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AlNg
Guest
It is time for the US to do the same.
Should the 19 year old Florida school shooter be given the death penalty?
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rcwitness
Guest
Well, im not necessarilly opposed to that. But you can probably see how the cost would be staggering.
Anyway, thats on the control spectrum. I was talking about actaully stopping the problem.
Anyway, thats on the control spectrum. I was talking about actaully stopping the problem.
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Fauken
Guest
Pilate may have personally found Him innocent, but Jesus was still found to be treasonous by the Roman government because had Pilate not, there would be no crucifixion, Pilate would have a civil war on his hands, and not to mention being in trouble with Rome for not executing a man whose own people claimed was treasonous. Pilate didn’t give two bits about Jesus being the Son of God. But when the Pharisees said that Jesus was trying to be a King of the Jews in opposition to the authority of Rome, that made Him a traitor in the eyes of Rome.
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rcwitness
Guest
Yes. According to the State, Jesus committed treason. So he was justly crucified by Rome.
According to the Sanhedrin, He was falsley tried. He was unjustly handed over to secular authorities.
I dont think Pilate cared too much abput the “king of the Jews” claim. He didnt find Jesus to be a threat to Ceasar. Thats why he saw him as innocent (not deserving death). He knew the Jews just hated Him, not because He claimed to be king, but that the people were following Him.
According to the Sanhedrin, He was falsley tried. He was unjustly handed over to secular authorities.
I dont think Pilate cared too much abput the “king of the Jews” claim. He didnt find Jesus to be a threat to Ceasar. Thats why he saw him as innocent (not deserving death). He knew the Jews just hated Him, not because He claimed to be king, but that the people were following Him.
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AlNg
Guest
I know how you feel. This topic is disturbing.
With the death penalty, that ;person would not be able to kill again.
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Arkansan
Guest
What other Roman governmental authorities do you think were involved?
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rcwitness
Guest
Deleted… 
He was broight to Herod and sent back to Pilate.
He was broight to Herod and sent back to Pilate.
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Arkansan
Guest
And neither actually found him guilty of anything.
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Fauken
Guest
Besides Pilate? The Roman soldiers that flogged Him, guarded Him, and brought Him to His execution. The ones who waited for Him to die and drew lots for His tunic. The Roman soldier who stabbed Him in the side with a spear to ensure He was dead. Those men, as part of the Roman military, were government employees. Do you think they’d be doing all of that stuff without orders from a higher power?
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Arkansan
Guest
I meant, what Roman authorities do you think found him guilty of treason? As in, someone with the power to issue a death sentence.
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Fauken
Guest
Pilate did. Despite his personal belief that Christ was innocent, he declared Christ as guilty. Again, if Pilate publicly found Him innocent, there would be no crucifixion, period.
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rcwitness
Guest
Yes, interestingly Pilate did say he did not find Him guilty of Capital crime.
But the official reason was for treason, no? Claiming to be king of the Jews.
But the official reason was for treason, no? Claiming to be king of the Jews.
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Arkansan
Guest
When?
St. Matthew expressly records him as publicly finding him innocent.
That’s what he was accused of. But Pilate was clear, he found Jesus innocent and was simply allowing them to kill him (obviously his washing of his hands did not actually absolve him of moral responsibility, but it does make clear that he did not condone what was happening).
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Fauken
Guest
As his personal opinion, yes. But let’s say he did. Let’s say Pilate officially proclaimed Him innocent. You mean to tell me that Roman soldiers in the disciplinarian and imperial culture of the Roman Empire seized an innocent man and lynched Him with no repercussions afterwards? Or that the Jews did so themselves with no fallout after deliberately disobeying the findings of the Roman government? Those ideas, in my view, are outrageous.
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Ender
Guest
Squirrel!!! And off we go…
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o_mlly
Guest
It seems to me, logically, that if one concludes prudentially that the Florida prison system can restrain this person (the concrete circumstance) then one must conclude that execution of this person is not morally permissible (the application of Catholic doctrine).
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Ender
Guest
There are other assumptions involved in that conclusion, the primary one being that it is immoral to execute a person if he can be safely incarcerated. I thought I was pretty clear in showing why I reject that assumption.
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Crocus
Guest
Agreed, and to reiterate the prophetic warning of the Catholic Bishops:
When the state, in our names and with our taxes, ends a human life despite having non-lethal alternatives, it suggests that society can overcome violence with violence. The use of the death penalty ought to be abandoned not only for what it does to those who are executed, but for what it does to all of society.
—USCCB, A Culture of Life and the Penalty of Death
As always, first inform our conscience.
(Full document link to the above quote, is at the top of the thread.)
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simpleas
Guest
Sister Helen Prejean is known around the world for her work to end the death penalty and has been instrumental in encouraging dialogue around the world and in shaping the Catholic Church’s newly vigorous opposition to all executions. She talks about her optimism that the death penalty will be abolished.
link for 10 minute radio interview below, (not sure if it’s available worldwide)
link for 10 minute radio interview below, (not sure if it’s available worldwide)
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o_mlly
Guest
The conditional admits of no assumptions that one may accept or reject. If one accepts the truth of the conditional then one must accept the truth of the consequence. The teaching in 2267 is quite clear.
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