Should I feel guilty about my musical tastes?

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For this reason, though I think that Nietzsche is probably one of the worst philosophers of all time, he’ll always be a better writer than…say…St. Thomas Aquinas, who was a much better philosopher than Nietzsche. The sound of the German in Nietzsche’s writing is apparently beautiful, whereas St. Thomas Aquinas wasn’t writing for the sake of beauty (obviously, this doesn’t hold true of St. Thomas Aquinas’ hymns).
German? Beautiful?

As Emperor Charlie the fifth said,

“I speak Spanish to God, Italian to women, French to men, and German to my horse.”
 
German? Beautiful?

As Emperor Charlie the fifth said,

“I speak Spanish to God, Italian to women, French to men, and German to my horse.”
That’s a great line. I’ll have to be sure to remember it.

ChadS
 
Ok. Before I say anything about the music I listen to, I want to point out that I am, in fact, a philosophy student, and when I view music, I generally view it as a philosophy student.

For me, the beauty of music is in harmony, proportion, melody, etc. For me, music is an arrangement of sounds which are designed to be delightful to the ear. For this reason, I am highly sympathetic to those who love Classical music. I can see why that would be the case.

Generally speaking, it’s the music that delights me, and lyrics for me are entirely secondary. The best that singing can achieve in a song is not lyrical content, but the actual sound of the singing.

For this reason, though I think that Nietzsche is probably one of the worst philosophers of all time, he’ll always be a better writer than…say…St. Thomas Aquinas, who was a much better philosopher than Nietzsche. The sound of the German in Nietzsche’s writing is apparently beautiful, whereas St. Thomas Aquinas wasn’t writing for the sake of beauty (obviously, this doesn’t hold true of St. Thomas Aquinas’ hymns).

For this reason, for example, I think that those people who think that Wagnerian Operas should be translated from the original language are absolutely misguided.

On that note, I love “church music.” Gregorian chant delights me. Even a lot of the modern hymns are beautiful to me (for example, the hymn “Holy Darkness”). Yet, I completely despise modern Christian music (gospel music, “Christian rock,” etc…). “Christian music” for me is a code name for “unoriginal, repetitive, boring, poorly written nonsense.”

No. I prefer bands like Metallica, Megadeth, Slayer, Kreator, etc. These are bands that actually write songs that sound amazing. They write songs that actually require musical skill to write. Unfortunately…herein lies my dilemma:

I don’t think that anyone is going to deny that the first minute of this song is absolutely breath taking. Anyone who likes thrash metal will agree that the entire song (music only, lyrics and vocals aside) absolutely rocks.

But then, we have the lyrics…which ultimately end like so:

Same with this song. The musicianship is amazing. The guitars are fantastic! Truly, the words of Leibniz are not to be doubted here when he says (and I might be paraphrasing) “Music is the joy the soul apprehends when it counts, not knowing that it counts.”

Yet, we have the lyrics!

Here is a cool song by Slayer…that drips with anti-Christian imagery:

I dont’ know. I try to stave off the guilt by telling myself that the lyrics are all metaphorical, and are more social commentary (in the Nietzchean sense) than anything. That even if these bands are atheist or whatever, that they probably aren’t entirely “anti Christian,” so to speak. And I think that’s the feeling that you’d get in an interview with…say…Kreator:

Source.

I don’t know. What do y’all think?
I’d still stay away from it… you keep feeding your brain that kind of stuff its eventually gonna get to you.

Trust me man theres far better music out there

Your brother in Christ,
Zachary
 
If you’re feeling guilty about it, then there’s something you need to investigate.
i agree, one must find the root and discern. i think your decisions will grow as you grow spiritually. i once listened to only rap and hip hop, because it related to the state of my soul. now i listen to all Christian music, from rock to praise, and love Gregorian Chant. over time i started to weed out even those which i felt were not appropriate as far as Catholic teaching.

there was an episode the other day on Life On the Rock on EWTN, and they talked about how powerful music is and how it really stirs the soul. it was created by God for us, so use it for God as best you can.

trust God, take your time, continue to grow spiritually everyday, and the music will follow. don’t worry too much about others’ opinions, but trust in God to lead you and you can peacefully enjoy the music that brings you closer to Him. if He wants to change your playlist, let Him do it for you!
 
Schol17,

First of all, it’s very exciting. The fact that you’re asking the question shows the Holy Spirit it tugging at your heart. Otherwise the lyrics wouldn’t bother you a bit. I was also like you and listened to a lot of punk and rock music. DK, TSOL, Oingo, Black Flag, Doors, Zep, etc. Once I started really hearing the lyrics, I started to ask the same question.

