Sex, Marriage & Birth Control

[PassingThru]

What I don’t understand though is how y’all think you can know exactly what the planet can and can’t handle.

To me, it’s like admitting that God’s design was faulty. God made the world, and God says multiple children are BLESSINGS and we’re not to arbitrarily limit family size. So have some faith, your concerns and fears-- as far as I can tell-- are based on nothing.

Well, I am not really concerned at all. This is a hypothetical question! And I don’t think anyone is trying say what we can “handle” with an certainty whatsoever. I don’t really see it as a moral question, it is more of a logistics issue.

In that light, I think it is fair to say that there is a practical limit somewhere. That much is logical. And I don’t think it has much at all to do with space, its more with food/resources.

I think all people (at least me) are theorizing on, is a hypothetical scenario of:

If, as a whole, we were more focused on marriage and family, and our population did grow quite rapidly to the point where resources became gravely scarce (literally not enough to support the population, whether that is food/medicine/minerals etc) would that have an effect of Catholic or other religions stances on family size. Again, not as some sort of an attack on anyones values, more of a practical problem that needs solving. That would be of interest to me as a thought provoking issue…

 

[EeyoresButerfly]

There are some very broad and uncharitable generalizations going on in this thread.

Overpopulation is a concern. The land can only handle so much. The greater the populace, the more land that has to be cleared to make room. This means less land to grow crops and fewer habitats for wildlife. This means the land that is already used for growing crops would have to work harder and any kind of natural disaster that would have an even greater effect than it does now.

There are also many social concerns with overpopulation. Look at countries that are overpopulated right now- China and India being prime examples. You have countries with very high rates of poverty and extreme human rights abuses. Another issue is the out dated infrastructures in most places that simply could not handle a population explosion.

Now, I do not believe that if everybody started automatically following the church’s teaching that the population would explode. Like many, I believe the opposite because there would be much fewer children born out of wedlock. This would cut the birth rates for families in poverty dramatically as they have some of the largest percentage of illegitimate births and single parent households.

But to call people who look at the science behind population morons, or to think that anybody who recognizes the dangers of overpopulation automatically wishes death and divorce is simply inaccurate. If anything, the risk of overpopulation is a reason to embrace the teachings of the Catholic Church.

 

[PassingThru]

Overpopulation? Oh come on! Right now, there are some demographics that aren’t even replacing the people that die.

That’s why the hispanic population will be the majority in the US in our kids’ lifetime. That’s why Europe will be Muslim in our kids’ lifetime, maybe ours.

Overpopulation is a myth perpetuated by people who want free availability of birth control, abortion, divorce, and living lives with no consequences and no responsibility.

Unfortunately, the only people dumb enough to fall for this are the middle class WASPs.

I know I am stepping in a bear trap here, but I think in light of your comment it is worth mentioning that if current surveys are roughly accurate, half or more of the US Catholic population is in the same boat right next to the WASPs you are so upset with!!!

(As it relates to ABC, not the rest in your list)

/Ducks head

 

[RedSoxWife]

What I don’t understand though is how y’all think you can know exactly what the planet can and can’t handle.

To me, it’s like admitting that God’s design was faulty. God made the world, and God says multiple children are BLESSINGS and we’re not to arbitrarily limit family size. So have some faith, your concerns and fears-- as far as I can tell-- are based on nothing.

This pretty much sums up what I was thinking when I read this thread. We live in California, which I think many people probably think of as rather populated (we have enough problems… but they aren’t from overpopulation!) but there’s also a HUGE amount of land. If I left my house I could go several hundred miles south without hitting a town. I could go hundreds and hundreds of miles due north without meeting another person (lots of bears, coyotes and foxes though) and I have to drive three hours round trip east to do monthly shopping (or I could go four hours round trip to the east). And in my small garden I managed to grow enough vegetables to supply the four generations we have here, along with more than our local county soup kitchen could handle, the summer before I had my daughter (never plant an ENTIRE seed packet of tomato seeds in a green house in January… I ended up with 80 tomato plants.).

Overpopulation is a myth.

 

[ac_claire]

Overpopulation is a myth.

Agree.

I think all people (at least me) are theorizing on, is a hypothetical scenario of:

If, as a whole, we were more focused on marriage and family, and our population did grow quite rapidly to the point where resources became gravely scarce (literally not enough to support the population, whether that is food/medicine/minerals etc) would that have an effect of Catholic or other religions stances on family size. Again, not as some sort of an attack on anyones values, more of a practical problem that needs solving. That would be of interest to me as a thought provoking issue…

Ok, I think I understand more what you’re trying to say. As far as would any of this change the Catholic Church’s stance on family size (as you put it), I can tell you definitively: no. The Church’s tradition of blessing large families comes directly from the Church’s position on life issues, like ABC and abortion, as well as her teachings on marriage and fidelity. Those teachings have never and will never change.

