Should Catholics support Israel, Palestine, or take a neutral stance?

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colmywaykurtz said:
I believe what you say here, and it makes some points I’ve been trying to make in this discussion in a far better way than I ever could.

chosen people, since you are posting in a Christian forum, I feel comfortable asking this. What do you think of the Christian gospel?
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There is only one God and we are all His children. Judaism is a universal religion in that it holds that it is easier for the Gentile than for the Jew to get into the world to come as the Gentile has only to follow the seven Noahide commandments.
 
St_Francis said:
…However, I do feel that those who are called Palestinians have been used and abused by the Arabs and are in a terrible position. I feel sorry for most of them because they are pawns in power politics there.
…
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Yes. How many so-called Palestinians are there? There can’t be so many that the neighboring Islamic states can’t use some of their oil money and absorb them all. Common culture, common heritage, common religion. They could even stop buying themselves solid gold Rolls Royces, silver palaces, and shopping trips to Europe for just a few minutes to buy them all houses to live in.

Just look at a map of the area from the Atlantic Ocean, across N. Africa and the ME, and all the way to the S. Pacific and ask why there is a problem when Muslims have all that land except for a sliver called Israel.

Maybe God is not a real estate agent, but He did give the Jews the promised land.
 
sedonaman said:
Yes. How many so-called Palestinians are there? There can’t be so many that the neighboring Islamic states can’t use some of their oil money and absorb them all. Common culture, common heritage, common religion. They could even stop buying themselves solid gold Rolls Royces, silver palaces, and shopping trips to Europe for just a few minutes to buy them all houses to live in.
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I’d venture to say that King Abdullah’s accountant could slip them enough money to house them all by financial sleight-of-hand and Abdullah would probably never notice. They’ve probably given more money to American victims of 9/11 than they have to the Palestinians.

A fat lot they really care about people whom they are so quick to call “oppressed” and “downtrodden.”
 
sedonaman said:
Yes. How many so-called Palestinians are there? There can’t be so many that the neighboring Islamic states can’t use some of their oil money and absorb them all. Common culture, common heritage, common religion. They could even stop buying themselves solid gold Rolls Royces, silver palaces, and shopping trips to Europe for just a few minutes to buy them all houses to live in.

Just look at a map of the area from the Atlantic Ocean, across N. Africa and the ME, and all the way to the S. Pacific and ask why there is a problem when Muslims have all that land except for a sliver called Israel.

Maybe God is not a real estate agent, but He did give the Jews the promised land.
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My thought is that most if not all of the Arab rulers have no interest in bettering the lives of the Palestinians. Having a population that shares many of the same characteristics and can easily be portrayed as oppressed by the Israelis serves to keep many at home distracted from their own lot. While many of the Arab leaders could easily make them citizens, give them civil rights and take them out of the refugee camps that would end the same ability to portray the Palestinians as victims. This might give the other home populations a chance to stop and look at their own situation and start to ask even more questions about their rulers that the rulers don’t want to have asked. In the end it serves their best interest not to help the Palestinians too much or try to seek actual reconciliation between the Israelis and Palestinians.

ChadS
 
I come at Israel and Palestine at many angles. One big angle to it for me is political. Israel is the only free democracy in the middle east. Palestine on the other hand elected the terrorist Hamas as the gov’t in Palestine. America and Israel is the closest with gov’t goes. America would never elect hamas in our gov’t and destroy Christian Churches led by the gov’t. I just remember when the twin towers were hit, seeing Palestinians celebrating in the streets and handing out candy being happy that Americans died. Israel did the opposite, gave America support and offered their help.
 
I thought Roman Catholics thought they should occupy Isreal. It was the main purpose they started the Crusades correct?
 
RTully said:
I thought Roman Catholics thought they should occupy Isreal. It was the main purpose they started the Crusades correct?
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Don’t be so smug. The bulk of the crusaders came from parts of Europe that became and are now Lutheran.
 
