Should I say anything?

[SueKrum]

as a Christian woman, I think I always want to jump in and give my opinions/advice when ever I see something is wrong. I’ve learned, however, that that is not always the wise choice. I am looking for some sound opinions here on weather I should give this person some “advice”.

I’m part of a women’s circle at my church and we’re all pretty close. part of joing the group required a faith sharing/giveing of a personal testamony, so we’re all awair of what’s going on in eachother’s lives good and bad and we know a lot about eachother’s pasts. basically, we’re all very close and feel we can share anything with eachother and know it won’t be brought outside of our group and we won’t be judged for what we’ve done. Also, we are founded on strict adhearane to Chruch teaching and we are all prtty conservative.

anyhoo, we’ve got an e-mail prayer list that one of our members sends out every month. we send her our requests and she puts them in a nice list format and sends it out to everyone. it makes it a lot easier Recently, one member has put down a couple of requests that I find very disturbing. the first was for a friend who was dying and is a homosexual man, living the lifestile with another man. the prayer request was to see that the partner of the dying man recieved custity of the dying man’s children after he passes.

a week or so later, another request came down for her sister’s lesbian partner to get a job she was seeking.

than at our chrustmas party, she was telling us about her sister’s gay church and how she was going to the Christmas servace with her and her sister’s partner.

all of this has left me VERY disturbed. first, the request for the man’s partner to get custaty of the children seems to be DIRECTLY against church teaching and I feel I would be sinning to pray for such a thing.

the other two thing meantioned about her sister, I can sort of understand because she’s her sister after all, and she wants her love and all that. but she talks about all of it as if it were perfectly normal and okay. I honestly don’t think she knows that her sister has put her eternal soul in dainger. we ride to mass together sometimes and she talks about her sister a lot, but never says anything about praying for her conversion or any thing of the sort. it’s like her sister and her partner are like any normal married couple who love eachother and it’s all perfectly okay.

is there anything, as a sister in Christ, that I can do? I know I can’t changer her sister, but I feel that my friend needs to understand the truth and realize that we cannot pray for a homosexual man to recieve custity of children that aren’t even his. that instead, we should be praying for him to give his life back to God and live according to His laws and convert.

I don’t want to come off sounding hateful or anything, but I would like to help her understand that this kind of thing isn’t normal and she needs to be praying hard for her sister.

any advice? should I just pray for her and not say anything? what about all the prayer requests for homosexuals? should I just ask the woman in charge of putting them out to edit them so they don’t make the whole gay thing so “nomal” sounding. for example, change “A prayer request for my sister’s partner, for God to show her favor in finding a job at such and such a place” change it to, “A prayer request for a friend of my sister…” btw, the woman in charge of sending out the prayer ruquests is just as disturbed by this as I am and was seeking my advice on what to do about it.

sorry the post is so long winded.

 

[Other_Eric]

If this is truly an orthodox group that you are a member of, then the time has come to confront this wayward sister with two or three other members of the group. If she persists, then the time has come to consider that your words are falling upon a hardened heart and to turn and shake the dust from your sandals.

 

[Suat]

If you are uncomfortable praying for those requests, then by all means bring this up to the group or with the person making the request. You can even offer a prayer for the homosexual couples if you wish. However, reading through your post I have a problem understanding exactly what you are taking offense to. Obligatory disclaimer, I am an atheist, not a catholic, and I see nothing wrong with homosexuality. That said, it appears to me that you are more concerned about praying for something beneficial to happen to a homosexual person then about whether or not the request has anything to do with homosexuality.

the first was for a friend who was dying and is a homosexual man, living the lifestile with another man. the prayer request was to see that the partner of the dying man recieved custity of the dying man’s children after he passes.

It appears that your problem with this request is that the two men have children together when you believe that this is immoral. However, think about what will happen if the partner is not granted custody. At this time the two men are likely living together, and probably have been since the children were born or adopted. In most of those cases the children consider both of the men their fathers. If the partner does not receive custody, then the children will have to face not only losing one of their fathers, but also being torn away from their other father because of religious peoples’ aversion to their parents’ lifestyle. Would their life be more better if they were taken away from both of their fathers? Probably not in most cases. To me, it is quite sickening and shallow to use the death of one parent as an opportunity to remove children from another, providing that no abuse is taking place.

a week or so later, another request came down for her sister’s lesbian partner to get a job she was seeking.

