Shia view on sex with pre-pubertal girls

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Rodrigo_Bivar

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Grand Ayatollah as-Sistani gave the following fatwa on the permissibility of Muslims marrying and having sex with girls below the age of puberty.

Apparently, it is permissible for a Muslim to marry and have sex with a girl below the age of puberty (i.e. non-baligh) as long as she has passed the age of nine. She is still not-haram to him after she attains puberty. But if he has damaged her sexual organs by having sex with her, he is advised to divorce her. What kindness.
  1. If a person contracts Nikah with a non-baligh girl, it is haraam to have sexual intercourse before she has completed her nine years. But if he commits sexual intercourse with her, she will not be haraam for him when she becomes baligh, even if she may have suffered Ifza (which has been described in rule 2389), though as a precaution, he should divorce her.
sistani.org/html/eng/main/index.php?page=3&lang=eng&part=3

This is what Ifza means:

imamreza.net/eng/imamreza.php?id=3738
Ifza (Ifdha):
Opening. State of a woman that her urinary and menstrual tract or her menstrual passage and rectum, or all three of them have become one.

The nine year limit is in consideration to Muhammad’s marriage to Aisha as he also married and had sex with a pre-pubertal girl of the age of nine.

Please note the morality and kindness of having sex and damaging the sexual organs of a pre-pubertal girl of nine. Please also note the morality of divorcing her once her sexual organs have been damaged and casting her away like trash.
 
I think this is a horrible crime against women. sex with a 9 year old. Now where does that get fun?
 
Wammy101 said:
I think this is a horrible crime against women. sex with a 9 year old. Now where does that get fun?
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Not fun for the girl, but its fun for horny and lust for virgins people like ayatollah! Disgusting!
 
PaulDupre said:
It goes against the natural law. Horrible.
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It is. But it does not against Islamic shia law. See why now, they have problem with modern civilization? Because they prefer to live in the 7th century era.
 
In Iran they tried to change the minimum age to 14. It was vetoed by the Islamic clerics. So it remains 9 years old. Muhammed did it, so it must be good. When will they learn.
 
cestusdei said:
In Iran they tried to change the minimum age to 14. It was vetoed by the Islamic clerics. So it remains 9 years old. Muhammed did it, so it must be good. When will they learn.
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TIGHT! Thats the only thing they learn. 🙂

Disgusting. Really really disgusting. Do you think a 9 year old girl ready for sex activity?
 
It seems to me that many of the posts here that “discuss” Islam could trigger automatic suspension under the rules. That I, as a jew, find myself continuoulsy defending Islam here, is an indication of the level of hatred, rather than discussion that is being focused on in many of these threads.
 
Valke2 said:
It seems to me that many of the posts here that “discuss” Islam could trigger automatic suspension under the rules. That I, as a jew, find myself continuoulsy defending Islam here, is an indication of the level of hatred, rather than discussion that is being focused on in many of these threads.
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Valke, I agree with you, but I am going to say it strikes me that most of the religious animosity that I, at least, see in here comes from those who attack Catholicism, Christianity generally, or Judaism, and nobody does a thing about it. If the rules are that we cannot discuss something true, but not very complimentary, about Islam, but that Islamists can come in here freely and clog up threads with outrageous slanders, then I think the rules are inappropriately and unfairly applied. Not long ago I found myself responding to a Muslim who said there was an “agreement” between Israel and Hezbollah that Israeli civilians would be killed, and that, therefore, Jews only had themselves to blame for it. Want to defend that one? Now on this 9-year-old girl thing; it’s either true or it isn’t. If it’s not true, then someone needs to show that it isn’t. If it’s true, then it’s heinous and a terrible commentary on Shia Islam, and nobody should be prevented from saying so.

I, for one, have had all I want of the Stockholm Syndrome nonsense where we have to watch people mistreated or killed and then make excuses for those who do it instead of telling the truth on them.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Valke, I agree with you, but I am going to say it strikes me that most of the religious animosity that I, at least, see in here comes from those who attack Catholicism, Christianity generally, or Judaism, and nobody does a thing about it. If the rules are that we cannot discuss something true, but not very complimentary, about Islam, but that Islamists can come in here freely and clog up threads with outrageous slanders, then I think the rules are inappropriately and unfairly applied. Not long ago I found myself responding to a Muslim who said there was an “agreement” between Israel and Hezbollah that Israeli civilians would be killed, and that, therefore, Jews only had themselves to blame for it. Want to defend that one? Now on this 9-year-old girl thing; it’s either true or it isn’t. If it’s not true, then someone needs to show that it isn’t. If it’s true, then it’s heinous and a terrible commentary on Shia Islam, and nobody should be prevented from saying so.