1Corthians 6:12 starts by saying “Everything is permissible for me - but not everything is beneficial”. 1Corth 6:19 says “Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body”. Paul clearly states these are general comments.

What I found was this music was just like junk food. I loved it, it pumped me up and I was able to separate the lyrics from my life BUT it didn’t give me any value. It didn’t help strenghten my relationship w/ God and the more I would hear the lyrics, the more they would bother me.

Not all Christian music is as you say. That’s the same as me saying all heavy metal is the same. There is a lot of great Christian music (and not the same “lift Him on high”).

Listen to U2. A majority of their albums have Christian lyrics/themes. Pillar, POD, Judah First are heavy metal Christian music. If you get into lyrics, try Jars of Clay, Nicole Nordeman, Margaret Becker. Try Nicole C. Mullens for an upbeat hip-hop flavor. DC Talk and Newsboys have been out forever. Mercy Me, Pillar, Switchfoot, Kutless, etc.

If you start to fill yourself w/ something that will build yourself up, you’ll start to see the difference (obviously not overnight though).

God Bless.
 
Sorry, I haven’t read all the posts.

I’m a pretty down to earth person. But here is my philosophy.

If a musician doesn’t want you to listen to his lyrics, he would not go to the trouble to write them. His lyrics are either from his heart or to tell a story, like poetry or writing. He (or she) sits down and pours his feelings and thoughts onto a piece of paper. If you have ever gotten alone and written down your deepest feelings and thoughts, you know how it feels to get them out and on paper. A musician can put those thoughts and feelings to music and give them life. If he didn’t want them to live along with his music he would write and play the music alone and write a compliation of his thoughts and feelings within a book or a collection of poetry. It’s obvious that these musicians you’ve mentioned went to a great deal of effort with both the lyrics and the music. To separate them and ignore what the lyrics are expressing is the same as taking away one of the instruments (guitar, perhaps) and what it is expressing.

Here is a quote from your OP.

“The best that singing can achieve in a song is not lyrical content, but the actual sound of the singing.”

It would be more true to say that the best that singing can achieve in a song is emotion and the ability to touch another’s soul. That comes from both the expression of the music and the expression of the lyrics. Some singers just sing the music and some do extraordinary things with their voice and the music, but that doesn’t mean anything unless there is emotion behind it. In fact, the music sounds better with a singer who not only makes wonderful sound but conveys the lyrics well through emotion and phrasing.

Okay, those are my thoughts.

Now, your topic line question. Should you feel guilty? If you feel the least bit guilty, you should listen to those feelings and explore why. Guilt is a signal from your conscience telling you that something is wrong. Don’t just push it away, accept the guilty feelings and go on, or ponder it and create a philosophical outlook regarding it.

You aren’t ignoring the lyrics to these songs. You know what they are and what they mean. They came out of the songwriters’ mind. In my opinion, you know darn well what is going on and what to do. You can use philophosy and logic to rationalize continuing to listen to this if you want or you can make a decision to change. There are Christian bands that play the same sort of music, but with different types of lyrics. Like I said, I’m down to earth. So…you are either with Him or against Him.
 
I don’t think it’s true that all lyricists pour their hearts into their songs.

Take a band like Faith No More for instance, amazing music, but the lyrics are usually meaningless. Mike Patton (their singer) has said that he doesn’t care much about the lyrics, and he just uses whatever words will best suit the melody/rhythm of the vocals.

Many singers like lyrics take the backseat to the music.

On a different note, not all metal is violent and full of obscene lyrics.

I suggest for anyone to check out the band Between The Buried And Me. They have a very heavy sound, but their lyrics have nothing to do with satan, death, etc… They’re lyrics are actually very thoughtful and well written. Their singer screams and growls, but he is also amazing at clean singing. The whole band is amazing at their instruments.

They use Death Metal as a base for their music, but they incorporate every style imaginable, from jazz to classical to ballads, and everything in between.

Here’s a great song. If you don’t like the heavy growling, than skip to about 2:30 where they suddenly switch into a soft and pretty mood. It’s incredible.youtube.com/watch?v=KFze65yQhgY

I should also add, that song is an older one of their’s, and now they’ve actually diversified their sound a lot more.