Whether or not a woman gets a job should have nothing to do with her sexual tendencies. Is the issue here actually the request, or are you simple uncomfortable praying for someone to succeed when you judge them morally bankrupt? If it is the first, then bring it up to the group, if it is the second then it may be better to simply abstain from offering the prayer.

should I just ask the woman in charge of putting them out to edit them so they don’t make the whole gay thing so “nomal” sounding. for example, change “A prayer request for my sister’s partner, for God to show her favor in finding a job at such and such a place” change it to, “A prayer request for a friend of my sister…” btw, the woman in charge of sending out the prayer ruquests is just as disturbed by this as I am and was seeking my advice on what to do about it.

This would probably be the best idea, especially because I doubt that you mean to imply that homosexuals should not be prayed for simply due to their sexual preference. You might also want to talk to the woman making the requests. It is possible that she is aware of the Catholic position and chooses to disagree with it, or she may not be aware of the position.

 

[asquared]

there are general rules for all such prayer chains
one is personal info about the people we are praying for is never given, the most you can give is first names, or you can say, Suzy’s brother-in-law.
we do not go into medical or psychological clinical detail about the condition of the person being prayed for.
we do not digress about the lifestyle choices of the person we are praying for
we do not give orders to God about what is best for the person we are praying for.
The person who publishes the prayer chain should let people know prayer requests will be edited according to these guidelines.

Examples:
Please pray for Mary’s sister who is recovering from surgery.
Please pray for Joanne’s brother who is near death, and for his friends and family (no need to bring up anything about the lifestyle of the brother, the friends, or the family).
Please pray for all cancer patients, especially Jack, Maria and Deborah.
Susan ask’s prayers for a special intention for her family (no need for details on the marital squabble that initiated the prayer request).

No Christian should ever feel discomfort about praying for someone who is publicly living an disordered lifestyle, or who is suffering for any reason, for who needs prayer more? But it is an invasion of privacy and a breech of common courtesey to publish such personal information under the pretext of asking for prayers, especially if that publication is intended as some kind of political or social statement: “see how open-minded and sensitive I am, some of my best friends are: gays-lesbians-cohabiting-addicted-gamblers-alcoholics or whatever.”

 

[Della]

What your group needs is a chaplain to guide you through such situations. I think it would be prudent to ask the priest of your parish to suggest someone knowledgeable in Church teaching who would be under him and answerable to him to help you with such questions in your group. Perhaps an assoicate pastor or deacon?

And yes, the member who asked for these requests ought to be told that they were inappropriate for your group since what she was asking for goes against Church teaching (not the request for employment but the tactic acceptance of the lesbian relationship). If she is truly orthodox, she will accept this correction, lovingly given.

 

[BlestOne]

However, reading through your post I have a problem understanding exactly what you are taking offense to. Obligatory disclaimer, I am an atheist, not a catholic, and I see nothing wrong with homosexuality.

As Catholics we believe that the homosexual act is disordered. It is right to love the sinner but hate the sin The issue the OP is referring to is the custody of the children, which we believe are always better off in a home with a mother and a father, as God originally intended.

That said, it appears to me that you are more concerned about praying for something beneficial to happen to a homosexual person then about whether or not the request has anything to do with homosexuality.
It appears that your problem with this request is that the two men have children together when you believe that this is immoral. However, think about what will happen if the partner is not granted custody. At this time the two men are likely living together, and probably have been since the children were born or adopted. In most of those cases the children consider both of the men their fathers. If the partner does not receive custody, then the children will have to face not only losing one of their fathers, but also being torn away from their other father because of religious peoples’ aversion to their parents’ lifestyle. Would their life be more better if they were taken away from both of their fathers? Probably not in most cases. To me, it is quite sickening and shallow to use the death of one parent as an opportunity to remove children from another, providing that no abuse is taking place.

