Should I go?

[Mockingjay]

I could use some prayers and support. I have been estranged from my father for many years. Recently I heard that he is in poor health and could die. The estrangement happened so long ago, I broke away from him out of a home with really bad problems, things happened that he will never admit to, horrible things; and I spent many years healing and moving on from the things that happened. I did what I could, I made a new life… without him. My life changed and improved and I was able to find peace and happiness at last but am now suddenly faced with the possibility of going to his funeral. I have no feelings for him, he has been out of my life for so long that all I can think of when it comes to him is his absence which was better than his presence. The best way I can describe it is with him, I was dying. Without him, I was able to live. All I ever see in him is the monster. I don’t want to go to his funeral… and this alarms me. I am numb to having any feelings at all towards him, I don’t even remember his voice unless it was screaming. That is what all this time has reduced him to in my memory. And I know if I do go, there will be problems from other family members… if I don’t go, there will be problems from other family members. I forgave him years ago in my mind, but have never been able to tell him so, because he won’t even admit to the things he did in the first place. What should I do? Should I go? Or should I let him go?

 

[R_C]

He is your father. God commanded us to honor our father. You should go.

And by the way, feelings do not matter much, if at all.

I believe it will mean a lot to Christ if out of humbleness and out of love for God, our heavenly Father, you pay your respects at your father’s grave, entrusting his soul to God’s mercy adorned with that forgiveness which may make a big difference in the eyes of the Divine Judge,

 

[maryjk]

I could use some prayers and support. I have been estranged from my father for many years. Recently I heard that he is in poor health and could die. The estrangement happened so long ago,** I broke away from him out of a home with really bad problems, things happened that he will never admit to, horrible things;** and I spent many years healing and moving on from the things that happened. I did what I could, I made a new life… without him. My life changed and improved and I was able to find peace and happiness at last but am now suddenly faced with the possibility of going to his funeral. I have no feelings for him, he has been out of my life for so long that all I can think of when it comes to him is his absence which was better than his presence. The best way I can describe it is with him, I was dying. Without him, I was able to live. All I ever see in him is the monster. I don’t want to go to his funeral… and this alarms me. I am numb to having any feelings at all towards him, **I don’t even remember his voice unless it was screaming. ** That is what all this time has reduced him to in my memory. And I know if I do go, there will be problems from other family members… if I don’t go, there will be problems from other family members. I forgave him years ago in my mind, but have never been able to tell him so, because he won’t even admit to the things he did in the first place. What should I do? Should I go? Or should I let him go?

It depends. It depends on how bad things were and how bad things will be if you show up.

He is your father. God commanded us to honor our father. You should go.

And by the way, feelings do not matter much, if at all.

I believe it will mean a lot to Christ if out of humbleness and out of love for God, our heavenly Father, you pay your respects at your father’s grave, entrusting his soul to God’s mercy adorned with that forgiveness which may make a big difference in the eyes of the Divine Judge,

Honor, yes. But that doesn’t mean we have to be a punching bag.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

I’m sorry you suffered so much. It is good that you have a good and happy life despite the sad circumstances in which you grew up.

Do you ever pray for your father? Perhaps you could do that - pray for his repentance before death and a peaceful death. Even if you don’t go to the funeral you could have a mass said for the repose of his soul. From what you have written you have no intention of going to see him before he dies. I wonder if going to the funeral makes any difference really. It would be just a gesture that other people would approve of. The real work of love and mercy to the unrepentant is praying for their soul.

I’ll pray that you find peace regarding this decision.

 

[UbiCaritas]

A little background: without going into explicit details, I too have decided to have no further contact with my parents unless their behavior changes radically for the better. This was not an easy decision, and was one that was made on the advice of an excellent confessor. He recommended that I pray for them, yes (something I still find terribly difficult to do) but that since they refused to respect perfectly reasonable boundaries (ie, as a previous poster mentioned, not using me as a punching bag) and since their presence in my life leads to nothing but hatred and deep spiritual turmoil, I should not maintain contact with them.

I am still learning to forgive them for the many terrible things they have done over the years. I suspect that this may take many more years. For now, all I can do is pray for them when I can. A previous poster said that feelings don’t matter; they may not to a certain extent, but you are also a precious child of God, and therefore should not allow yourself to be treated badly.

If I were you, I would not go. I would have a Mass or two said for my father, and when he died I would try to have a Mass said for him each year, and would ask that he be remembered during November (many parishes have lists of names of the dead which are placed on the altar during Masses during this month). I would not subject myself to further abuse, nor give him or the other family members a way in which to abuse me because I was in their presence. If some family members criticize your decision not to go (and I have run into this in the past in my situation), then state firmly that the decision is not up for discussion and change the subject. You are an adult, and your decisions are not subject to others’ criticisms except perhaps those of your spouse, depending on the decision in question.