Here’s a video of them in the studio recording their latest record youtube.com/watch?v=uREa-9o2ylE
 
This thread caught my eye because I too enjoy metal music from time to time. Although, personally, I prefer bands like Bury Your Dead, Every Time I Die, Casey Jones and Norma Jean (pp mentioned BTB&M - another 👍 ) to Slayer. Sometimes I get in an Atreyu mood and find myself singing along to lyrics about vampires, or I’ll listen to Alkaline Trio and walk around the house humming “This Could Be Love”

azlyrics.com/lyrics/alkalinetrio/thiscouldbelove.html

Now I probably wouldn’t want to sing that at Mass, but I don’t think there’s anything inherently bad about liking the melody of the song. Alkaline Trio is mostly laughable - I’m not taking the lyrics to heart. You, however, have indicated that you feel guilty about the lyrics so you should probably explore that. Maybe (as a pp suggested) you should explore other metal bands with less intense lyrics? There’s tons of bands out there - if you’re anywhere near a metro or college area, I’m sure you’ll find more options.

–
 
Hi everyone,
I listed to metal for about 5 years of my life; from sophomore year in high school up until junior year in college. I justified it by being selective on a per song basis so I didn’t listen to anything (what I believed to be overtly) anti-Christian. Metallica, Megadeth, Black Sabbath, and Led Zeppelin were among my favorites. My mom never liked it that I listened to the thrashier stuff and people from my church warned me about the subliminal messages. I thought I was alright.

It wasn’t until junior year in college that I began to notice the [negative] way the music affected me. What ever the emotion, I had a song popping in my head for it. That may not be bad in of itself, but I was beginning to see how much of a hold it had on my life. If one analyzed my thoughts, one would think that music was a religion of mine. Much of my music was heavy metal and nearly always on the angrier side. So nearly all emotions could usually get to anger. Emotion–>Song–>probably anger or a derivative there of.

Also, it was all so sensual; by this I mean it was meant to capture the senses. It was so tribal, so ecstatic. I get into a riff and treat it, whether knowing it or not, like an escape from reality. The music was like a drug. I had someone explain it to me like so: Those people that go to raves dancing with their eyes closed as if intoxicated by the trance atmosphere are in a sense high. Light show for the eyes, sound for the ears, all the senses ready to be pleased. I never thought that techno and metal had stuff like that in common, but they do. Head banging in unison, feeling the vibrations of the sound when it’s cranked up all the way, seeing the larger than life artists do their gig. It was music for the sake of music (or the sake of an emotion, a mental state, a pleasure in the bad sense), not for the sake of God. All things should be foremost/primarily for God.

I thought that much of it was composed really well. My favorite song was Orion by Metallica. I justified it, the metal, by saying that it was like classical music and classical music doesn’t sound unGodly. It couldn’t be that bad, right? Not all inspiration comes from God; *Satan *can do stuff too; *he *likes to deceive and confuse. The music was still capturing my senses, memories, and thought processes [in the bad way].

It was also means to an end of feeling in control (I say this now looking back at how I was; I didn’t really think I did it for these reasons, or if I did, then not overtly). If I can get angry and have it, the anger, cycle through a song, it was like I could put it in a spot I wanted it~I could direct the anger. I would somewhat believe that the anger is justified. The anger I held was unnecessary. God wants us to be happy. There may be a time to be angry, but not how much the amount of time it surfaced in me. I would call myself, at that time, a calm person, but relative to the state of being I could be and am now in, I would call myself excessively angry back then.

I was getting tired of reverting to my metal for motivation and anger seemed to be the principal emotion behind most of it. I began getting into classical music, especially the 2nd half of my junior year in college. I didn’t denounce anything I used to listen to, I just didn’t want a song attached to every feeling, or if I heard something similar to a riff, solo, or lyrics, a song would pop into my head, which was usually angry. Anything with angry lyrics was the first thing I avoided. I was still noticing that even listening to a band like Apocalyptica, it would still revert me to the adrenaline pumping anger that I felt when listening to the old metal. Then angry riffs/solos. This may seem like it is all subjective, and before this revelation to me, I would have thought so too, but* there is an objective Truth on what glorifies God and what doesn’t*. I was in the flip-flop stage at this point on trying to figure *that *out.

