Seton Hall University OK's "Brokeback Mountain" showing

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Are you serious? 95% of the time, you go to your library and ask to order something Catholic related and if they can afford it they will order it. It’s a lot easier for gay and lesbian materials requests to get “lost in the shuffle”.
Don’t you think one’s location would make a big difference here? I mean, San Francisco’s public libraries probably aren’t going to lose homosexual materials requests, but a small town library somewhere else in the country might. I dunno ‘bout getting Catholic stuff “95% of the time”, tho’…😉
 
Are you serious? 95% of the time, you go to your library and ask to order something Catholic related and if they can afford it they will order it. It’s a lot easier for gay and lesbian materials requests to get “lost in the shuffle”.
Not at my library. “New Books” is well supplied with homosexual material. Their newest prize is a autobio by first gay player in the NFL. Library doesn’t put in on the shelf but highlights it on the top of the case. There it sits for weeks and weeks. So do others. Then there is the usual run of the mill New Age material, feminist tracts, Howard Zinn type history and books on the Holocaust–including those which attempt to blame Catholics for Nazism. Try finding anything truthful on the Soviet Union and American communism in my library. It has one volume from Yale’s Annals of Communism series. Usdin, Radosh,Yakovlev, Klehr, Rayfield, Haynes and others who have written on revelations since the fall of the Berlin Wall are no where to be seen. We get revisionist history such as put out by Zinn, Foner, Duke, Fitzpatrick, Thurston and Reiber–the same material the left was putting out at the height of the cold war.

There are two bios out on Elizabeth Bentley–the first ever. She lived in this area. I know people who knew her. One would think one of the small towns here would have one of those books. After all, her former comrades hounded her to death and now we know for a flat out fact they, not she, were making things up.

I did check Catholic books. Less than five which are neutral or positive. More than I cared to count from “progressives” seeking to change the church or hit pieces by “investigative” journalists.

Yes, I can get any book I want. And I do. I have interlibrary loans out constantly. A pity, isn’t it? Ten years ago my town wasn’t like this. But it was only a matter of time I suppose before the American Library Association influence took over (read their history, its chilling).
 
Not at my library. “New Books” is well supplied with homosexual material. Their newest prize is a autobio by first gay player in the NFL. Library doesn’t put in on the shelf but highlights it on the top of the case. There it sits for weeks and weeks. So do others. Then there is the usual run of the mill New Age material, feminist tracts, Howard Zinn type history and books on the Holocaust–including those which attempt to blame Catholics for Nazism. Try finding anything truthful on the Soviet Union and American communism in my library. It has one volume from Yale’s Annals of Communism series. Usdin, Radosh,Yakovlev, Klehr, Rayfield, Haynes and others who have written on revelations since the fall of the Berlin Wall are no where to be seen. We get revisionist history such as put out by Zinn, Foner, Duke, Fitzpatrick, Thurston and Reiber–the same material the left was putting out at the height of the cold war.

There are two bios out on Elizabeth Bentley–the first ever. She lived in this area. I know people who knew her. One would think one of the small towns here would have one of those books. After all, her former comrades hounded her to death and now we know for a flat out fact they, not she, were making things up.

I did check Catholic books. Less than five which are neutral or positive. More than I cared to count from “progressives” seeking to change the church or hit pieces by “investigative” journalists.

Yes, I can get any book I want. And I do. I have interlibrary loans out constantly. A pity, isn’t it? Ten years ago my town wasn’t like this. But it was only a matter of time I suppose before the American Library Association influence took over (read their history, its chilling).
If you don’t like the selection in your town, don’t blame the Library Association. Someone selects and orders the books. It’s not the ALA. Those who have enough interest and energy become involved in the process. It sounds like some have done just that. And some haven’t.
 
**On Monday, Nov. 20, Hollywood movie “Brokeback Mountain” is scheduled to stage at Seton Hall University, a Catholic institution **founded in 1865. The film is currently listed on the university’s web site under “Multicultural Program Film & Lecture Series.” TFP Student Action is calling for a peaceful protest because the film:

Approves same-sex relations, adultery, nudity, profanity and drug use. It is a blow to Catholic education, America’s Christian roots, the institution of the family and very foundations of morality and society.

“Brokeback Mountain” is the antithesis of authentic Catholic education. It scrambles human emotions and encourages students to tolerate sin. The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops classified this pro-homosexual film as “morally offensive” – the lowest possible rating.

