Should homosexual acts be illegal from a Catholic & Government perspective?

[DexUK]

Hasn’t this horse finally been beaten to death?

The US is not going to make it illegal. Get used to it and move on!

The obsession with homosexuals on CAF is going beyond the absurd.

 

[livingwordunity]

BMC Public Health. 2006 May 8;6:127.

The health of people classified as lesbian, gay and bisexual attending family practitioners in London: a controlled study.

King M, Nazareth I.

Department of Primary Care and Population Sciences, Royal Free and University College Medical School, University College London (UCL), Rowland Hill Street, London NW3 2PF, UK. m.king@medsch.ucl.ac.uk

BACKGROUND: The morbidity of gay, lesbian or bisexual people attending family practice has not been previously assessed. We compared health measures of family practice attendees classified as lesbian, gay and bisexual.

METHODS: We conducted a cross-sectional, controlled study conducted in 13 London family practices and compared the responses of 26 lesbian and 85 bisexual classified women, with that of 934 heterosexual classified women and 38 gay and 23 bisexual classified men with that of 373 heterosexual classified men. Our outcomes of interest were: General health questionnaire; CAGE questionnaire; short form12; smoking status; sexual experiences during childhood; number of sexual partners and sexual function and satisfaction.

RESULTS: In comparison to people classified as heterosexuals: men classified as gay reported higher levels of psychological symptoms (OR 2.48, CI 1.05-5.90); women classified as bisexual were more likely to misuse alcohol (OR 2.73, 1.70-4.40); women classified as bisexual (OR 2.53, 1.60-4.00) and lesbian (OR 3.13, 1.41-6.97) and men classified as bisexual (OR 2.48, 1,04, 5.86) were more likely to be smokers and women classified as bisexual (OR 3.27, 1.97-5.43) and men classified as gay (OR 4.86, 2.28-10.34) were much more likely to report childhood sexual experiences in childhood. Psychological distress was associated with reporting sexual experiences in childhood in men classified as gay and bisexual and women classified as heterosexual. Men classified as bisexual (OR 5.00, 1.73-14.51) and women classified as bisexual (OR 2.88, 1.24- 6.56) were more likely than heterosexuals to report more than one sexual partner in the preceding four weeks. Lesbian, gay and bisexual classified people encountered no more sexual function problems than heterosexuals but men classified as bisexual (OR 2.74, 1.12-6.70) were more dissatisfied with their sex lives.

CONCLUSION: Bisexual and lesbian classified people attending London general practices were more likely to be smokers and gay classified men were at increased risk of psychological distress in comparison to heterosexual classified people. Increased awareness of the sexuality of people seen in primary care can provide opportunities for health promotion.

Source:
The health of people classified as lesbian, gay and bisexual attending family practitioners in London: a controlled study

 

[Fairwinds]

Hasn’t this horse finally been beaten to death?

The US is not going to make it illegal. Get used to it and move on!

The obsession with homosexuals on CAF is going beyond the absurd.

its kind of an unhealthy obsession, according to clinical studies.

 

[fix]

Hasn’t this horse finally been beaten to death?

The US is not going to make it illegal. Get used to it and move on!

The obsession with homosexuals on CAF is going beyond the absurd.

Why do the “gay” apologists keep replying?

 

[Fairwinds]

Why do the “gay” apologists keep replying?

who are the gay apologists?

 

[fix]

who are the gay apologists?

Those that defend “gay” behavior as acceptable.

 

[livingwordunity]

Those that defend “gay” behavior as acceptable.

Everywhere one goes outside of CAF homosexual behavior is being trumpeted as “the new normal” as if there are no dangers associated with the behavior as if there is no difference between this behavior and what heterosexual couples do. But the studies and statistics, even from left-leaning sources, consistently show that the opposite is true. Homosexual behavior not only puts one in serious spiritual danger, it’s also something that is a serious public health matter.

“Disparities in HIV infection also exist between gay and bisexual men and heterosexual populations. Recently, the CDC announced that gay and bisexual men in the United States are 44 to 86 times more likely to become infected with HIV than heterosexual men, and 40 to 77 times more likely to become infected than women.” – Obama

“Given the starkness and the enduring nature of the disparate impact on gay and bisexual men, it is important to significantly reprioritize resources and attention on this community. The United States cannot reduce the number of HIV infections nationally without better addressing HIV among gay and bisexual men…Even though gay and bisexual men comprise only two percent of the U.S. population (4 percent of men)” – Obama (bold emphasis given in Obama’s 2010 Whitehouse report)

Source:
President Obama’s National HIV/AIDS Strategy for the the the United States 2010 White House Report

 

[Fairwinds]

Those that defend “gay” behavior as acceptable.

good, it seemed you were accusing someone of being gay.

