Seeking Guidance: Exorcism and Blessing of Family House

[umamibella]

I think what I should have explicitly said was “The average Priest isn’t of the quality that he should be these days.” I didn’t realise what I said was so vulnerable to misinterpretation. I was making a generalisation, not an absolute statement. Apologies.

That does not make what you said any better. Your intention is quite clear.
Still an inane and ridiculous comment.
Uncharitable and disrespectful.

I believe it was Pope Pius X who first battled with the Modernists. He himself stated that he had merely driven them underground and that they would most assuredly resurface. Indeed, just as he predicted, Modernism has entered the Church. You now have Priests like Fr. James Martin openly receiving an award from a putatively (according to they, themselves) Catholic organisation that supports sodomy. You have clergy like Bishop Barron who argue, publicly, that there is a “reasonable hope” that all men are saved. I think blindly trusting in the clergy will lead to one being led to Hell.
As I stated, there are good ones out there but I think a bit of wariness is justified in this day and age.

Bishop Barron has done so much for educating Catholics and non Catholics globally, You would do well to watch his series on Catholicism.

There is absolutely no valid Cathiolic organisation that supports any kind of sex outside marriage. If you believe you know differently, then prove it.

Modernism has nothing to do with your continued calumny of the clergy. What you are doing is proving the Beatitide Blessed ae those who have all sorts of calumny and falsehoods…

I also seriously doubt you have any experience with pre Vatican II priesthood, which is invalidating your arguments even further.

 

[umamibella]

Unfortunately, these concerns of hers have driven her into engaging in Charismatic Catholic worship and I fear that this will eventually culminate in her speaking in tongues

Speaking in tongues and the Charismatic movement are part of the church. If this is where your mother finds her faith then that is fine by the Pope, in whom all Catholics owe obedience and submission.

This has absolutely nothing to do with exorcism.

 

[umamibella]

Firstly, due to a lack of information on my part, I would not be able to dismiss the possibility that there is something systematically wrong with the performance of the particular Priest I requested and every Priest that comes to the house due to the seminaries themselves being of poor quality. If I’m informed, I would know what quality looks like and that’s a very reassuring piece of knowledge to have.

Ok, I have had a gutful of your absolute (insert Australian word for bucket ful of### here)

of the clergy and I have no idea what is going on with you , but its flagging time.

We Catholics have to defend our diminishing in numbers clergy from this kind of all sorts of wrong.

 

[PenguinBeak]

Don’t expect any thing to change if nothing changes.

In that case then I wish to reiterate that I believe there will be one change: as my mother will not be bringing to the house people she no longer views as friends, they will not be able to reapply whatever curses they may have originally applied to the house.
Fr. Ripperger talks about how dangerous pornography is due to the fact that the producers of pornography actually apply a curse onto the master copy of a pornographic video. Then, when they mass-replicate that copy, the curse is transferred to all of those copies. Fr. Ripperger speaks of a man that became demonically obsessed with a particular pornstar through pornography.
Now, if Fr. Ripperger knows of men who became possessed through pornography then I think it’s safe to assume that these men chose to seek out pornography because they were indifferent to the notion that pornography was sinful i.e. they were already leading sinful lives.
If these men were already living out sinful lives, why is it that they only became subjected to demonic obsession when they viewed pornography?
Based off of this, it seems to be that there’s a distinction between leading an ordinarily sinful life and being cursed. Fr. Ripperger being adamant about the avoidance of pornography because it’s cursed, to me, suggests that you’re much more likely to have problems if you expose yourself to it than otherwise.
If we’re all leading sinful lives, that’s one thing, but being cursed seems to be a very different matter. Having those curses nullified through an exorcism could absolutely make a difference.

Do you understand Charismatic Catholicism and speaking in tongues?

It’s not something that happens from curses put on houses.

Allow me to clarify.
My mother is engaging in Charismatic Catholic worship because the Charismatic Catholic Priests offer things like “healing” and they offer “Healing Masses”. My mother is interested in this kind of Christianity and so she’s turned to these Priests, hoping that they will heal the whole house.
I’ll clarify that in the OP, thanks.

 

[FiveLinden]

So as I understand it to perform (is that the word?) a major exorcism, a person must be a priest specifically authorised by the local bishop to do so. (This is not the sort of information we atheists carry around in our heads - I looked it up in the Catechism).

There are rules in the CCC about the priests so authorised being particularly meritorious, so the concept of ‘quality priest’ does come into it.

There appears however, to be no ‘super-charged’ exorcism available. And as its a sacramental, not sacrament I would have assumed that the only thing Catholics believe ‘works’ as the OP would have it is whatever the Church sets out.

