Should Catholics support new laws on banning certain fashions?

[TypesAndShadows]

I’d support it. I’ve daydreamed before about removing that temptation to sin mortally. It’s like being forced to watch porn in public.

And would you make it illegal for men to wear baggy trousers that show their underpants? And for men to wear tight t-shirts, or no shirt at all? And for men to wear skinny jeans? And for men to wear smart clothes that make them look particularly attractive?

Would you make it illegal for people to say sexual things in public, or even a sexual innuendo?

Would you make it illegal to treat someone in an irritating manner, that causes them to sin by thinking uncharitable thoughts?

 

[edwest2]

I see some have decided to fog up the issue. We are all responsible, each one of us. Modesty means modesty. And it should be a universal standard.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Julianna]

But if you were to wear a burkha, I’ll bet men who can’t control their urges would still find a way to sexualize and objectify you

Sarah x

yes they would.

 

[aspirant]

You mean if I showed tasty ice cream everywhere I went you wouldn’t get hungry because you saw it?

Assuming for the sake of your example that eating ice cream was a sin (it’s not), being tempted would not be a sin. Feeling hungry would not be a sin. Feeling one’s mouth water after seeing the ice cream would not be a sin. Deliberately willing to eat the ice cream (whether one ate it or not) would be the sin. Willing to eat the ice cream would be my own choice, my own sin, my own fault.

The responsibility for my reaction to the ice cream is mine.

The elements of your reaction that are deliberately chosen, yes. Hunger and mouthwatering are not deliberately chosen reactions, but willing to eat would be.

If they dressed provocatively, isn’t part of the sin theirs?

We are the subjects of our own actions. Regardless what other people do, good or evil, other people cannot choose our actions for us. In the words of Karol Wojtyla:
Karol Wojtyla:

Man’s nature differs fundamentally from that of the animals. It includes the power of self determination, based on reflection, and manifested in the fact that a man acts from choice. This power is called free will.

Because a human being-- a person-- possesses free will, he is his own master, sui juris as the Latin phrase has it… The incommunicable, the inalienable, in a person is intrinsic to that person’s inner self, the power of self determination, free will. No one else can want for me. No one can substitute his act of will for mine. It does sometimes happen that someone very much wants me to want what he wants. This is the moment when the impassable frontier between him and me, which is drawn by free will, becomes most obvious. I may not want what he wants me to want-- and in this precisely I am incommunicabilis. I am, and must be, independent in my actions.

The culpability for my deliberate bad choices is mine. “I confess to almighty God, and to you, my brothers and sisters, that I have greatly sinned in my thoughts and in my words, in what I have done, and in what I have failed to do, through my fault, through my fault, through my most grievous fault.”

 

[Kamaduck]

I see some have decided to fog up the issue. We are all responsible, each one of us. Modesty means modesty. And it should be a universal standard.

Nobody’s contesting that modesty itself is a good thing. Most just don’t think there should be laws enforcing it. Putting aside the fact that they would never get passed, there are all sorts of other problems with it. Who gets to decide what is modest? If Melek had his way, the law would ban yoga pants. That just seems silly to me- are we banning all swimsuits? Ballet clothes? Diving gear? Leotards? Where are we drawing the line, and why?

So no, we don’t all have the same definition of modesty. Your idea of modesty =/= others ideas of modesty, so who gets to write the proposed laws?

 

[Julianna]

Nobody’s contesting that modesty itself is a good thing. Most just don’t think there should be laws enforcing it. Putting aside the fact that they would never get passed, there are all sorts of other problems with it. Who gets to decide what is modest? If Melek had his way, the law would ban yoga pants. That just seems silly to me- are we banning all swimsuits? Ballet clothes? Diving gear? Leotards? Where are we drawing the line, and why?

So no, we don’t all have the same definition of modesty. Your idea of modesty =/= others ideas of modesty, so who gets to write the proposed laws?

thank you, exactly.

America, land of the free, home of the brave.

 

[atheistgirl]

So no, we don’t all have the same definition of modesty. Your idea of modesty =/= others ideas of modesty, so who gets to write the proposed laws?

Right.

What’s the point of dressing modestly? To stop others from having lustful thoughts?

But how do I know the guy opposite me doesn’t have a fetish about 4 inch heels?

Or long black hair?

Or petite slim women?

Or women with black eyes?

Nothing I can do about covering these unless I wear a tent, a turban, dark glasses and go barefoot.

And even then some guy’s bound to get turned on

Sarah x

 

[Melek]

Among other things, your disrespect for women has clearly increased.

Clearly you do not treat women well. You’re objectifying and violating women, then blaming women for your own bad treatment of women.