I don’t see anyone here defending gay behavior as acceptable.

 

[fix]

good, it seemed you were accusing someone of being gay.

I don’t see anyone here defending gay behavior as acceptable.

I would include those who claim the Church has no business in influencing the culture including those who self identify as Catholic yet support homosexual unions and other unnatural activities.

 

[InSearchofGrace]

I would include those who claim the Church has no business in influencing the culture including those who self identify as Catholic yet support homosexual unions and other unnatural activities.

,

 

[Elizabeth502]

I would include those who claim the Church has no business in influencing the culture including those who self identify as Catholic yet support homosexual unions and other unnatural activities.

 

[CopticChristian]

I didn’t say that though, did I? I proposed a scenario where such a professional might deal only with men. Nowhere did I say that proctology was in any way a gender specific speciality.

I agree… people should use their brains and not be promiscuous. But that wasn’t the point and again I’m certain you know it. The point was the prevention of transmission of disease amongst people who are promiscuous. Even His Holiness Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI knows what I’m going on about… I’m sure you do too. You’re just being deliberately obtuse again.

One would assume that a female proctologist would be more suitable for female patients in any case and a male proctologist for male patients, on the basis of decorum and patient comfort.

:nope:

You assume incorrectly. I wish you would convince yourself to stop putting forth information, opinions and thoughts about the practice of medicine or psychology…

• There are approximately 160,000 surgeons in the United States: only 19 percent are women, 30,400 women are surgeons

Consult the American College of Surgeons website report

acshpri.org/documents/ACSHPRI_Surgical_Workforce_in_US_apr2010.pdf

On page 25 of this document you will see the number of Proctologists and the number of Proctologists that are female…

So with 30, 400 surgeons there are

1357 total colorectal surgeons, with 222 being female, women represent 16% colorectal surgeons.

Now with so few women in surgery and so few women in colorectal surgery how would it be possible to make this scenario possible?

 

[CopticChristian]

Hasn’t this horse finally been beaten to death?

The US is not going to make it illegal. Get used to it and move on!

The obsession with homosexuals on CAF is going beyond the absurd.

If the horse is dead, asking others to get used to it and move on, claiming an obsession, then what is the obsession with suggesting that the horse is dead and move on, vote with your feet and move one.

 

[CopticChristian]

good, it seemed you were accusing someone of being gay.

I don’t see anyone here defending gay behavior as acceptable.

What would you say to a statement like this…

Homosexuals can be promisuous. It would be reasonable to promote the use of condoms in this population, as a device that does a reasonable job at preventing a promiscuous homosexual from spreading disease.

Should Catholics promote the use of Condoms in Homosexuals that are sexually active and promiscuous?

 

[Julianna]

I would include those who claim the Church has no business in influencing the culture including those who self identify as Catholic yet support homosexual unions and other unnatural activities.

The Church has no business “influencing” the culture. Wow, talk about twisting my words.

Bottom line, the US is not going to make homosexual acts, or homosexuals illegal. You want a theocracy, move to Iran, I understand stand burkha one size fits all.

The Church says it’s wrong…this is the horse that has been beaten to death. What is there left?

The Church says “NO WAY”, I believe everyone who has posted on here, “get’s it”.

Gay apologist…yeah, that’s a good good one…

Go placidly amid the noise and haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story. Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit. If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain and bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself. Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans. Keep interested in your own career, however humble; it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time. Exercise caution in your business affairs; for the world is full of trickery. But let this not blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strive for high ideals; and everywhere life is full of heroism. Be yourself. Especially, do not feign affection. Neither be cynical about love; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment it is as perennial as the grass. Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth. Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul. ***With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. ***Be cheerful. Strive to be happy.

 

[CopticChristian]

The Church has no business “influencing” the culture. Wow, talk about twisting my words.

Bottom line, the US is not going to make homosexual acts, or homosexuals illegal. You want a theocracy, move to Iran, I understand stand burkha one size fits all.

The Church says it’s wrong…this is the horse that has been beaten to death. What is there left?

The Church says “NO WAY”, I believe everyone who has posted on here, “get’s it”.