I threw out nearly all of my old metal for a totally unrelated reason (God was helping me in the right direction, whether I knew it or not). This helped me expand on other types of music. I even stopped listening to bands that conduct themselves poorly or have immoral album art.

continued…
 
The summer before my senior year in college, I was really challenged on the type of music I listened to. Everything I do must be for the glory of God. If I am not glorifying God, then what am I wasting my time doing? Why am I supporting people who do not glorify God? Why am I allowing this escapism from God via my metal songs? It really hit me then what a waste of time listening to metal was. I was then introduced to a Catholic artist, Matt Maher. The first time, he seemed a bit cheesy, but I was strangely drawn to it. After several, maybe several dozens of times of listening to 2 out of his 50 songs, I was hooked. I then threw out the rest of my metal. I knew that if the music wasn’t for God, then Satan had room to mess with it. Orion may not be that bad of a song, but what will help me more spiritually, “Orion” by Metallica, or “I Love You, Lord” by Matt Maher?

You can apply this to anything: books, magazines, TV, movies, etc. Be prudent, but in our day and age, the vast majority of media, especially mainstream (and I would consider metal mainstream) is not glorifying God.

Guilt and lack of peace in my mind were some things I felt more and more with all the unnecessary anger back in the day~it helped drive me towards finding something better, and ultimately, God intervened and set me on the right path. I can tell you with 100% confidence that switching music tastes was one of the foremost things that helped me get into a relationship with Jesus. Always reach for something better. If your music corrupts, if it can’t be played in public, then you may be right for feeling guilty. Take a step back and look at how it affects you, the people around you, and especially your relationship with Jesus–is it a block to your path to holiness? Would you listen to it with Jesus? I hope this helps you in your dilemma. I’ll be praying for you.
 
In case anyone here doesn’t know. There are Christian Metal bands out there. Such as The Devil Wears Prada youtube.com/watch?v=ufN6olJ3P8s

I remember when I saw them open for Protest The Hero, they were talking a lot about their love for Jesus and such in between songs. They were preaching to the wrong crowd of people, but it was admirable.

I’m just mentioning this because it seems like some on here think that Metal music is a pretty one dimensional thing, when in fact it’s arguably the most diverse style of music. The amount of sub-genres in Metal are insane, so it’s impossible to say that it’s all evil and bad.
 
In case anyone here doesn’t know. There are Christian Metal bands out there. Such as The Devil Wears Prada youtube.com/watch?v=ufN6olJ3P8s

I remember when I saw them open for Protest The Hero, they were talking a lot about their love for Jesus and such in between songs. They were preaching to the wrong crowd of people, but it was admirable.

I’m just mentioning this because it seems like some on here think that Metal music is a pretty one dimensional thing, when in fact it’s arguably the most diverse style of music. The amount of sub-genres in Metal are insane, so it’s impossible to say that it’s all evil and bad.
Hobble,
I agree that metal is very diverse. I do agree that saying it is all evil is impossible. But, the vast mojority is not “good”. you can have moral and immoral. If it seems amoral, it’s probably immoral. I’ve heard of beautiful metal songs, but screaming, the [excessive] anger, the everything that isn’t showing the Gospels, that’s not good. I agree metal is not one dimensional, but I would call it a 3-dimensional cone that nearly all songs funnel towards something that is not spiritually helpful.
 
Hobble,
I agree that metal is very diverse. I do agree that saying it is all evil is impossible. But, the vast mojority is not “good”. you can have moral and immoral. If it seems amoral, it’s probably immoral. I’ve heard of beautiful metal songs, but screaming, the [excessive] anger, the everything that isn’t showing the Gospels, that’s not good. I agree metal is not one dimensional, but I would call it a 3-dimensional cone that nearly all songs funnel towards something that is not spiritually helpful.
That’s an interesting idea.

Although personally I’ve never really thought of screaming as an angry thing. I think of it more as a natural distortion for the voice, just like distortion for a guitar. Like the band I mentioned before Between The Buried And Me, the screamer growls but he is rarely conveying an angry mood. I don’t know how to explain it, but I like trying to find beauty in chaos when it comes to music, so things like screaming to me don’t seem angry, it’s just using another dimension of the voice if that makes sense. It ventures past the 12 tones of western music and uses many harmonic and dissonant tones, which I find refreshing.
 