 

[MtnDwellar]

You are not understanding Father Ripperger. Demonic obsession is not a person being obsessed with something or someone ie. a porn star. Then you employ convoluted logic to justify your position that after a curse is broken, the demonic cannot return.

You asked for guidance, but you really seem to want to demonstrate your knowledge gained from listening to some YouTube lectures.

 

[NevermoreLenore]

According to my own research,

I think your ‘research’ needs to begin with the Holy Bible and the Catechism. You have latched on to a lot of conspiratorial-type beliefs and sound biblical knowledge and encyclopaedic awareness of the catechism is what will be most helpful to you.

What makes you think it is necessary to have an exorcism? They are not entered into lightly, are infrequent, and involve psychologists, physicians, additional priests, and often occur over weeks or months. There would be a process of discernment regarding whether an exorcism is necessary; it’s not like you’ll have one priest come over and just enter into demonic battle without significant and substantial evidence that it’s necessary.

Am I correct in assuming you are a minor? What does your mom think about you wanting an exorcist? I’m not clear on why you’ve concluded there is something wrong at the house. If anything is necessary, it really should come from her, the head of the household.

 

[MtnDwellar]

A priest can perform a private exorcism without special faculties or psychological tests.

 

[NevermoreLenore]

This is not true.

https://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/sacraments-and-sacramentals/sacramentals-blessings/exorcism

“It is advisable that every diocese establish a protocol to respond to inquiries made by the faithful who claim to be demonically afflicted. As part of the protocol, an assessment should occur to determine the true state of the person.Only after a thorough examination including medical, psychological, and psychiatric testing might the person be referred to the exorcist for a final determination regarding demonic possession. To be clear, the actual determination of whether a member of the faithful is genuinely possessed by the devil is made by the Church, even if individuals claim to be possessed through their own self-diagnosis or psychosis.”

“The frequency of exorcisms of this sort is determined by the credible need for the rite. That is why establishing a diocesan protocol is important. Through the centuries, the Church has moved cautiously when evaluating alleged cases of demonic possession. The reason for this is not to deny access to members of the faithful who are in genuine need. However, the Church is equally concerned that individuals not get caught up in a sensationalist mentality and thus create a kind of sideshow affair. Although rare, genuine cases of demonic possession should be addressed in a balanced manner with the utmost care being extended to the afflicted person.”

“the Rite of Major Exorcism is to be celebrated only by a bishop or a priest who has obtained the special and express permission of the diocesan bishop.”

 

[MtnDwellar]

The article is referring to major (also called solemn) public exorcisms which are used in cases of possession. For instances of oppression, obsession, or infestation a private exorcism may be used. Any priest can perform a private exorcism. The OP is not referring to a case of possession.

 

[TheLittleLady]

the fact that the producers of pornography actually apply a curse onto the master copy of a pornographic video. Then, when they mass-replicate that copy, the curse is transferred to all of those copies. Fr.

If this is a fact, please provide the proof. Demonstrate where the Magisterium teaches that DVD burners replicate curses.

If you are a minor, please, stop dabbling with this sort of unprovable opinion. Talk to your pastor.

 

[PenguinBeak]

There appears however, to be no ‘super-charged’ exorcism available. And as its a sacramental, not sacrament I would have assumed that the only thing Catholics believe ‘works’ as the OP would have it is whatever the Church sets out.

That more or less settles the thread’s purpose then. I’m not missing out on anything by simply requesting the exorcism. Thank you. It’s a shame I had to spread so much grief in the process but it is what it is.

You are not understanding Father Ripperger. Demonic obsession is not a person being obsessed with something or someone ie. a porn star. Then you employ convoluted logic to justify your position that after a curse is broken, the demonic cannot return.

I think you’re correct in that I don’t know what Demonic Obsession is. I vaguely recall Fr. Ripperger talking about his stance that Borderline Personality Disorder is in fact, simply a case of Diabolic Obsession and I think I believed that, in the case of BPD, the Obsession would lead the sufferer to always be thinking things like “are these people going to abandon me?” and things of that sort but this may have just been me.
I found the video where Fr. Ripperger talks about the pornography case I mentioned:

I tried to put the correct time in the YouTube link so when you start the video, it should take you directly to the correct time but if that didn’t work, let me just state that you need to go to 47:25 in the video.
Fr. Ripperger outright states that this was a case of Possession, it’s just that this case of Possession led to the sufferer becoming obsessed with a pornstar. I thought Possession was exclusively cases where the person’s body is being taken over. I didn’t think a Possession would lead to an obsession but I think Fr. Ripperger may have actually clarified that there are different levels to Possession in one of the videos so I may simply need to rewatch the entire set.