However…the practices and beliefs of individual Catholics can, unfortunately, be all over the map. We all have free will, after all. And not all Catholics are faithful Catholics. I think this point also addresses your previous post about “half or more of the US Catholic population” embracing ABC. That may well be true, but it doesn’t have anything to do with what the Church actually teaches. I hope that makes some sense.

 

[PaulinVA]

I know I am stepping in a bear trap here, but I think in light of your comment it is worth mentioning that if current surveys are roughly accurate, half or more of the US Catholic population is in the same boat right next to the WASPs you are so upset with!!!

(As it relates to ABC, not the rest in your list)

/Ducks head

The birth control component is only a part of the selfish puzzle. Actually, I would same a lot of Catholics are in favor of the majority of things on the list - but that’s for another thread…

It used to be, before artificial birth control, women (and men) would not act on their adulterous attractions to each other because a very embarrassing baby could result. It kept everyone in check, so to speak.

So, the Anglican church caved in 1930 to allow birth control, and other protestant denominations followed suit.

Once those affairs could take place, people found they were mighty taken by the person they were committing adultery with, so they wanted to marry THEM instead of the person they started with. So, they needed divorce - no fault divorce was even better.

Sometimes, though, the free love, adultery and fornication causes unwanted babies. So, if you can get rid of THEM, you’ve hit the trifecta! Birth control, divorce, abortion! Hey, no need to think of others, now. Just think of yourself.

So, while people are thinking only of themselves, why in the world would they want to have 3 or 4 kids to ruin their lives? 1 or 2 is just fine.

Only it doesn’t replace those who are dying. OOPS!

 

[iamrefreshed]

What would happen if the world suddenly embraced Catholicism en masse and started following the Church’s teachings on sex and birth control.

The world would then be a wonderful place filled with peace and love. There would be no war, starvation or crime. All would share and none would need.

 

[gardenswithkids]

…My question is not meant to be provocative - I’m genuinely curious about the real-world implications of these teachings. … **What would happen if the world suddenly embraced Catholicism en masse and started following the Church’s teachings on sex and birth control. **…But could these teachings really work in the real world if everyone actually followed them? Wouldn’t this cause enormous problems, due the increase in the world’s population that would result?

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Thanks!

If everyone followed them, couples would reserve sex for marriage. There would be a sudden decline in the rate of unwed pregnancies and STD’s.

Now realizing the sex even within marriage has some restrictions, some might re-consider if they are called to marriage.

Marriages would be considered life-long, and the rate of divorce would drop. Second, third and forth marriages following divorce would stop.

The pornography industry would collapse.

The abortion industry would collapse.

The medical community and pharmaceutical industry could direct it’s full attention to curing illness and managing disease, rather than treating fertility as a disease.

Artificial hormones from birth control pills would no longer contaminate our waters and eco-system.

Children and pregnancy would be regarded as a blessing and responsibility, rather than an un-desirable side effect of sex.

Violence against women and children would decline. Violence–in general–would decline.

Oh, if only all the teachings of the Catholic church were followed the world would be a much better place…

 

[InRCIA]

Hi Everyone, I just signed up in hopes of getting some advice and this thread seems just the place. As you can see from my username, I’m currently in RCIA (very much enjoying it and looking excitedly forward to my Easter confirmation). I’m the mother to two beautiful children and would love to have more were it not for a severely busted disc in my lower back, which causes intense pain both in my back and down my left leg (the compressed disc pushes on my sciatic nerve). The damage happened during my second pregnancy – I have scoliosis and as a child the pediatric orthopedist actually warned my mother that I could have complications with pregnancy. So I’m very worried about additional pregnancies. There is the very real chance that I could lose the use of my left leg if there is further disc damage, not to mention the pain and how out of whack I am trying to keep up with the two little whirlwinds I have. I’m worried about being a hobbled, uninvolved mother! To further complicate things, I have endometriosis, and have had past surgery to remove cysts (one being grapefruit-sized). The only “treatment” for endometriosis is the pill. So, do I have any options out there? Am I SOL as far as getting future cysts? Should my husband and I take a chance with NFP or just stop being intimate altogether? I’m getting very worried/depressed over this issue. I’m not sure who to talk to. Have any of you had any experience with the above issues?

 

[InRCIA]

I also want to offer an apology if I just hijacked this thread…a very good topic, sorry!

 

[gardenswithkids]

I also want to offer an apology if I just hijacked this thread…a very good topic, sorry!

Hello and welcome to Catholic Answers and the Catholic Church. I don’t want to hijack the thread either, but if you want to copy your previous post and start a new thread, I’m sure there are many people here would respond to it. I’m sorry that you are struggling with health problems. Prayers for you.

 

[InRCIA]

Thanks, I think I’ve gotten my answers from reading other threads here. Looks like I’m just going to have to be reeeeeeally careful with the NFP. Hopefully my husband (a non-practicing Catholic) will understand. I’m going to try to find a Catholic OB GYN in my area, too.