 

[underacloud]

If your attendance at his funeral will cause issues for other family members, then that’s a good reason to stay away. A funeral is not the place for family disputes to come to a head.

If your attendance at his funeral will cause yourself misery, then that’s a very good reason to stay away.

As others suggested, pray for him and have mass offered for him. That’s about the most loving thing you can do, and you will honour him as your father by doing so.

Have you thought about what you’ll do if your father asks to see you? People on their death beds often want to resolve these sorts of issues with family members. It may bring you both peace in this difficult time. Or it may cause even more distress. But think about it. I’ll pray for you to have the strength and wisdom to follow God’s plan in all of this.

 

[Jon_S_1]

I could use some prayers and support. I have been estranged from my father for many years. Recently I heard that he is in poor health and could die. The estrangement happened so long ago, I broke away from him out of a home with really bad problems, things happened that he will never admit to, horrible things; and I spent many years healing and moving on from the things that happened. I did what I could, I made a new life… without him. My life changed and improved and I was able to find peace and happiness at last but am now suddenly faced with the possibility of going to his funeral. I have no feelings for him, he has been out of my life for so long that all I can think of when it comes to him is his absence which was better than his presence. The best way I can describe it is with him, I was dying. Without him, I was able to live. All I ever see in him is the monster. I don’t want to go to his funeral… and this alarms me. I am numb to having any feelings at all towards him, I don’t even remember his voice unless it was screaming. That is what all this time has reduced him to in my memory. And I know if I do go, there will be problems from other family members… if I don’t go, there will be problems from other family members. I forgave him years ago in my mind, but have never been able to tell him so, because he won’t even admit to the things he did in the first place. What should I do? Should I go? Or should I let him go?

I can tell you have been very hurt and that you are torn on this issue. I give you much credit for seeking wisdom from others.

I strongly believe you should go.

This man is not in a place to harm you anymore (I don’t think), and you say you have forgiven him. Forgiveness is given even when the other person never acknowledges their sins against you. That doesn’t mean you forget what happens, it just means you choose for yourself to offer forgiveness despite the other person. It is a very big thing to do and it is what Christ did for us.

I think you should go and tell him you forgive him despite his repentance and accountability. That act alone could cause him to seek Christ in his last days, and could potentially save your father’s soul.

I also believe as a rule in these types of things, that you should err on the side of going and seeing the person. Once they are gone you will never have the chance and many people regret such actions later in life.

God Bless,

 

[TK421]

I think going to your father and to the funeral would be the right thing to do. If it causes grievances with certain families members, just be gracious to them and tell them that you wanted to pay your respects, regardless of whatever terrible past your father may have left behind. It might be extremely painful for you, but I believe you will come out stronger from it.

 

[Deus_tecum]

I don’t think you have an obligation to attend his funeral. It does not sound like you need to attend for your own sense of closure. He died to you as a true father many years ago, and that happened the first time he chose to abuse you. Forgiveness does not require anyone to accept abuse according to any Scripture I have read

 

[mommy_k]

I would attend the funeral mass, sit away from the people who will give you trouble, pray for your fathers soul and leave.
No need to go to the cemetery. You have done your duty as your fathers child this way. You do not have to go to the veiwing or wake if there is one. Under the circumstances this is what I would do.

 

[Mockingjay]

Thank you all. You have given me a lot to think about which is what I needed.

Will he ever speak to me again, I don’t know and I don’t think so. It’s a complex situation that has been going on for a very long time, with no easy answers and multiple attempts made to solve things only to run into the same stumbling block over and over again. The best way I can explain it is, because when I left home I got help and identified what he had done to me as abuse, and sought treatment for it, that instantly turned me into a family scapegoat. There are several family members who adamantly deny that he did anything and in fact… they and my father all demand (to this day) that I say I made it all up, that I renounce any help I got from professional therapist to get past the things he did. The demands that I turn around and say “I made it all up, everyone!” and that I deny any treatment I got, that is the stumbling block. And to them this is how I can “honor” him. And they also say “your feelings don’t matter” which is too convenient a way to excuse and allow my father’s behavior to continue.

When I read scriptures, I read the opposite… that you are dishonoring a person AND yourself by lying for their sake just to save their reputation, when they are or have done something evil.

There is also an element of several of the in-denial family members threatening me with violence over this. It is heartbreaking but it is what it is, and I am not going to lie for them to “make things okay” or “save our reputation.” People can say “feelings don’t matter” but feelings drive people to do things… like brawl at a funeral. I don’t want to be the focus of a funeral brawl nor do I want that kind of thing to happen to other family members who might be there. I like the idea of just going to the mass but perhaps a better way would be to attend mass here and pray for him that way, to avoid turmoil.

