Sex with ex-wife

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Lifeisbeautiful3

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I have a brother in Christ with whom I attend a bible study through our church. This man has endured a rough road with an alcoholic wife, with whom he had to separate to protect his children.

In our small group setting, he asked a curious question: His wife has been sober for some time now, and is exhibiting ever-improving prospects at the possibility of reintegration into his family, even after their civil divorce. (He never sought, nor does he want a decree of nullity, and he has been faithful since they were married). Would it be morally acceptable, he asked, to again enjoy the closeness that sexuality brings to a husband and wife? (She had a hysterectomy for ovarian cancer, so pregnancy is neither possible nor a goal).

Thoughts?
 
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Was he married in the church?

If he was and the marriage hasn’t been annulled she is still his wife regardless of civil status.
 
This is a question for his pastor.

To avoid scandal, and to make sure the kids are not tossed into "mommy is back! mommy is gone again! mommy is back again! situation, there needs to be a formal reunion. What I have seen happen (this does happen in parishes from time to time) is that the couple gets a new marriage license does a renewal of vows before the priest and then they return to the conjugal life.
 
Yeah, I get what you are saying, but it still doesn’t seem okay. I agree with TheLittleLady that they should talk to their pastor. If there is no emotional commitment as in their past, it seems a bit like hooking up. And yes, confusing to their children if they have any.
 
Irishmom2 said:
Yeah, I get what you are saying, but it still doesn’t seem okay. I agree with TheLittleLady that they should talk to their pastor. If there is no emotional commitment as in their past, it seems a bit like hooking up. And yes, confusing to their children if they have any.
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The children should not be forced to further interact with their abuser/neglecter than required by law. This is a major issue that needs to be overcome.

However, he is still married to this woman from a Catholic perspective. No matter how imprudent one should recognize that he is still married.

The children are another issue entirely, as is her recovery. AA mandates a minimum of a year, and given the damage, I’d say probably 2 should be considered. However, they are married and pretending they aren’t would be unhealthy and a farce.
 
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If he and his wife have a valid Sacrament of Marriage (consult priest on that question), then having sex would not be intrinsically evil. It would not be extramarital sex. However, acts which are not intrinsically evil, can still be immoral due to intention or circumstances. And that evaluation can only be done by the couple. You have to consider all of the possible consequences, good and bad, and also be honest in evaluating your own motives.
 
They are married to each other, which means they can have sexual relations. The marriage wasn’t annulled, so it’s really a marriage.

Have we come to a point where it’s okay to have sex with a ‘second’ spouse, but not okay to have sex with your ex, who by all means is still your spouse?
 
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They were married in the Catholic Church and neither disputes the validity of the marriage. Neither of them wanted to divorce, but in our state, one cannot have sold custody of children without a divorce pending - and it cannot be pending indefinitely.
 
They _could_licitly have sex. They’re legitimately married. However, it might not be prudent for them to revive their sexual relationship at this point.

This is one of those “Could you? Yeah, you could. Should you? Ehh…”’ type questions.
 
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Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
The children should not be forced to further interact with their abuser/neglecter than required by law. This is a major issue that needs to be overcome
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No where was it said there was abuse or neglect.
Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
The children are another issue entirely, as is her recovery. AA mandates a minimum of a year, and given the damage, I’d say probably 2 should be considered.
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AA is a voluntary program with NO expectation and certainty NO mandates. You trying to say that a 12 step program like AA requires folks in recovery to not see or interact with their children as a fact is a problem.
 
X was addressing two points, her children and her recovery. AAA requests a year away from dating/new romantic relationships to focus on recovery.

The stress of reintegrating after divorce is a potential trigger for relapse, and needs to addressed seriously.
 
AAA is an automotive service company. AA is for Alcoholics Anonymous. Often 12 step SELF help recovery support groups express one should wait about a year to get into a NEW relationship, this is not the case in the OP’s question. This is a married couple who have lived separately but seem to have always looked toward living as a family again.

