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Irishmom2
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OP,
Where is your integrity leading you though?
Where is your integrity leading you though?
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EvangelistVictor
Guest
Where you going to go instead, if any church?
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WillPhillips
Guest
So my research is what led me to admit that I am unconvinced. I will of course remain open to new info but the justification is simply not convincing to me (in this instance). It’s not like I can choose to believe it anyway. Imagine trying to hold a belief in something you find unconvincing. Does that make sense? …and so then follows the discussion above about what Canon Law states about this…the requirement for definitive belief/being in opposition to the Church etc.WillPhillips:
This is the part we are having such a hard time understanding. If you are having doubts or are misunderstanding something, then why not research and learn more until you do understand why the Church teaches it.
To your other points, I don’t see myself as abandoning or stopping questioning at all. Quite the contrary. If anything, I’d say I’m abandoning my ignorance or lack of integrity surrounding the situation. I’d say I’m attempting honesty and personal accountability. And as I mentioned before, I hope to continue to ask questions…to remain openminded.
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Irishmom2
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OP, are you a cradle Catholic or a convert to Catholicism?
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WillPhillips
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Not sure. But wherever I’d have no reason to stop utilizing my values of empathy, compassion, fairness, and honesty.
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WillPhillips
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Curious (to me) question. But, cradle Catholic. I’d be the first in a very large Catholic family to leave. Two first cousins are priests and my father was a seminarian for many years. Grew up very involved in the Church (school, retreats, alter server, etc).
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Irishmom2
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It still seems a bit shocking to me that you are leaving, I was half expecting you to say recent convert, that’s why I asked.
I think it is hard for some of us, and your family will most likely agree, to understand how this happens after so long, that all.
I think it is hard for some of us, and your family will most likely agree, to understand how this happens after so long, that all.
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WillPhillips
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Ah, got it. And yes, to say it will be hard for my family to understand, is an understatement for sure…
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Cruciferi
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Irishmom2
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Well, I hope you will still hang around here at CAF. Even if there are parts of Catholicism you don’t agree with, I bet you could still discuss things as well as everyone else. You may offer a different take on things.
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EvangelistVictor
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That’s a very great and blessed heritage. I know for my life, I had to step away from the Evangelical/Pentecostal church also for 10 years. I wanted to be a Pastor, even getting a MA in Theology. But like you, I didn’t agree with alot of their theology.
It was like being in a desert during this time. I still had faith in God, but no church home to go to. I felt really lost in life. I’d pray, and ask God where can I go that holds my theological views.
Little did I know God was speaking to me in dreams. I’d have dreams of being in a Catholic Church over and over again. I would brush off those dreams as just weird, since I didn’t hold to its views on praying to Mary and the Saints, and Purgatory, and tradition.
In a turn of events I started listening to Catholic Answers on EWTN radio after getting a new car with Satellite radio that each day God would speak to me on the shows explaining those views. The final nail on the coffin was what I had already learned and studied in Seminary in accepting the CC as being founded by the Apostles, and still Christ Church on earth today, 2000 years latter.
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guanophore
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This is great Will, but as you can see, submission of intellect and will does not equate to “Believing something I am not convinced of”. It just means …\
- You accept that the CC is the one founded by Christ
- Jesus gave His teaching authority to His Church
- if there are teachings you don’t understand you can say what Peter did- Lord, to whom shall we go, you have the words of eternal life.
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guanophore
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What seems to be the trouble, Will?
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WillPhillips
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Haha. Yes, I think it is.
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WillPhillips
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Yes, that’s the analogy. I’ve realized/determined/acknowledged my “lack of qualification” and am looking to disclose that fact.WillPhillips:
I’m not familiar with qual card, but I guess you mean that if you discovered that you were not qualified (because something was missing), you would be required to disclose it to the appropriate authority.
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WillPhillips
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Perhaps not trouble per se but more an acknowledgement of canon law, and coming to terms with my “opposition to the Church”WillPhillips:
What seems to be the trouble, Will?
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_P2H.HTM
Can. 750
§1. A person must believe …
§2. …therefore, one who rejects those propositions which are to be held definitively is opposed to the doctrine of the Catholic Church.
Can. 752
…a religious submission of the intellect and will must be given to a doctrine … concerning faith or morals …
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TheLittleLady
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“Lord, I believe. Help my unbelief.”
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WillPhillips
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I appreciate your concern for me.
As with the responses above, I think your reply reiterates my current interpretation. That non-belief of any church doctrine (moral or theological) is incompatible with being a Catholic. The only recourse is to believe.
As with the responses above, I think your reply reiterates my current interpretation. That non-belief of any church doctrine (moral or theological) is incompatible with being a Catholic. The only recourse is to believe.
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TheLittleLady
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No, it is that we are encouraged by Scripture to pray and study when we do not believe.
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WillPhillips
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Hmmm. Agree we’re encouraged to study and pray. I’m simply coming to the realization of what Canon Law states about required belief in doctrine.
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