When it comes to my father, yes I forgive him but for the most part I feel very empty towards him. I feel like he is lost. That there is no hope for him. And this is the result of feelings such as hope, hoping for so long that he would change and then finally having to come to the realization that he won’t. He never will. He is what he is, and has given me no sign that he will be otherwise. I do still pray for him but I don’t know… I have lost so many feelings for him because he has been absent from my life for so long.

Thank you again for your advice. Like I said I have a lot to think about.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

Wow. That is all very disturbing. You have gone through a lot. My prayers are with you.

 

[McMcMe]

Abuse is unfortunately often a family disease. Continue to pray for your father and his repose. Honor his memory by having masses said for him and sending flowers to his funeral (anonymously if preferred). To put yourself in and among people who are threatening violence or verbally abusing you after all these years isn’t necessary. If you do choose to go to a funeral or visit your father on his deathbed, I’d do a quick in and out–and politely decline any offers to engage with hostile family members. Only you can know if this is feasible for you to do in a healthy way.

 

[Cupofkindness]

And by the way, feelings do not matter much, if at all.

This is generally false. Feelings matter and are given to us so that we know when something is good or bad for our souls, our hearts, and our minds.

To the OP, as the previous poster said, I would say that if there is anyway that you could visit your father on his deathbed, then a brief visit if you can afford the trip, is in order. He may have something he wants to tell you that you need to hear. Could you bring a friend or sympathetic family member with you?

It sounds like the funeral would be traumatic for you and others. Just send a floral arrangement, with the sentiment that you are praying for your father. You really don’t owe your relatives an explanation for your actions.

Where is your mother?

 

[Mockingjay]

If given the opportunity to visit him on his deathbed I would go (money is not a consideration). If it gave him even the remotest chance of trying to make peace with me and with himself. I’m not hoping for it to happen, but if it does happen I am open to it.

My mother is no longer with us.

Thank you all for your prayers and suggestions. I have a lot of thinking to do and it’s not easy. It took me a very, very long and difficult time to recover from what my father did. I have physical and emotional scars to this day but I was able to overcome it, start a very happy family of my own and in the long run the whole experience helped me to learn a lot of things and to most importantly not repeat the mistakes of my father.

 

[Mockingjay]

I would attend the funeral mass, sit away from the people who will give you trouble, pray for your fathers soul and leave.
No need to go to the cemetery. You have done your duty as your fathers child this way. You do not have to go to the veiwing or wake if there is one. Under the circumstances this is what I would do.

Also I feel I need to address this. There may be some “duty” I owe to my father but, and this is the six million dollar question, what is to be said about his duty to his child?

Everyone wants to quote the “Honor Thy Father and Mother” commandment and some in my family use it as a tool to allow, excuse and sweep under the rug behaviors that are wrong. The man has been absent for most of my life and when he was in it, he really caused a lot of problems.

So where is his duty?

Where is the commandment that tells him to do right by his child?

This is something that has infuriated me and caused me at times to even consider leaving the Church, because of the people who believe “feelings don’t matter” or “Honor Thy Father… who cares what he did to you… you got a DUTY”.

Sorry, I am just so frustrated over hearing this same argument time and again.

 

[ThyKingdomCome]

Even with good relationships, when faced with the choice to travel visit the dying person or to wait and travel to attend the funeral, I would always advise visiting the dying person. In your case, I would say even stronger, that going to the funeral is likely to be a source of great difficulty for you. I would not be inclined to attend this funeral unless I felt like I could do it pretty easily without encountering the people who will make it so difficult. The benefit would be to offer your prayers for his soul at the funeral Mass.

If anything, I would visit him before he dies, to say goodbye. Only you can determine if that will be too difficult and dredge up too many of the feelings that you have worked so hard to overcome over the years. It is true that you might regret not going, so it is worth considering. But there are also some situations that are bad enough that your own psychological health requires you to stay away even at the end of life. Try to put yourself into the future and imagine how you will feel if you do visit and how you will feel if you don’t visit. Try to see if you think you will regret not being able to say whatever last things you would say if you see him.

It is very true that his obligations to you are great, and that he has failed to meet them. I understand how frustrating it is to always hear about your duty to honor your parents, when they didn’t fulfill their duties. But all you can do is fulfill your end of it appropriately, and accept that his failure to meet his obligations are not something that you can change, or that we can tell him. This is where you will probably have to work to forgive him repeatedly. Ultimately, he will answer for his actions. And I think you understand that you are not duty bound to honor him by putting yourself into the position of punching bag. If the safest thing (psychologically, not just physically) for you to do is to stay away, then you honor him by your prayers, with distance between you.