Protest now. Your signature will make an impact. GO TO: tfp.org/student_action/activities/protests/seton_hall_brokeback_mountain.htm

Every movie is produced with a message and objective. It seems that the objective of “Brokeback Mountain” is to mock manhood and promote unnatural vice. Newsweek stated the movie “has the potential to change the national conversation and to challenge people’s ideas about the value and validity of same-sex relationships.”

Join the protest

Please sign your instant e-protest to the president of Seton Hall University, Msgr. Robert Sheeran. Urge him to cancel the film. TFP Student Action is alerting its affiliate members on 716 college campuses to join the campaign. If you would ask your friends too, the impact of this effort will be much greater. Defend moral values in Catholic education!

Make a polite phone call. After you sign your respectful e-protest, give Msgr. Sheeran’s office a call. Be polite and firm. Ask him to have the movie cancelled.

Call today: (973) 761-9691

Monsignor Robert Sheeran, S.T.D.
President, Seton Hall University
E-mail: president@shu.edu
So…

Have you watched the movie?
 
I find the catholic attitude in matters such as these humorous. It’s like they just want to stick in their head in the sand and pretend differing viewpoints don’t exist. Are they afraid they might see some reason or, in this particular case, beauty in it? Are you afraid that your mind might be changed? Are you just afraid of homosexuality?

I don’t get it.

If your beliefs are so well-grounded in the real truth, then how would seeing this movie be any different from a movie that portrayed a heterosexual couple having premarital or contraceptive sex? I really don’t understand the vehemently anti-gay prejudice that so many of you harbor in your words.

I’ve seen Brokeback Mountain - it’s not glorifying the gay lifestyle at all. In my opinion, it’s just about as far from any kind of propoganda as you can get. If you’ve seen the movie, you’d understand. And if you have: Could not such a situation be real? Is it not possible? If it is a plausible situation, then why would watching it be a bad thing? It doesn’t show anything explicit. I thought the scenes in the new James Bond were way more explicit than this, and I don’t hear any cries for people to not go see it. (And the USCCB gave Casino Royale an A-III rating, even with a much more explicit extra-marital aldulterous sexual encounter. Double standard? Oh yes.)

It’s a challenging movie. It’s a brave one. It’s a sad one. But it’s definatey not propoganda. Even the USCCB review that is mentioned says that: “Use of the film as an advocacy vehicle to promote a morally objectionable message that homosexuality is equivalent to and as acceptable as heterosexuality does a disservice to its genuine complexity. While the actions taken by Ennis and Jack cannot be endorsed, the universal themes of love and loss ring true. The film creates characters of flesh and blood - not just the protagonists, but the wives, girlfriends, parents, and children – who give the film its artful substance.” -USCCB Movie review:

usccb.org/movies/b/brokebackmountain.shtml
 
I find the catholic attitude in matters such as these humorous. It’s like they just want to stick in their head in the sand and pretend differing viewpoints don’t exist. Are** they** afraid they might see some reason or, in this particular case, beauty in it? Are you afraid that your mind might be changed? Are **you **just afraid of homosexuality?

I don’t get it.

If **your **beliefs are so well-grounded in the real truth, then how would seeing this movie be any different from a movie that portrayed a heterosexual couple having premarital or contraceptive sex? I really don’t understand the vehemently anti-gay prejudice that so many of you harbor in your words.

I’ve seen Brokeback Mountain - it’s not glorifying the gay lifestyle at all. In my opinion, it’s just about as far from any kind of propoganda as you can get. If you’ve seen the movie, you’d understand. And if you have: Could not such a situation be real? Is it not possible? If it is a plausible situation, then why would watching it be a bad thing? It doesn’t show anything explicit. I thought the scenes in the new James Bond were way more explicit than this, and I don’t hear any cries for people to not go see it. (And the USCCB gave Casino Royale an A-III rating, even with a much more explicit extra-marital aldulterous sexual encounter. Double standard? Oh yes.)