My point about AA is they have no mandates, no real rules, and make suggestions on how one might be successful in recovery. It is not a treatment program and has no real accountability to anyone other than the group itself.
 
Horton said:
No where was it said there was abuse or neglect.
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He had to separate for the children’s safety. If they were unsafe, in the very least, the parent was being neglectful of their care.
Horton said:
AA is a voluntary program with NO expectation and certainty NO mandates. You trying to say that a 12 step program like AA requires folks in recovery to not see or interact with their children as a fact is a problem.
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You missed my comma. The children are another issue COMMA as is her recovery.

AA (which, yes, is voluntary) is a well known and successful organization for addiction recovery. It’s one of the very, very few programs that have shown long-term, decade-long life changes.

AA does require that participants do not begin a relationship for a minimum of a year after recovery. Given the fact that there are children involved, divorce involved and a whole slew of issues doubling that time would be prudent.

I never said that she shouldn’t see her children. I said that his feelings for her shouldn’t mean that the children are forced to interact any more than required by law. He has been granted custody for their safety. While it appears that she is now safe, they still have a right to their own recovery from trauma. Their recovery is the FIRST priority and should not be forced by needing to interact with her because he now wants to be around her.
 
Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
AA does require that participants do not begin a relationship for a minimum of a year after recovery. Given the fact that there are children involved, divorce involved and a whole slew of issues doubling that time would be prudent.
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You will need to site an authority for this. I worked professionally in addiction treatment for many years and know 12 step groups like AA very well. There are NO requirements in AA. One is only accountable to themselves. There is no reporting system (the anonymous part of AA) and it is NOT addiction treatment. It is simply a recovery support group. AA is NOT a program.

There was nothing said about the length of time the wife has been sober, could be six months, could be 2 years. The reality is you don’t know, I don’t know, the only one here who may, is the OP. Nothing was said about “and a whole slew of issues”. So quit making up stuff so you have something to post about.

I’m guessing you know very little about addiction and recovery. (Having a family member being an addict does not make one knowledgeable about addiction treatment & recovery)
 
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12 step programs are medically irresponsible, and so is telling someone to make marital decisions based on the programs’ arbitrary rules or philosophy.

For starters, AA has abysmal success rates, so taking their approach and applying it to other addictions or behaviors is several steps removed from logical. Most mental health providers and addiction counselors don’t recommend AA or similar groups first, because telling someone they’re ‘powerless’ over their own behavior is a stupid place to start and totally out of line with modern addiction science and therapy. The notion of ‘abstinence’ has really only been shown to be beneficial for the most severe alcoholics. The groups are led by Average Joe’s off the street with no real counseling or social work background. There is no oversight of these groups.

If she needs a year, or whatever, before reconnecting with her husband, then that decision needs to come about from discussions between the couple and with any real counselors or doctors she is seeing. It should never, ever be the place of a psuedoscientific self-help group to make blanket recommendations like that to addicts or their families and the OP should feel more than free to disregard them.
 
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Unfortunately, a lot of families of addicts were duped by the promises of AA in the 80’s and 90’s. It provided hope in a surefire, easy to understand way. It also turned a lot of people off from addiction treatment who need it the most. It was never grounded on science; it’s always been about philosophy.

That said, I have someone in my life that has stopped drinking with AA. It can help some people some of the time. But even she would tell you it’s not a treatment plan and you have to take what works and leave what doesn’t in conjunction with real help. A reputable, licensed counselor would never tell someone to wait X amount of time before rebuilding a family. The counselor may try to talk someone through it and help them come up with a workable plan, but even the experts know that rules and advice like that are not helpful or even ethical.
 
If he’s married then it would be totally fine.
If he’s married in the church and never got an annulment then they’re still married.
 
Xanthippe_Voorhees said:
successful organization for addiction recovery. It’s one of the very, very few programs that have shown long-term, decade-long life changes.
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Actually, the nature of AA as anonymous means that there is no data available. All reports of success are anecdotal. AA could not tell you what their success rate is because such records are not maintained.

Fascinating article The Surprising Failures of 12 Steps - The Atlantic
 
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