 

[R_C]

Honor, yes. But that doesn’t mean we have to be a punching bag.

Attending the Last Rites of his father does not seem equiparate in any sound way to “be a punching bag”.

When it comes to my father, yes I forgive him but for the most part I feel very empty towards him. I feel like he is lost. That there is no hope for him. And this is the result of feelings such as hope, hoping for so long that he would change and then finally having to come to the realization that he won’t. He never will. He is what he is, and has given me no sign that he will be otherwise. I do still pray for him but I don’t know… I have lost so many feelings for him because he has been absent from my life for so long.

There is always hope in Christ even for the worst monsters. How much more for the man who is your father in the flesh. This is not how you relate to him, but how you relate to God. This is not about your feelings towards him, but about your faith.

This is generally false. Feelings matter and are given to us so that we know when something is good or bad for our souls, our hearts, and our minds.

Emotions such as love and joy matter, passions such as sorrow or aridity don’t. Not feeling love, for instance, does not mean much when we know that we are in love. I may be very angry at my father, and not only not feel love for him but even feel hatred for him, and yet I am keenly aware that I love him, because I am flesh of his flesh.

However, if this would be hurtful or traumatic to the OP, then perhaps he shouldn’t attend - although, as a Christian, I believe that expressing forgiveness, no matter how, is always something psychologically and spiritually healthy.

 

[maryjk]

Attending the Last Rites of his father does not seem equiparate in any sound way to “be a punching bag”.

It really depends on the family. And from the sound of it, going could very well be a problem.

 

[R_C]

Also I feel I need to address this. There may be some “duty” I owe to my father but, and this is the six million dollar question, what is to be said about his duty to his child?

Everyone wants to quote the “Honor Thy Father and Mother” commandment and some in my family use it as a tool to allow, excuse and sweep under the rug behaviors that are wrong. The man has been absent for most of my life and when he was in it, he really caused a lot of problems.

So where is his duty?

Where is the commandment that tells him to do right by his child?

This is something that has infuriated me and caused me at times to even consider leaving the Church, because of the people who believe “feelings don’t matter” or “Honor Thy Father… who cares what he did to you… you got a DUTY”.

Sorry, I am just so frustrated over hearing this same argument time and again.

Like I mentioned, the issue I see here is with your faith more than with your feelings.

Clearly your understanding of the commandment, for instance, is not full. If you re-read the appropriate section of the Catechism, you will find that indeed the Commandment carries within it an equal duty towards the parents:

The duties of parents

2221 The fecundity of conjugal love cannot be reduced solely to the procreation of children, but must extend to their moral education and their spiritual formation. “The role of parents in education is of such importance that it is almost impossible to provide an adequate substitute.” The right and the duty of parents to educate their children are primordial and inalienable.

2222 Parents must regard their children as children of God and respect them as human persons. Showing themselves obedient to the will of the Father in heaven, they educate their children to fulfill God’s law.

2223 Parents have the first responsibility for the education of their children. They bear witness to this responsibility first by creating a home where tenderness, forgiveness, respect, fidelity, and disinterested service are the rule. The home is well suited for education in the virtues. This requires an apprenticeship in self-denial, sound judgment, and self-mastery - the preconditions of all true freedom. Parents should teach their children to subordinate the “material and instinctual dimensions to interior and spiritual ones.” Parents have a grave responsibility to give good example to their children. By knowing how to acknowledge their own failings to their children, parents will be better able to guide and correct them

• Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord.*

It is very clear, then, that a Catholic who is a disciple of Jesus Christ will not use the Fourth Commandment “as a tool to allow, excuse and sweep under the rug behaviors that are wrong”, because that sort of behavior is a sin of the gravest kind, and a sacrilege.

This, however, is entirely irrelevant, for we are not here to judge others, but to forgive others. We do not forgive someone unless that someone hurt us in some way. I have nothing to forgive you, because you did nothing wrong to me. I have nothing to forgive my best friend, because he honors me with his kind friendship. But those who hurt me, those I have the supernatural vocation to forgive for the sake of that Christ Crucified who, nailed to the wood and crowned with thorns, forgave those who put Him there - which of course includes both you and me.

Let us always keep this in mind, lest one day we were to commiserate ourselves as we find ourselves reflected in the most simple of all parables:

Then his lord, after that he had called him, said to him: "

O you wicked servant, I forgave you that tremendous debt because you pleaded with me. Should not you also have had compassion on your fellow servant, even as I had mercy on you? …]

In the same way my Heavenly Father will deal with you, if you do not all of you forgive one another from your hearts.