Seeking input on controversial topic of women being ordained

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Right up front let me say I am NOT in favor of women being ordained. I am a very conservative Catholic who obeys the Magisterium.

That said, I need some concise arguments against the ordination of women. I am writing a paper due in a month. I would appreciate being pointed to some articles, books, or other resources which I could read about this topic.

Thank you.
 
I don’t know what kind of paper you are writing, but I think you should first stop calling it a “controversial issue”. It is not “controversial” and it’s not an “issue”. It’s a doctrine.

For your paper, JPII’s Apostolic Letter Ordinatio Sacerdotalis.

I would also suggest going to the EWTN document library and searching on the key word ordination where you will find numerous documents including some commentaries on the Apostolic Letter including one by then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger.
 
Writing a paper on this topic is almost an exercise in futility. Ordination of women is something that is simply not going to happen. Ever. You can of course find numerous articles about the reasons for this, but proposing arguments pro or con is like arguing about the phlogiston theory of combustion.
 
Makerteacher said:
Right up front let me say I am NOT in favor of women being ordained. I am a very conservative Catholic who obeys the Magisterium.

That said, I need some concise arguments against the ordination of women. I am writing a paper due in a month. I would appreciate being pointed to some articles, books, or other resources which I could read about this topic.

Thank you.
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In a nutshell, Jesus chose only men as His apostles. He had plenty of women disciples, but he ordained none of them, not even His sinless Mother.

The Church has an unbroken tradition of honoring this precedent. Since Jesus chose only men as Priests, the Church has no power to reverse this decision.

God Bless
 
I agree that it is a doctrine, already decided, and that conversing about it is meaningless etc etc, but I have to do the paper, so I am going to do it on the con side and I want to do a good job. My goal is to make some of the folk in this class I am taking rethink things.

Thanks for the suggestions on articles and places to go for doctrinal support, please feel free to add more.
 
Although all these posts are correct, I think your paper will be more interesting and have more substance for those taking the “pro” side if you anticipate some of the “pro” arguments and refute them in your paper.

Some examples:
  1. “There were deconesses.”
    Yes, but they were not ordained. Their role was to baptize women (by full immersion).
  2. “It’s a matter of equal rights.”
    Ordination is not a right, and, as has been stated, only men were present at the Last Supper and sent to baptize all nations. Not Mary, the Mother of God. Not Mary Magdalene. Not Mary and Martha. All these women were very close to the Lord.
  3. “Yes, but that was because of the patriarchal society they lived in and the social norms of the day.”
    Nope. Jesus ate with all manner of public sinners despite the scandal, forbade the stoning of the adulteress although her execution followed Mosaic law and spoke in public to a woman unknown to him - and a Samaritan at that who had lived with a string of men. Jesus could have bucked one more Jewish tradition of having a male priesthood if He had cared to.
Good luck,

Gem
 
I’m still waiting for a good argument in favor of male pregnancy.😃
 
Makerteacher said:
That said, I need some concise arguments against the ordination of women. I am writing a paper due in a month. I would appreciate being pointed to some articles, books, or other resources which I could read about this topic.

Thank you.
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I would invite you to look at the whole area of the ‘Existential Priesthood’ which confers upon each of the Baptised a right to share in the Priesthood of Christ.

In fact by the very nature of or Baptism we are already, Priest, Prophet and King with Christ and rightly exercise a Priestly service in that we offer our own personal sacrifices to God each and every day in union with the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

I could guess that many of those women who demand access to the Ministerial Priesthood don’t even practice the existential priesthood in their daily lives.

If this is the case then it boils down to nothing but rights and that is a recipe for disaster. This is the reason why those ‘ordained’ with no mandate don’t last.
 
Spirithound said:
It shows the “equal” does not necessarily mean “same”.
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True, in reproduction, which is a biological matter, only a man can get a woman pregnant; he contributes sperm to the union. Only a woman can be gotten pregnant by a man; she contributes ova to the union. Both share equally in the responsibility of creating life, and the end result is that they are both responsible for the child’s well-being; they both share the ministry of parenthood. They do not have identical functions, but they exercise necessary and equal functions at the same level. This is how genetics work. This is scientifically verifiable and observable.

