R
Religio71
Guest
So I happened upon one of the numerous sede websites found on the interweb.
mostholyfamilymonastery.com/
Now, while I do think they are REALLY fanatical and nit pick over some really inconsequential issues, I am wondering how others see sedes. In particular, some of the quotes of the writings and speeches of various Popes and bishops are a little…disturbing. I’ve found at least one that definitely was taken out of context. However upon research of others from the same book (Pope Benedict XVI’s Intro to Catholic Theology), some had the same meaning in context.
I searched catholic.com for any articles, and came up with this:
catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0103fea1.asp
It really has some disturbing comments on the sede movement and how you can be a heretic or apostate and still be a Pope. Illicit, but still a valid Pope:
**
2. A pope who began his pontificate as an orthodox Catholic but became a formal heretic or apostate during his pontificate would thereby legally incur excommunication. However, even if his heresy or apostasy should become publicly discernible, the absence of any competent authority on earth who could lawfully declare his excommunication would mean that, if he refused to resign and continued to insist on carrying out acts of papal authority, those acts, though illicitly exercised, would still be valid. In other words, he would still be juridically the true pope whom we would have to recognize and obey in all things but sin, even though at the inner level at which grace operates he might well be totally separated from the mystical body of Christ.**
**Now, if a heretic, apostate, or Freemason can be validly elected pope, then obviously he can validly remain acting as pope until he dies. The cardinals he appoints will be true cardinals, the bishops he appoints will have true jurisdiction, the saints he canonizes will be truly guaranteed to be in heaven, and the legislation by which he binds us will have to be obeyed (insofar as it does not command us to sin or do something manifestly opposed to the common good of the Church). Thus, the continuity of the universal Church will be preserved until in God’s providence a worthier pontiff is elected.
**
**
"Canon 2263 states that an excommunicated person, as we would expect, “is forbidden to exercise ecclesiastical offices or duties”—the first among which is, of course, the papacy. However, the next canon (2264) affirms the following: “An act of jurisdiction carried out by an excommunicated person, whether in the internal or the external forum, is illicit; and if a condemnatory or declaratory sentence has been pronounced, it is also invalid, without prejudice to canon 2261 §3; otherwise it is valid.” (The other canon cited here, 2261 §3, makes an exception to this invalidity when it is a case of an officially excommunicated priest giving absolution to someone in danger of death.)
These last four words—“otherwise it is valid”—are highly significant. Let us assume that this pope, the validity of whose election no one disputes, refused to admit he had fallen into heresy. Since no other earthly person or authority—not even all the rest of the bishops gathered in an ecumenical council—would be competent to pass a condemnatory sentence against this pope or to declare that he has incurred excommunication, it follows from the Church’s law that, if he refuses to resign, all his acts of jurisdiction would remain valid, even though they would be illicit. So while this pope would offend God gravely by exercising his office while under an (undeclared) excommunication, all his official acts still would be juridically valid and binding on the Church’s members.
"**
This is all really…interesting
, so I’m wondering what others think about it.
mostholyfamilymonastery.com/
Now, while I do think they are REALLY fanatical and nit pick over some really inconsequential issues, I am wondering how others see sedes. In particular, some of the quotes of the writings and speeches of various Popes and bishops are a little…disturbing. I’ve found at least one that definitely was taken out of context. However upon research of others from the same book (Pope Benedict XVI’s Intro to Catholic Theology), some had the same meaning in context.
I searched catholic.com for any articles, and came up with this:
catholic.com/thisrock/2001/0103fea1.asp
It really has some disturbing comments on the sede movement and how you can be a heretic or apostate and still be a Pope. Illicit, but still a valid Pope:
**
2. A pope who began his pontificate as an orthodox Catholic but became a formal heretic or apostate during his pontificate would thereby legally incur excommunication. However, even if his heresy or apostasy should become publicly discernible, the absence of any competent authority on earth who could lawfully declare his excommunication would mean that, if he refused to resign and continued to insist on carrying out acts of papal authority, those acts, though illicitly exercised, would still be valid. In other words, he would still be juridically the true pope whom we would have to recognize and obey in all things but sin, even though at the inner level at which grace operates he might well be totally separated from the mystical body of Christ.**
**Now, if a heretic, apostate, or Freemason can be validly elected pope, then obviously he can validly remain acting as pope until he dies. The cardinals he appoints will be true cardinals, the bishops he appoints will have true jurisdiction, the saints he canonizes will be truly guaranteed to be in heaven, and the legislation by which he binds us will have to be obeyed (insofar as it does not command us to sin or do something manifestly opposed to the common good of the Church). Thus, the continuity of the universal Church will be preserved until in God’s providence a worthier pontiff is elected.
**
**
"Canon 2263 states that an excommunicated person, as we would expect, “is forbidden to exercise ecclesiastical offices or duties”—the first among which is, of course, the papacy. However, the next canon (2264) affirms the following: “An act of jurisdiction carried out by an excommunicated person, whether in the internal or the external forum, is illicit; and if a condemnatory or declaratory sentence has been pronounced, it is also invalid, without prejudice to canon 2261 §3; otherwise it is valid.” (The other canon cited here, 2261 §3, makes an exception to this invalidity when it is a case of an officially excommunicated priest giving absolution to someone in danger of death.)
These last four words—“otherwise it is valid”—are highly significant. Let us assume that this pope, the validity of whose election no one disputes, refused to admit he had fallen into heresy. Since no other earthly person or authority—not even all the rest of the bishops gathered in an ecumenical council—would be competent to pass a condemnatory sentence against this pope or to declare that he has incurred excommunication, it follows from the Church’s law that, if he refuses to resign, all his acts of jurisdiction would remain valid, even though they would be illicit. So while this pope would offend God gravely by exercising his office while under an (undeclared) excommunication, all his official acts still would be juridically valid and binding on the Church’s members.
"**
This is all really…interesting
, so I’m wondering what others think about it.