Violating women? Excuse me? Me masturbating is only violating myself. You make some very outrageous accusations…accusations that might be considered slander in certain jurisdictions.

You also previously compared women getting raped to men masturbating. You do realize how sexist you sound? Do you think rape victims would appreciate your disrespectful comparison on masturbation with women getting raped?

 

[edwest2]

The usual dodges.

 

[gam197]

originally posted by athiestgirl
What one sees as provocative another won’t

When I’m not in a business suit, I’m in tight jeans or short shorts or a mini skirt.

I’m only little so everything that accentuates my legs is all good to me

Am I trying to be provocative.

Do you wear them to go food shopping or to the mall?

Can one dictate clothing lawfully - no. Still morally women should be held accountable. The Church has always taught modesty in dress.
’
I understand fully that we are responsible for our own actions. Yet most could come up with some basic dress code. That is what catholic schools do sometime.

I think women know when they are dressing provocatively. They wear real tight clothes, low cut tops, Daisy Duke shorts. I have this discussion with my daughters and they will say they are hot in the summer.

I think nice looking women do wear these clothes just because they are nice looking. and they can.

 

[Oneofthewomen]

It’s a lot more complex than that. Most rape cases don’t happen because of fashion. However, many masturbation cases happen because of fashion. The comparison was very inappropriate.

A man’s problem with masturbation is not caused by the fashion of women.
Take some responsibility, your problem is caused by you not controlling your urges.

 

[Seeker1961]

The usual dodges.

So I’m guessing that you believe laws should be passed to enforce women to dress modestly?

Good luck with that.

To the OP: your choices are your own-not the fault of a woman, her clothing or lack thereof. All of us have inclinations to sin, it’s our choice how we respond to them. You can give into them and blame someone else for your choice-or you can be responsible for yourself and make better choices. Prayer, scripture reading and Mass will help.

 

[Rence]

I’m a young man and it’s very tempting for me to go home and masturbate whenever I see a woman dressed provocatively. Fashion these days reveals so much on women. The winter time used to be safe but even that has turned into a time of temptation with all the tight yoga pants young women are wearing these days.

Should Catholics support new laws to not allow certain fashions that are distracting? Many of my Muslim friends who are from countries such as Pakistan agree with me on this.

Human beings are blessed with the capacity to reason and self control. Perhaps you should excercise some since it’s so tempting “whenever you see a woman dressed provocatively”. Especially since everyone has different opinions on what might be ‘provocative’. What might be provocative to you may not be to someone else.

 

[Rence]

So I’m guessing that you believe laws should be passed to enforce women to dress modestly?

Good luck with that.

To the OP: your choices are your own-not the fault of a woman, her clothing or lack thereof. All of us have inclinations to sin, it’s our choice how we respond to them. You can give into them and blame someone else for your choice-or you can be responsible for yourself and make better choices. Prayer, scripture reading and Mass will help.

Thank you

 

[Rence]

Should we also allow public banners with nude women?

If we ban public banners with nude women, then all the nude art needs to go…even the ones in chapels and cathedrals

 

[Rence]

Let’s not lie to ourselves. The fashion industry is trying to make women look sexually provocative just like porn. There is no reason to reveal so much skin or have clothes that are so tight they clearly show the curvature of a woman’s entire body. This is trouble for many men trying to practice chastity.

And Jesus said, 'if your eye is causing you to sin, then cut…" well, you know what He said

 

[KendraDZ1902]

I’m a young man and it’s very tempting for me to go home and masturbate whenever I see a woman dressed provocatively. Fashion these days reveals so much on women. The winter time used to be safe but even that has turned into a time of temptation with all the tight yoga pants young women are wearing these days.

Should Catholics support new laws to not allow certain fashions that are distracting? Many of my Muslim friends who are from countries such as Pakistan agree with me on this.

The OP wasn’t about short skirts or low cut shirts or any other style of clothing that would be immodest. His problem is with yoga pants
Control yourself, bud.

 

[gam197]

originally** posted by KendraDZ1902**
The OP wasn’t about short skirts or low cut shirts or any other style of clothing that would be immodest. His problem is with yoga pants

College girls have always worn these types - first it was black leggings, then loose pants with saying on bum such as “Hot” and now tight yoga pants which usually are worn with mini tops in warm weather.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

College girls have always worn these types - first it was black leggings, then pants with saying on bum such as “Hot” and now tight yoga pants which usually are worn with mini tops in warm weather.

I was a college kid not too long ago. About 2 years. My go to outfit was leggings/yoga pants and an oversized fraternity t-shirt. Again

 

[gam197]

I live near a college. Just posting what I see when the winter coats come off.

The yoga pants are very popular.