George_Stegmeir said:
Don’t be so smug. The bulk of the crusaders came from parts of Europe that became and are now Lutheran.
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Not smug sir just stating historical fact:

‘The Crusades were a series of religiously sanctioned military campaigns, called by the Pope and with the main goal of restoring Christian control of the Holy Land. The crusaders came from all over western Europe. The main series of Crusades occurred between 1095 and 1291; historians have given them numbers, later unnumbered crusades were also taken up for a variety of reasons…The Crusades were fought mainly by Roman Catholics against Muslims’

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades

Also, I don’t claim Protestants are not responsible for horrible human events. Differance is they do not claim infailability like the Roman Catholic Church.
 
I think a free, democratic, secular state with no race or religious preference in immigration or law would be an excellent idea. And giving up the nukes would also be good.
 
Hokomai said:
I think a free, democratic, secular state with no race or religious preference in immigration or law would be an excellent idea. And giving up the nukes would also be good.
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Such a state would not only cease to be Israel, it would shortly cease being altogether, subsumed forcefully into one of the adjacent Islamic states.

And they have no more call to give up their nukes than we, England, or France have.

ICXC NIKA.
 
exnihilo said:
Ridgerunner, it would be pointless to continue because you seem to think the US is a holy nation. I dont. You see things it does always in a positive light. I used to be like you. So it might be the case that I approach everything always looking and seeing the worst.

But I do have a defense for my position and that is that the power to rule people tends to corrupt. In order for the most massive government in the history of the world to not be corrupt it would have to be exceptional. You apparently believe that it is. I do not. I’d point to any number of social metrics which show a diseased and depressed culture. If that society is exceptional it is in a satanic way, not a holy way. So while I’m aware of all the justifications that make the US right in all that it does I simply dont believe them nor could I.
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You are a very wise person. Thanks for your posts, I have enjoyed reading them. 👍
 
I support a viable Palestine living in peace next to a secure Israel. Two states for two peoples. Negotiations are the sole way to get there.
 
I would say a neutral stance. The kind of Christians who support Israel are typically the ones who want the Israelites to rebuild the temple and bring about the end times. I say that no such effort would bring about that turn of events. Honestly there has been so much fighting over Israel, I can’t support any more bloodshed over that land.
 
antonivs said:
I support a viable Palestine living in peace next to a secure Israel. Two states for two peoples. Negotiations are the sole way to get there.
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The idea that conflicts between peoples can be resolved by diplomatic negotiation has frequently been a dangerous delusion. Duplicitous states bargain in bad faith, using the process to buy time and mask their aggression.
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frontpagemag.com/2011/09/09/time-to-face-reality-in-the-middle-east
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Every Palestinian boy gets a .22 caliber AK-47 for his tenth birthday. frontpagemag.com/2011/09/08/lessons-that-last-a-lifetime

People who do this to their kids do not negotiate in good faith, a requirement for any successful negotiation.
 
Israel. Plus, its easy because both main parties in the U.S generally are for an Israeli state. Just saying…🙂
 
I’m for Israel because a nation like Israel that has the power to wipe Palestine off the map and doesn’t , after daily missiles fired at them,holds much restraint. If it were the other way around ,it wouldn’t be the same. I know God favors the nation who is slow to anger so therefore I am too.
 
Copts aren’t allowed to visit Israel since the Israeli government gave the Coptic monastery of Deir el-Sultan over to the Ethiopians, so unless/until that gets resolved I’d like to think I have no particular interest in this…but…I know Palestinian Christians. Reading some of these replies, I wonder how true that is for everyone else.

I find the decrying of the exploitation of the Palestinians by the neighboring Arabs, while essentially true (like Hassan Ibrahim says in the film “Control Room”, a water pipe breaks in Damascus and the Israel-Palestine conflict is to blame), a bit hypocritical coming from people who would support Israel. How is this not also exploiting the Palestinians? Condemning them to live in all kinds of humiliations because of your view of Israel, as though it is right to prioritize one peoples’ right to live over another. It really does seem as though some believe Israel is democratic, so they should be sustained; the Palestinians are not, so they get what they deserve. Really? I don’t think either of those positions are true. Look up water rationing in Israel sometime. Guess who most often goes without? It’s not the settlers. That’s an important issue in the desert…though I guess those dirty Palestinians deserved it…they probably voted for the wrong party in those oh so undemocratic elections held in Palestine (you know, the ones that are reported to be “extremely professional, in line with international standards, free, transparent and without violence” by international observers).
 
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