And no, I never said that the demonic can’t return, only that the demons that were present due to the curses will not return. My view is that there are demons that are present due to a sinful life and that there are demons that are solely present due to one (or one’s house) being a target of curses. If the house were to be exorcised, I believe it is those curse-demons (i.e. demons present solely due to a particular curse still being in effect) that will not return however, I accept that the sinful-life demons would return. Does my stance make sense? I don’t know why I didn’t do this sooner but what I’ve just written here is the essence of my stance on this matter:
If the house were to be exorcised, the sinful-life-demons would return whereas the curse-demons would go and could only return if the curses were re-applied, something which my mother won’t provide the opportunity for as the people she intends to cut ties with are the people she suspects to be responsible for the initial application of the curses.

 

[PenguinBeak]

What makes you think it is necessary to have an exorcism?

How else does one use the powers of a Priest to nullify curses placed upon one’s house?

What does your mom think about you wanting an exorcist?

My mother desires that any curses placed upon the house are nullified. I believe an exorcist is necessary then for the attainment of this goal.

If this is a fact, please provide the proof.

I don’t want to spam the thread with the same video twice so please check my previous post. If the video doesn’t automatically start at 47:25 when you click the video, please go there yourself. Fr. Ripperger is a respected Exorcist and so I trust his statements.

 

[MtnDwellar]

I understood your thinking. It’s not illogical to think that demons brought on by a curse cannot return once the curse is broken. I don’t think it’s true.

If one reads the prayers of exorcism, they are the same regardless of why the demons entered. There are exceptions when the demon is known, however, the formula still prescribes the same outcome for the demons.

Scripture tells us that the demons will return. Their behavior upon return depends upon what they find.

BTW - when Father Ripperger mentions that the guy was obsessed with a porn star, he’s using the secular definition of obsess.

 

[TheLittleLady]

The online priest you reference is giving his opinions, he is not teaching you magisterial teaching. Is he your pastor? If so, ask for a meeting where you can discuss the difference between opinion, rumor, and verifiable truth.

If he is not your pastor, speak to your pastor.

 

[PenguinBeak]

Scripture tells us that the demons will return. Their behavior upon return depends upon what they find.

I see. I think what you see makes sense. Generational Spirits are also a curse and I believe Fr. Ripperger states that in the case of a Generational Spirit, one has to be living a holy life otherwise, it will simply return.
Well, thanks.
I’d also like to thank you for your mentioning of the variance amongst Exorcists. You see, I realise that my reason for focusing so much on Fr. Ripperger is very much akin to that of the useful martial arts. A useful martial art is one that has been developed through full-contact sparring so this would mean looking towards Boxing, Muay Thai and Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu and it would also mean looking away from Aikido. Since Fr. Ripperger’s ability to effectively combat demons is dependent on his own holiness, I think his practises as well, have been validated through combat. If there’s a whole bunch of different Exorcists saying different things then I guess I’d like to get into studying these things. I vaguely recall Fr. Ripperger saying that Exorcists publish their findings in Latin. I think I’ll learn Latin and start reading their works and then see what’s out there. Thanks.

The online priest you reference is giving his opinions, he is not teaching you magisterial teaching.

Yes, you’re correct. It’s not magisterial like you requested so really, I shouldn’t have recommended the video but I think, through victory in combat against demons, what he teaches has been verified. Nonetheless, you are free to dismiss it as it is not magisterial.

 

[MtnDwellar]

Father Ripperger is a good resource for several reasons: He’s an excellent communicator. His publications and recordings are prolific. His experience is invaluable. His faith is strong and orthodox. He’s very smart. In conversation he spews out quotes and information just like in his lectures. He doesn’t need notes!

Most exorcists keep their identities hidden. They have good reasons. A few, like Father Ripperger, consider public education to be part of their ministry. Thank God for them.

One of the problems with understanding and teaching about the spiritual world is that it is so vast and complex. Exorcists and others catch a glimpse and then want to generalize about the entirety. Each speaks from his own experience, but that experience may not be universal.

I don’t want to go into how spells and curses are performed, but they are not always effective. Their effectiveness depends upon several things. One of them is the defenses of the target. We have guardian angels. If we establish relationships with him, other angels and saints, Jesus, and His Mother, our defense is stronger. God placed a hedge of protection around Job which kept Satan away.

Nothing happens unless God permits it. His reason for permitting evil is always to bring some good… If God allowed a curse against you, He is trying to lead you toward holiness.

 

[PenguinBeak]

I see. Well, I’ll go through with the exorcism but I intend to warn my mother and sister about how their sinful behaviour may bring about something worse if they don’t actively try to change it.
Thanks.

This thread can RIP now.