I, for one, have had all I want of the Stockholm Syndrome nonsense where we have to watch people mistreated or killed and then make excuses for those who do it instead of telling the truth on them.
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I generally stick to the non-Catholic portion and I don’t doubt that a lot of people come here to attack Christianity. And I may be seeing more of the reaction than the action. As far as the 9 year old girl issue goes, I can tell you exactly how this topic will come out. A muslim will post that it is certainly not part of Islam to sleep with children and then they will explain why the post should not be taken literally. THen someone will reply that “well, that’s your opinion, but the scripture says what it says.” Then the muslim or someone else will post something about how The Bible has its share of disgusting verse. Then the Catholic or Christian will reply that Jesus fullfilled x laws and that while the Old Testament is valuable, they are not bound by it. Then I will jump in and say if you are explaining away portions of your text, why do you have so much trouble excepting the muslim’s explanation of their text? Then someone will ask me if I’ve seen the Daniel Pearl video.

Then the thread will continue.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Not long ago I found myself responding to a Muslim who said there was an “agreement” between Israel and Hezbollah that Israeli civilians would be killed, and that, therefore, Jews only had themselves to blame for it. Want to defend that one?
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What does that have to do with Islam or religion in general?
 
We should also remember that there are marriages to 14 year olds that are sanctioned in this country (USA).
 
Valke2 said:
I generally stick to the non-Catholic portion and I don’t doubt that a lot of people come here to attack Christianity. And I may be seeing more of the reaction than the action. As far as the 9 year old girl issue goes, I can tell you exactly how this topic will come out. A muslim will post that it is certainly not part of Islam to sleep with children and then they will explain why the post should not be taken literally. THen someone will reply that “well, that’s your opinion, but the scripture says what it says.” Then the muslim or someone else will post something about how The Bible has its share of disgusting verse. Then the Catholic or Christian will reply that Jesus fullfilled x laws and that while the Old Testament is valuable, they are not bound by it. Then I will jump in and say if you are explaining away portions of your text, why do you have so much trouble excepting the muslim’s explanation of their text? Then someone will ask me if I’ve seen the Daniel Pearl video.

Then the thread will continue.
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Good, valid points with a realistic outcome. The question in my mind is “What is your proposed course of action?” Should we as Christians, in particular Catholic Christians, turn a blind eye to our (mis)understandings of Muslim text and law? You made a statement (in rebuttal) to a poster to join Christians for Tolerance… That is an interesting thought. Tolerance. Do you expect me to tolerate the acceptance of Shia Muslim teachings like violating the sanctity of a 9 year old girls body? In this thread your innuendo of tolerance in this case is poor guidance. So, with that said, what is your idea for where this should go?

Peace,

Gordon
 
Valke2 said:
We should also remember that there are marriages to 14 year olds that are sanctioned in this country (USA).
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Blue laws that are still on the books (and seldom adhered to or utilized.) In the state of NC, you can still take your wife to the courthouse steps on Sunday at noon to beat her with a switch of which is not to exceed the diameter of your thumb. Haven’t seen that happen lately though. Point taken, however.

Peace,

Gordon
 
Gordon_N said:
Good, valid points with a realistic outcome. The question in my mind is “What is your proposed course of action?” Should we as Christians, in particular Catholic Christians, turn a blind eye to our (mis)understandings of Muslim text and law? You made a statement (in rebuttal) to a poster to join Christians for Tolerance… That is an interesting thought. Tolerance. Do you expect me to tolerate the acceptance of Shia Muslim teachings like violating the sanctity of a 9 year old girls body? In this thread your innuendo of tolerance in this case is poor guidance. So, with that said, what is your idea for where this should go?

Peace,

Gordon
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First of all, after reading all these posts, I still have no idea whether Islam sanctions sex with 9 year old girls today. I’m guessing the answer is no. The link that the OP provided did not say anything, that I could find, about sex with 9 year olds being acceptable.

What does christian scripture teach about the mariageable age of children?
 
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