It’s a challenging movie. It’s a brave one. It’s a sad one. But it’s definatey not propoganda. Even the USCCB review that is mentioned says that: “Use of the film as an advocacy vehicle to promote a morally objectionable message that homosexuality is equivalent to and as acceptable as heterosexuality does a disservice to its genuine complexity. While the actions taken by Ennis and Jack cannot be endorsed, the universal themes of love and loss ring true. The film creates characters of flesh and blood - not just the protagonists, but the wives, girlfriends, parents, and children – who give the film its artful substance.” -USCCB Movie review:

usccb.org/movies/b/brokebackmountain.shtml
Spoken like a true 17-20 year old. I probably would have agreed with you when I was your age.
Are “the catholic attitute” “they” and “you” referring to this thread?
Could you please quote the “vehemently anti-gay prejudice” that is in use in this thread?
Otherwise, having read some of your other posts, I think you might be making some pretty inaccurate generalizations out of frustration from previous thread conversations. Maybe?
This isn’t a thread about homosexuality.
This is a thread about the the decision-making of a Catholic institution being called into question.
 
Spoken like a true 17-20 year old. I probably would have agreed with you when I was your age.
Are “the catholic attitute” “they” and “you” referring to this thread?
Could you please quote the “vehemently anti-gay prejudice” that is in use in this thread?
Otherwise, having read some of your other posts, I think you might be making some pretty inaccurate generalizations out of frustration from previous thread conversations. Maybe?
This isn’t a thread about homosexuality.
This is a thread about the the decision-making of a Catholic institution being called into question.
Spoken like a true senior.

Address the issues and then make a real post.
 
I find the catholic attitude in matters such as these humorous. It’s like they just want to stick in their head in the sand and pretend differing viewpoints don’t exist. Are they afraid they might see some reason or, in this particular case, beauty in it? Are you afraid that your mind might be changed? Are you just afraid of homosexuality?

I don’t get it.

If your beliefs are so well-grounded in the real truth, then how would seeing this movie be any different from a movie that portrayed a heterosexual couple having premarital or contraceptive sex? I really don’t understand the vehemently anti-gay prejudice that so many of you harbor in your words.

I’ve seen Brokeback Mountain - it’s not glorifying the gay lifestyle at all. In my opinion, it’s just about as far from any kind of propoganda as you can get. If you’ve seen the movie, you’d understand. And if you have: Could not such a situation be real? Is it not possible? If it is a plausible situation, then why would watching it be a bad thing? It doesn’t show anything explicit. I thought the scenes in the new James Bond were way more explicit than this, and I don’t hear any cries for people to not go see it. (And the USCCB gave Casino Royale an A-III rating, even with a much more explicit extra-marital aldulterous sexual encounter. Double standard? Oh yes.)

It’s a challenging movie. It’s a brave one. It’s a sad one. But it’s definatey not propoganda. Even the USCCB review that is mentioned says that: “Use of the film as an advocacy vehicle to promote a morally objectionable message that homosexuality is equivalent to and as acceptable as heterosexuality does a disservice to its genuine complexity. While the actions taken by Ennis and Jack cannot be endorsed, the universal themes of love and loss ring true. The film creates characters of flesh and blood - not just the protagonists, but the wives, girlfriends, parents, and children – who give the film its artful substance.” -USCCB Movie review:

usccb.org/movies/b/brokebackmountain.shtml
That’s not really the Catholic attitude. It’s the attitude of a relatively small group of Catholics. Oher Catholics are perfectly willing to entertain various views. A simple example is Seton Hall, which is a Catholic University. This discussion itself shows the vast divisions that exist within the Catholic population; we see Catholics publicly attacking other Catholics. From a sociologic perspective, there no longer exists a Catholic view on social issues. This means there is no dominant view among the Catholic population.
 
I find the catholic attitude in matters such as these humorous. It’s like they just want to stick in their head in the sand and pretend differing viewpoints don’t exist. Are they afraid they might see some reason or, in this particular case, beauty in it? Are you afraid that your mind might be changed? Are you just afraid of homosexuality?

I don’t get it.

If your beliefs are so well-grounded in the real truth, then how would seeing this movie be any different from a movie that portrayed a heterosexual couple having premarital or contraceptive sex? I really don’t understand the vehemently anti-gay prejudice that so many of you harbor in your words.

I’ve seen Brokeback Mountain - it’s not glorifying the gay lifestyle at all. In my opinion, it’s just about as far from any kind of propoganda as you can get. If you’ve seen the movie, you’d understand. And if you have: Could not such a situation be real? Is it not possible? If it is a plausible situation, then why would watching it be a bad thing? It doesn’t show anything explicit. I thought the scenes in the new James Bond were way more explicit than this, and I don’t hear any cries for people to not go see it. (And the USCCB gave Casino Royale an A-III rating, even with a much more explicit extra-marital aldulterous sexual encounter. Double standard? Oh yes.)

