Sex Scandal Has Far Reaching Implications

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manualman said:
This is a strange sentiment. Presuming you are (like me) a middle class white person, how many black people have you apologized to for the atrocity of slavery? That’s about as absurd as an innocent priest apologizing for sexual predation.

The sexual abuse crisis occurred precisely because far too many catholics (bishops, priests AND laity) all tolerated an excessively secular vision of catholicism decoupled from legitimate catholic sexual teaching. Nobody wakes up one morning and decides “Hey, maybe it would be fun to sexually molest a kid!” That sickness is one that comes on in stages. You don’t get there until you commit a LOT of earlier sexual sins, many of them trivialized in our culture today (masturbation, promiscuity, porn, sodomy, etc). The OP’s wife is unwittingly walking down the path (secularism) that leads to MORE of this sickness in society instead of less.

I’m confused about why she prevented the OP from attending mass. Were you backpacking in the wilderness and she feared being eaten by bears? Was she really terrified to be left alone in a hotel room for 2 hours? What does she do when you’re at work? Maybe I’m missing the details here, but I’d be concerned that she’s starting to try to manipulate the OP into giving up on his faith like she has hers.
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I wasn’t going to bring this up but maybe a little history will help. When my wife was in Catholic high school she attended school dances that were also attended by some of the school priests. On several occasions one or more of the priests would approach a table of students and invite one of the girls into the stairwell where he would kiss and fondle the girls. He would then return to the table to invite the next girl, and so on. All the girls were afraid to say no to a priest because they were “next to God”. When it finally came to my wife’s turn she was the first one to refuse. Many years later while my wife worked in our local high school the principal pointed a rifle at her as a joke. I was livid at this happening and reported it to the school board who did nothing but give a mild reprimand. He belonged to “the good old boys club” that says if you’re in a position of power almost anything is OK. The priest who made the apology did apologize for the actions of others, not himself, and he is the first person who made me feel that someone actually cares. If no one ever apologizes to the victims how are they ever to heal and ever trust again? It’s no wonder it took the Blacks so long to recover from the years of slavery. Just because slavery was an accepted practice never made it right.

I have much less of a problem with the priests who committed the crimes than I do with the Bishops who should have known better. There is absolutely no reason for what they did and it’s my wife’s anger at their arrogance that caused her to take the position she has.
 
TruthSkr said:
I did go to confession about it and the priest did not tell me if I sinned or not. He just said that I am the source to help my wife heal from her woundedness, and that I must listen to her issues. I have been doing this for years, but no matter how I try I cannot convince her that it’s just a matter that priests are human, too. She sees the Church as moral and spritual leaders who failed at their primary mission and who cannot be trusted.
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The sex scandals have had many impacts and one of the many is that they have facilitated many who for a variety of reaons want to leave the Church to leave whilst transferring any guilt they feel for so doing onto the “sinful clergy” who “drove us out” but their “failure”.

Having been brough up catholic it is likely that your wife knows well the tat the clergy are not anything other than sinful as are we all. Are you quite sure that she is not happy to be away and happy to have an excuse for being away?
 
Again with sex scandal


  1. *]Since not all priests are pedophiles, why blame the entire Catholic Church?
    *]Teachers molest kids that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t send our kids to school.
    *]There are Non-Catholic Christian Churches with a history of sex abuse (there’s a whole list at reformation.com)
 
TruthSkr said:
I have much less of a problem with the priests who committed the crimes than I do with the Bishops who should have known better. There is absolutely no reason for what they did and it’s my wife’s anger at their arrogance that caused her to take the position she has.
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I think you’re letting the sickos off rather easy. IMO both a priest who molests and a bishop who reassigns him knowing he’ll probably molest again are guilty of similar level of crime. Why excuse the one and not the other??

What I don’t understand is how anger at how some bishops were unfaithful to the beliefs they profess to hold could motivate someone to ALSO be unfaithful to those beliefs in response. The answer to faithless clergy isn’t LESS catholicism, it’s MORE catholicism. Always remember that the people in positions aren’t the object of our faith. They are caretakers and stewards of it. Faith is a gift from God, not the product of an institution. The Sacraments are not created, nor empowered by the faith or lack thereof of the priests. They are gifts from God for our nourishment. The fact that certain clergy have neglected to partake of that Grace should in no way encourage others to do the same.

And I’m still unclear, it is her illness that leaves her unable to be unattended for 2 hours in a hotel room? Does she have a caregiver at home?
 
manualman said:
I think you’re letting the sickos off rather easy. IMO both a priest who molests and a bishop who reassigns him knowing he’ll probably molest again are guilty of similar level of crime. Why excuse the one and not the other??

What I don’t understand is how anger at how some bishops were unfaithful to the beliefs they profess to hold could motivate someone to ALSO be unfaithful to those beliefs in response. The answer to faithless clergy isn’t LESS catholicism, it’s MORE catholicism. Always remember that the people in positions aren’t the object of our faith. They are caretakers and stewards of it. Faith is a gift from God, not the product of an institution. The Sacraments are not created, nor empowered by the faith or lack thereof of the priests. They are gifts from God for our nourishment. The fact that certain clergy have neglected to partake of that Grace should in no way encourage others to do the same.

