Segregated Parishes

[Brian_C]

Growing up in the South, it’s an ugly fact. I know that no one in the Church itself imposes it, but why aren’t more efforts made to bring us together. I realize that Hispanic parishes have special needs, but I never understood how you can have a “white” Catholic parish and then a “black” one just down the street. That’s the way it was in my hometown.

Now, I was raised Baptist and beneath the surface the attitude was “let them go to their church. They don’t do things like we do.” But the Catholic Church is much more colorblind and the liturgy does not change with regard to the color of the congregation. I realize that each parish has its own sense of community and that African-American Catholics in many cases are just fine with their own church. I also realize some are the result of immigrant populations from Africa or the Carribean being close-knit. A parish church serves the neighborhood where it’s located. But it’s just disheartening to see we still aren’t “together” in many ways.

Is this a predominately Southern issue or is it like this everywhere? Or is it just that there aren’t that many African-American Catholics?

 

[Ghosty]

Is this a predominately Southern issue or is it like this everywhere? Or is it just that there aren’t that many African-American Catholics?

Little of column A, little of column B, I think. Where I live the parishes are rather integrated, though we have a much higher Asian population that is Catholic, so that makes our composite “tone” a bit different I suppose

It also depends on WHERE in the South you go. New Orleans is gonna be a lot different in this regard than, say, Charlettesville. I have black relatives from N’awlins (though they’re technically Creole, I suppose), and they’re as Catholic as they come.

Outside of these minor observations I’m afraid I don’t have a lot of information on the matter. I wouldn’t be suprised if the tendency was stronger in the South though, given the history. One thing that can’t be said, however, is that there are few African-blooded Catholics in general (not to be confused with African-American Catholics in particular); from what I understand there’s upwards of 250 million of them, give or take

Peace and God bless!

 

[Ted_CharlotteNC]

It is not a Catholic phenomina. Actually I think Catholics I have met are more tolerant than the Baptists I have met.

Having grown up in Mableton/Austell GA (about 20 miles from Atlanta) in the 60s and 70s and attended the largest Southern Baptist in my town, I think it has a lot to do with distance and race too.

A black family would have driven past 3 “white” churches just so they could feel more at home with a black church.

I dont remember doing to church with any blacks.

I hope that helps the discussion.

 

[1ke]

Brian_C:

Growing up in the South, it’s an ugly fact. I know that no one in the Church itself imposes it, but why aren’t more efforts made to bring us together. I realize that Hispanic parishes have special needs, but I never understood how you can have a “white” Catholic parish and then a “black” one just down the street. That’s the way it was in my hometown.

I think you are over generalizing. In Houston there are a couple of parishes that would be called “African-American” parishes-- where they are almost exclusively black, have a traditional gospel choir, etc. That’s out of over 150 parishes-- and clearly not all black Catholics go to just these two parishes. There are parishes just for Vietnamese, Polish, and other ethnicities. I don’t think that having a parish that’s predominantly black speaks to discrimination, but more towards human nature of desiring to have a place that is special and preserves heritage and culture. My mom goes to a parish that is almost all Hispanic… why? Because that is their parish and they’ve gone there 30 years, and the neighborhood has become predominantly Hispanic in that time. It’s not segregation, it’s demographics.

In my home parish in Houston there are all ethnicities (and I mean all… we have quite a mixed congregation) mixed together in the English masses, plus two Spanish masses for the non-English speakers. Some English speaking Hispanics go to the Spanish mass because they prefer it, not because they feel unwelcome at the English masses.

Brian_C:

Now, I was raised Baptist and beneath the surface the attitude was “let them go to their church. They don’t do things like we do.”

I have never experienced that in the Catholic Church.

Brian_C:

But it’s just disheartening to see we still aren’t “together” in many ways.

I think that we are together, and that the universality of the Church is very evident.

Brian_C:

Is this a predominately Southern issue or is it like this everywhere? Or is it just that there aren’t that many African-American Catholics?

Well, where I live now there literally are no blacks at all in the community (practically in the whole state). There are Hispanics but I don’t know where they go to Mass b/c they don’t go to our parish.

I also disagree that it is “segregation”, it’s no different than an elementary school reflecting the ethnicity of the surrounding neighborhood.

 

[geezerbob]

I grew up in Columbia, SC, when everything was segregated. There was a mission church in a black area of town. That mission church has done quite well and is now a full-fledged parish, complete with day care and elementary school. While the doors of all our churches are open to everybody, the members of St. Martin’s have a lot of time, money and sweat invested in “their” church and have a real sense of community there. I doubt if anything short of the bishop closing it would make them even think about joining another parish, even though they are perfectly free to do so. Am I missing something or is there nothing wrong with that?

 

[T.A.Stobie_SFO]

Most of the segregation occurs by neighborhood and as people thend to attend the nearest parish, it can be reflected in the parishes.

 

[Brian_C]

Nah, I’m not trying to generalize, just relate my experiences. I’m not trying to accuse anyone here of being racist. But it is segregation, whether it’s forced or voluntary. As I said, I realize Hispanics are more inclined to be like this b/c of language issues. I also realize that yes, there is a sense of community, yes. But, I have also gotten the vibe that though they would not be turned away, a sudden influx of African-American parishoners would not be entirely welcomed. Let’s say, not actively courted.

Like I said before, I realize that the Catholic Church is by far the most tolerant and open. We were begged to go downtown and attend the special service for MLK back in January to show solidarity. That’s something I’ve never been asked in any church I’ve attended and it made me happy. In either of the Baptist churches I attended (both the largest in their respective cities) that would have just not been mentioned.

 

[Cathy_of_Alex]

We have a historically African-American parish in St. Paul called St. Peter Claver. It was formed in a now vanished predominantly Black neighborhood called Rondo. Rondo was essentially destroyed in the 60’s when I-94 was cut right thru the neighborhood but the parish survived (though it is RIGHT next to the freeway).

St. Peter’s is still a predominantly African American parish and the neighborhood around it still is predominently African American too.

The Twin Cities was very segregated in it’s history (in many ways it still is). The Rondo neighborhood by it’s very nature was segregated. There are many interesting stories/theories about the I-94 corridor being deliberately cut thru the area to destroy it because it was a Black neighborhood.

I have personally only observed a few African-American parishioners at my parish in St. Paul (St. Andrews) but there are few African-Americans in my neighborhood.

Our Archbishop, Harry Flynn, wrote a Pastoral Letter (In God’s Image) on racism. You can find it here: archspm.org/html/pastoral.html

Archbishop Flynn takes a lot of flak for not being firm enough on dissentors but the Pastoral Letter, in my mind, was one of the many good things he’s done for this Archdiocese.

 

[JOHNYJ]

This is a very complicated question.There is a diference between a church that is segragated on purpose and one that is by location.
Also many things enter into this. As a child I lived in an Italian/Irish neighborhood so the parish was white. In the Rectory there were pictures of many Saints,Italian and Irish of course but also you’d see Saint Rose of Lima, Saint Martin De Pores, and others. It is now a black neighborhood ,I visited the Rectory .All the saints were black and the corpus on the crucifix was black. The idea of this is to give black people self respect.It s a stupid idea ! It is anther part of the perfidious thinking called political correctness. It continues the theory that blacks are victims.