It’s a challenging movie. It’s a brave one. It’s a sad one. But it’s definatey not propoganda. Even the USCCB review that is mentioned says that: “Use of the film as an advocacy vehicle to promote a morally objectionable message that homosexuality is equivalent to and as acceptable as heterosexuality does a disservice to its genuine complexity. While the actions taken by Ennis and Jack cannot be endorsed, the universal themes of love and loss ring true. The film creates characters of flesh and blood - not just the protagonists, but the wives, girlfriends, parents, and children – who give the film its artful substance.” -USCCB Movie review:

usccb.org/movies/b/brokebackmountain.shtml
I agree with your assessment of the film, but is Seton Hall not Roman Catholic? It seems like the protestors are a minor but vocal group whose aim is to see any depiction of a lifestyle at odds with their own squelched. Most cases, such fanaticism is the exception, not the rule.
 
I agree with your assessment of the film, but is Seton Hall not Roman Catholic? It seems like the protestors are a minor but vocal group whose aim is to see any depiction of a lifestyle at odds with their own squelched. Most cases, such fanaticism is the exception, not the rule.
You’re right! They ought to ban any media or book that depicts anything other than single, celibate Catholics or married, chase Catholics.
 
Spoken like a true senior.

Address the issues and then make a real post.
Ha! And here I was feeling pretty spunky this morning for almost 36! 😛
Okay, here’s my real post, addressing the issues (minus the snarky reference to your youth, Grasshopper):
Are “the catholic attitute” “they” and “you” referring to this thread?
Could you please quote the “vehemently anti-gay prejudice” that is in use in this thread?
Otherwise, having read some of your other posts, I think you might be making some pretty inaccurate generalizations out of frustration from previous thread conversations. Maybe?
This isn’t a thread about homosexuality.
This is a thread about the the decision-making of a Catholic institution being called into question
 
That’s not really the Catholic attitude. It’s the attitude of a relatively small group of Catholics. Oher Catholics are perfectly willing to entertain various views. A simple example is Seton Hall, which is a Catholic University. This discussion itself shows the vast divisions that exist within the Catholic population; we see Catholics publicly attacking other Catholics. From a sociologic perspective, there no longer exists a Catholic view on social issues. This means there is no dominant view among the Catholic population.
More accurately many folks who are Catholic fail to inform their consciences correctly. Prudential judgements are needed, but political propaganda and academic nuance do not equal truth. They may relate a snapshot of “opinion” but that are not the foundation of a critical intellect.
 
More accurately many folks who are Catholic fail to inform their consciences correctly. Prudential judgements are needed, but political propaganda and academic nuance do not equal truth. They may relate a snapshot of “opinion” but that are not the foundation of a critical intellect.
And all that equals a huge split in Catholic thinking and views.
 
And all that equals a huge split in Catholic thinking and views.
You mean it means individual Catholics, with varying degrees of understanding, hold opinions that may or may not be consistent with Church teaching.
 
You mean it means individual Catholics, with varying degrees of understanding, hold opinions that may or may not be consistent with Church teaching.
Exactly correct. I make a distinction between the members of an organization and the official policy of the organization. Self-identified Catholics have a variety of opinions on social issues. Some are in accord with the official Church policy, others are not.

This is somewhat like looking at political parties. There is a party platform, then there is the rank and file who hold a variety of opinions which may be at odds with platform.
 
**While the actions taken by Ennis and Jack cannot be endorsed, the universal themes of love and loss ring true. **The film creates characters of flesh and blood - not just the protagonists, but the wives, girlfriends, parents, and children – who give the film its artful substance." -USCCB Movie review:

usccb.org/movies/b/brokebackmountain.shtml
This quote from the USCCB summarizes exactly how I felt about the movie. Sure if Ennis and Jack lived in a different era, the story probably wouldn’t have been so tragic. I believe that if you are well-grounded in your faith, you should be aware of what’s happening in pop-culture. Pop-culture affects society so greatly. Sure you can be ignorant of it and go on living, but when you try to make an arguement against something (like Brokeback or Da Vinci Code) you lose all credibility if you haven’t seen it. It’s like when the Passion of the Christ came out. How would we have felt if people say it sucked, it was full of lies and wrong on so many levels and then they admit they never saw it - we would want them to see the movie and then come back for a debate. Yes this is a Catholic University showing this movie- but university students are adults and to be a well-rounded adult Catholic, they should learn to view and read differing view-points from our religion in order to develop their critical thinking.
 
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