And I’m still unclear, it is her illness that leaves her unable to be unattended for 2 hours in a hotel room? Does she have a caregiver at home?
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You are correct when you say that we cannot abandon our faith because of the sins of some. Our faith is what we need to keep us on the right path and this is why I continue to practice mine. I do not mean to say that the sins of the priests are not great, but the reasons for their failures are a little easier to understand as they were likely the result of some sort of addiction. The choice to move them to places where they could re-offend is harder to accept as the Bishops should have known better. My wife’s reason for not wanting me to leave her to attend Mass was simply because this was our first vacation in many years and she did not want to be left alone for any reason. Was she being unreasonable? - quite possibly. She certainly has issues with the Church that I have not been successful in countering in many years. I have tried every argument I could think of and she is not receptive to any. I believe that this has become more of an emotional issue than anything, as logical argument does not work. This has been very difficult for me as I, on one hand, understand her lack of trust in those who are our moral leaders, and on the other hand know that abondoning one’s faith is not the answer. At this point I believe that all I can do is pray for her.
 
I am glad that the Church is taking strict measures against sex offenders these days.
It is about time. They should NEVER have listened to the secular psychologists who told the bishops that some R&R and some counselling would make it safe for these men to be back around children again. The results were horrible, absolutely horrible.

I do have to take issue with one poster who said that it is common knowledge that
sex offenders cannot be “cured.” I would say that that depends on what you mean
by “cured.” If you mean by natural means such as art therapy, vitamins, meds, and psychological counselling, then you are absolutely right, they cannot be, and they will likely re-offend. That is because they are usually unrepentant. Just like most thieves will likely re-offend if given the opportunity to embezzle again: because they are tempted to do such things and they are unrepentant.
But there is absolutely NO moral flaw nor character flaw
that the Holy Spirit cannot “cure.” None whatsoever. It may take years of discipline and prayer and fasting, but the Holy Ghost can effect the cure of any and all sexual and other moral problems. To deny that, is to deny His power, and that is heresy.
But in the meantime, those sexual predators have to be kept away from children, period.
God bless all,
Jaypeeto4
 
TruthSkr said:
My wife and I have been married for 37 years. We were both raised Catholic, having both attended Catholic school from kindergarten through high school. Many years ago my wife stopped attending Mass. I didn’t really know why until just a few years ago. There were several reasons for it, but the primary one has to do with the sex scandal. My wife feels that the Catholic Church has among the strictest rules of all the Christian religions, yet its leadership has committed some of the worst sins by transferring sex offending priests from one place to the other, to re-offend, time after time. She feels it is a very hypocritical organization that she wants no parts of. My wife is a good woman, with very strong moral values. She had been an excellent wife and mother to our two sons, but on this issue there is no compromising.

Last month she and I went on our first vacation in 20 years. She had been unable to travel for many years because of an illness that she is still healing from. Before our trip to the Grand Canyon in Arizona I saw that there is a Catholic Church in Grand Canyon Village that we could have attended. My wife said that she absolutely would not go, and when I suggested that I could go by myself she said that it would be a serious problem if I left her alone in the park to go by myself. To avoid an ugly confrontation on our first vacation in so many years I made the decision to not go to Mass. Did I sin by doing so? And how do I handle this on future vacations?
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I don’t know for sure whether or not it was a sin…it is between you and God whether you missed Mass “deliberately” but since you confessed it, if it was a sin you are forgiven. So for all intents and purposes it is erased.

I don’t know what type of argument would persuade your wife, but i would suggest showing her some numbers first. A small fraction of priests abused children; a similar fraction of teachers, coaches, lawyers, cops, etc etc. You could not join or participate in any sort of organization made up of humans that is not made up of a few percent child molesters.

The question is: does your wife believe that the Church is Christ’s Body on Earth? That it holds the Truth? I would guess not b/c she is treating the Church like a human organization. I think she needs educating about what the Church really is, and she should start with the Catechism.
 
usnlt76 said:
I don’t know what type of argument would persuade your wife, but i would suggest showing her some numbers first. A small fraction of priests abused children; a similar fraction of teachers, coaches, lawyers, cops, etc etc. You could not join or participate in any sort of organization made up of humans that is not made up of a few percent child molesters.
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I just had a conversation with my wife about this comment as I used it before to try to persuade her. Her response was “what bishop anywhere in the United States reported a pedophile priest before the whole issue went ballistic?” At least the police, the lawyers, the educators policed their own. The Church did not. She feels that the bishops are the leadership of the Church and that they failed us. She said that she tolerated a priest in her parish who had a live in mistress and priests who went after high school girls. At least they sinned with those who had freedom of choice. But when it came to going after innocent children who didn’t have a choice and then covering it up she gets livid. Yes, it is an emotional issue for her, very emotional.
 
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