Would you listen to it with Jesus?
I apologize in advance for fixating on what is surely a minor point in your post. 😉

But, the “Would you do such-and-such with Jesus in the room” argument has always irked me. I think Jimmy Akin spells it out pretty well:
If you try to imagine Jesus in the room as a test for whether it’s okay to do something then one of two things will happen:
  • You will become scrupulous because you will conclude that an awful lot of things are not okay which in fact are okay (e.g., “I wouldn’t snarf down a Big Mac while bopping to secular music on my iPod during Eucharistic exposition, therefore I should never do those things”).
  • You will become irreverent by concluding that things that are okay to do in general must therefore be okay to do when in the immediate presence of Infinite Holiness Incarnate (e.g., “It’s okay for me to snarf down a Big Mac while bouncing my head back and forth as I listen to secular music on my iPod in general, therefore that’s perfectly okay for me to do that during Eucharistic exposition”).
The “Would you do it with Jesus in the room?” test thus strikes me as a bad tool to use for making such decisions. It either will force us to scrupulosity or irreverence–or both.
I think some people probably do need to avoid metal music. If it makes you angry all the time, that would be a good reason to stay away. But it doesn’t have that effect on everyone.

If we limit ourselves to only art produced by those who have lived exemplary lives, we are placing unnecessary limitations on ourselves. You’d have very little poetry to choose from as the majority of poets were either homosexual, committed suicide, or both. 😉

I understand your point. We don’t want to give the impression that we condone a lifestyle that is immoral, but we need to be careful as well. We cannot possibly know the sins of all those who make music or other art. We don’t need to. And even if an artist is leading a horrible lifestyle at one point in time, doesn’t mean that they don’t change (Dave Mustaine of Megadeth kicked his addiction habits and went clean, for example).

Of course, we all need to do what’s best for our relationship with God. If that means pitching certain music, then by all means do it. But that doesn’t mean that every Christian needs to follow that same path.
 
Ditto^^ Ultimately I’d say it depends on your intentions, and the effect you let the lyrics have on your life. But those lyrics don’t glorify God. they kinda go the opposite way…
In case anyone here doesn’t know. There are Christian Metal bands out there. Such as The Devil Wears Prada youtube.com/watch?v=ufN6olJ3P8s
yes!

Personally I like a little Demon Hunter, Disciple, Project 86, etc in my musical diet. I tend to lean more towards the softer stuff though. Skillet’s my fav.

ooh and I’m a huge fan of the lyrics to “Dive” by Disciple
Sometimes it gets hard upon this beaten road
Sometimes I am tempted just to walk alone
But I hear your words out of my mouth
Wanting, expecting that
The seeds that I’ve sown this time
I’ll reap in a short while
I’ll run and not grow weak
Walk and will not faint
Climb the highest mountain to dive off
And I’ll fly high on broken wings
All I desire is everything that you are
Strength is renewed as I wait on you God
 
I think some people probably do need to avoid metal music. If it makes you angry all the time, that would be a good reason to stay away. But it doesn’t have that effect on everyone.
I agree, though it should be mentioned that if a song, movie, video game, etc. is leading you to do evil, you should probably see a counselor. I don’t buy the “Music can play with your subconscious mind and make you do evil things” argument.
 
I agree, though it should be mentioned that if a song, movie, video game, etc. is leading you to do evil, you should probably see a counselor. I don’t buy the “Music can play with your subconscious mind and make you do evil things” argument.
Exactly. I guess sometimes it’s easier to blame the external factors rather than the internal ones. Remember, it’s not what goes into a man that defiles him, but what comes out of a man that defiles him. I think someone famous said that once, but I can’t remember who… 😉
 
You have the responsibility to know the content of what you’re listening to, which you seem to know very well. 😉

The next step is to train yourself to resist negative songs all together- even if they sound amazing. There’s good and evil in all forms of art. Just because something is categorized as art doesn’t automatically make it moraly acceptable- even if it’s “great” art.

It seems to me that God is speaking to you through your conscience- take some quiet time to listen to Him (without any music in the background.) There lies great value is silence.

Gods Peace & Love be with you always,
Mariah
 
I don’t think that this music is healthy for you. I used to listen to Metallica and things like that and I don’t think it was healthy for me. Generally the further I got away from it the less musically appealing I found it, and the more I began to feel that it I was feeding off of the garbage of American pop-culture. I honestly don’t think there is alot of virtuosity in this music. I find it less beautiful than ever.
 
I don’t think that this music is healthy for you. I used to listen to Metallica and things like that and I don’t think it was healthy for me. Generally the further I got away from it the less musically appealing I found it, and the more I began to feel that it I was feeding off of the garbage of American pop-culture. I honestly don’t think there is alot of virtuosity in this music. I find it less beautiful than ever.
Well, that’s probably more because Metallica is terrible, if people are going to listen to metal it should be good metal.
 
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