OK, this is where you may be mistaken. The OP refers to the dying parent as the father of the children. I would take this to mean that the man probably was married to a woman or at least in a relationship with a woman at some point

Whether or not a woman gets a job should have nothing to do with her sexual tendencies. Is the issue here actually the request, or are you simple uncomfortable praying for someone to succeed when you judge them morally bankrupt? If it is the first, then bring it up to the group, if it is the second then it may be better to simply abstain from offering the prayer.

I think what the OP is saying here is that she doesn’t feel right praying for a person that isn’t immediate family of the person who requested the prayer. Since we cannot recognize this relationship as legitimate, it does put one in an awkward position. I don’t think the OP is begrudging the woman getting the job in any way.

This would probably be the best idea, especially because I doubt that you mean to imply that homosexuals should not be prayed for simply due to their sexual preference. You might also want to talk to the woman making the requests. It is possible that she is aware of the Catholic position and chooses to disagree with it, or she may not be aware of the position.

I agree that the OP is not saying that you shouldn’t pray for the woman on the basis of her sexual orientation. I think, as I stated above, she feels awkward due to the relationship that the woman has to the person making the prayer requests. We should all pray for anyone who asks or anyone we know that needs prayer, what we cannot do is ask God for it to be ok for a person to do something that we feel is against the teachings of the church.

When I am asked to pray for a person that I don’t necessarily think is doing the right thing, I pray for God’s will in their life or for them to come to understand why what they are doing is wrong.

 

[SueKrum]

how would you suggest we talk to her? maybe a couple of us come by her house privately? should be bring it up at our next get-to-gether in a gerneral way? like, “we need to have a discussion on the format for prayer requests”?

I’m thinking the private way would be better, but I’m unsure on how to iniciate such a thing. any suggestions? or maybe something to read and than discuss with her? she likes to read good catholic books.

this woman was kind of away from the church for a long time and came back a fiew years ago. Knowing her the way that I do, she is tring to live a proper life style, but I think she’s kind of like, “what other people do is okay as long as they love God.”

I like the idea of changing the format of the prayer requests. I’ll deffinately bring that up with the woman who is in charge of that.

suat,
I don’t have a problem praying for someone to recieve certain blessings, like a job. but as a Christian, I believe that living a homosexual life style puts one’s soul in dainger because it’s living outside of God’s plan for humanity. I realize that you don’t agree with that and this thread is not for debating this topic, however what I want you to understand is that my problem is my friend’s lack of understanding on the churches teaching on this matter. she feels it’s perfectly normal for other folks, but we believe that it is not and as a christian, it’s my duty to help her understand the truth. she’s still entitled to her opinions, but she needs to know what the church says on the matter and I do not think she does.

 

[SueKrum]

blessed one,
you said it much better than I could have. thanks.

 

[rwoehmke]

Too much information in some of the prayer requests. Its always possible in some situations, in fact in most, to pray for God’s will. Personaly I would be inclined to mind my own business with the friend as she has not asked for or solicited your advice. Be impeccable in your own behavior and remember it is not your friend who has the irregular relationships, but her relatives. Is it better to try to maintain family ties with the sinner or drive them out of the family. You don’t have any way of knowing.

 

[Suat]

As Catholics we believe that the homosexual act is disordered. It is right to love the sinner but hate the sin The issue the OP is referring to is the custody of the children, which we believe are always better off in a home with a mother and a father, as God originally intended.

Yes, I am aware of the position of the Catholic Church and we will have to agree to disagree on that. Fascinating how two people can have diametrically opposite views on morality, is it not?

OK, this is where you may be mistaken. The OP refers to the dying parent as the father of the children. I would take this to mean that the man probably was married to a woman or at least in a relationship with a woman at some point

I suppose that depends on the area. Where I live homosexuality is not seen as something that needs to be hidden or overcome. If two people in a committed relationship want to become parents then both surrogacy and adoption can be used.

I agree that the OP is not saying that you shouldn’t pray for the woman on the basis of her sexual orientation. I think, as I stated above, she feels awkward due to the relationship that the woman has to the person making the prayer requests. We should all pray for anyone who asks or anyone we know that needs prayer, what we cannot do is ask God for it to be ok for a person to do something that we feel is against the teachings of the church.

If it is against your Faith then you should not be obliged to participate in the prayer, which is why I can understand her issue with the first case. The second one has nothing to do with sexual orientation though.