But here we’re talking about a purely sacramental matter. Currently “equal” men and women are not permitted to receive an equal number of sacramental graces. (7 vs. 6) And because of this, women are excluded from exercising necessary and equal functions at the same level as men in the Church. This should scream injustice to all Christians. Even if you don’t care if women received Holy Orders, you should be angry that the Church loses out on the gifts and ministry of countless women who are barred from serving (with an equal, but not “same” sacramental character) those necessary functions at the same level as men in the Church.

To the OP: Please don’t use the following argument. I’m not a logician, but a developed common sense tells me that it is fallacious:

“God designed the world such that only women can get pregnant. So ‘Duh!’, only men are allowed to be priests. QED”

Which makes about as much sense as:

"God designed the world such that motor oil reduces friction in automobile engines. So “Duh!’, you are only allowed to drive on the right side of the road.”

Our friends in Ireland, Australia, NZ, UK, and elsewhere will laugh at this, because they know that driving on the left-hand side of the road works perfectly well, it is an arbitrary system that evolved as the popularity of driving cars rose and the popularity of riding horseback waned, and has nothing to do with the natural laws of physics (or biology).
 
This would be an interesting debate if the case wasn’t closed. I’m no expert on this issue, but the most trustworthy people I know (such as Peter Kreeft, who I’ve spoken to personally on this issue) emphatically tell me that the case is closed or that the Church is one minute step away from an infallible declaration; so essentially, the widespread debate is pretty meaningless.

But I agree with Chemical Bean that we should be furious but only if the idea of an exclusively male priesthood came from human beings and not God. But that’s the real issue here - the authority of Church and God. So the argument from inequality, in and of itself, is nothing more than a red herring argument.

We can get as angry as we want about equality and the like but until we hash out the issue of authority and doctrine we’re doing nothing but wasting our breath. If it’s God’s will that there be an all male priesthood we know a priori that it isn’t unjust and discriminatory - that somehow its goal isn’t equality but harmony.

I’ll let the better theologians than myself talk about doctrine and authority, but as I said, whining about inequality is worthless if we whine against God’s will.
 
We call priests ‘father’ because Holy Orders confers the charism of spiritual fatherhood, not spiritual motherhood. Sacramental grace builds on nature. All males are potential fathers; all females are potential mothers.

Not only that, the priest acts ‘in the person’ of Christ, lending his body and his total personhood to mediate Christ sacramentally to others. Since Christ is male, it is fitting that those acting “in persona Christi” are also male.

To me, it makes sense that a woman cannot be a father, any more than a man can be a mother. But no matter the arguments either way, the matter has already been decided.
 
I think we would be able to ordain women as priests, if it were also possible to make a convincing and serious stage play or movie about the life of Christ, using a female actress in the role of Christ.

Such things have been done as comedy, of course, but even as comedy, it is not particularly effective.

The priesthood is not centrally about writing or preaching good homilies, nor is it about being a good business manager in the office, or even being able to say Mass well, or being a good liturgist or theologian - it is about being in persona Christi relative to the Sacraments. The closest thing we have to the image of Christ, which is what is needed in order for the function of being in persona Christi to be effective is the male human being. Like it or not, it’s all about appearances, here.

Non-sacramental roles are open to women - there are lots of these. Women are in no way “left out” of the Church. Women have essential roles of their own. (What parish could function for long without the motherly presence of the office administrator, overseeing the office staff and ensuring that no paperwork ever goes astray, but is all properly filed and easy for the priest to access at the moment that he needs it?)
 
**To the people that push for a woman ministerial priesthood. Might I make a suggestion?

If you don’t like Catholic doctrine than make your own church like all the other heretics…

oh I mean ‘lost brethren’

maybe using the word “brethren” isn’t fair?

lost people?**
 
One of the best resources for your paper would be Monica Miller’s doctoral dissertation called something like Sexual Authority in the Catholic Church. It is very relevant to your topic and discusses male priesthood at length. It may be obtained through that dissertation duplication service that CUA uses… I can’t remember all the stuff in it because I borrowed a copy of the book from Donna Steichen, but it is really, really good.
 
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