Gay apologist…yeah, that’s a good good one…

Go placidly amid the noise and haste, and remember what peace there may be in silence. As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with all persons. Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story. Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit. If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain and bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself. Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans. Keep interested in your own career, however humble; it is a real possession in the changing fortunes of time. Exercise caution in your business affairs; for the world is full of trickery. But let this not blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strive for high ideals; and everywhere life is full of heroism. Be yourself. Especially, do not feign affection. Neither be cynical about love; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment it is as perennial as the grass. Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth. Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many fears are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself. You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul. ***With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. ***Be cheerful. Strive to be happy.

So many words for a horse that is dead. You probably have a talent for eulogies absent an attempt at humor

 

[Julianna]

So many words for a horse that is dead. You probably have a talent for eulogies absent an attempt at humor

honey, you aren’t worth a confession, don’t flatter yourself.

I hope the mods close this thread.

 

[CopticChristian]

I hope the mods close this thread.

honey,

I do appreciate endearment and we hardly interact and I am sure that we know little of each other.

you aren’t worth a confession,

Now I am confused. Endearment and then degradation. Please understand that I am not a person that allows someone to degrade me. I have boundaries. This may cause me to be angry with you.

don’t flatter yourself

I think well of myself. I am not prone to flattery. To be honest when someone flatters me what happens is that I roll my eyes and say awe cmon…like below…

.

aw cmon…

 

[sw85]

really? I expect laws against murder and rape to be rigorously enforced and I believe, without consulting the CCC, that this is in line with moral teaching. because these laws and the crimes they’re trying to permit are important. so if eradicating sodomy is that critical, then you want anti-sodomy laws enforced in the same way (which may involve snitches and police raids into private homes). or are you saying sodomy isn’t worth investigating and prosecuting unless it causes scandal? then its not all that important.

Yet laws against rape and murder are already enforced exactly the same way I’m saying sodomy laws typically have been. We use them to enact justice after the fact. Last I heard we don’t have a pre-crimes division, and you don’t typically hear about SWAT teams busting down doors looking for evidence of murders still being planned (unless there’s, like, really grave reason for them to suspect a murder is being planned).

Your last two sentences are a total non sequitur. Or rather the only way it isn’t is if you think scandal doesn’t exist or isn’t important. But it does exist and is important. The Church itself teaches that the state has the duty to protect and promote the common good, and that this includes protecting the moral sensibilities of society. Not even other goods (like religious liberty) can trump this; that’s straight out of Dignitatis Humanae.

So were pro-slavery laws.

The existence of laws prohibiting or allowing certain things in the past does not necessarily mean they were good laws.

There’s a key difference. Sodomy is always and everywhere a moral abomination. Slavery isn’t. Indeed for much of human history slavery was a rational and humane response to social circumstances, as I’ve argued elsewhere (e.g., here). Yes, the peculiarly virulent character it took on in the United States and Caribbean does not conform to any reasonable moral code, but then the situation of slavery in the US and Caribbean was not exactly normative historically speaking.

Slavery surely outlived its justification but that doesn’t mean there was never a justification for it. Have sodomy laws outlived theirs? If so, how?

Laws have no business involving themselves in the private sphere of morals where neither party is harmed or abused.

I don’t disagree here, in principle. In fact, as I said above, there is no reason for the state to deliberately seek trouble in matters like this. I envision sodomy laws being enforced after the fact to mitigate scandal.

But that’s just the thing: publicly-advertised sin does cause real harm to others. I can choose not to look at porn, for instance, but I cannot choose not to live in a society that’s been vulgarized by it.

How is this still considered a valid argument? Many civilizations considered laws punishing women for being witches justified. That doesn’t mean we should also consider those laws.

“Many”? Witch burnings are a historical anomaly that happen to coincide with the rise of Protestant sentiments in a small handful of Western nations and which died out right around the time they (i.e., those in thrall to Protestant sensibilities) started sliding into apostasy. An instinctive revulsion re: sodomy, on the other hand, appears to be a relatively uniform feature of the human condition with very few exceptions.

Now perhaps previous societies were wrong re: sodomy laws. Maybe they were wrong, too, about the sky being blue. All I’m saying is that when facing the consensus of history we maybe owe these sorts of considerations a little more thought than “oh, freedom of association, u idiot.”

I rather doubt those older civilizations had a realistic concept of disease or were aware of the facts about disease, let alone the health risks of sodomy.

I dunno why you’re talking to me about disease, etc. That’s lower on my list of concerns. I’m the one who wants sodomy punished in order to protect and promote a moral consensus.