Should the Confirmation age be lowered?

[Lapey]

Yup, I went to a Catholic school and that was what they would tell us at the time. That it was our willing choice to fully embrace religion as adults.

And this is a perfect example you are giving of the very poor chatechesis, we have given over the years. This is not good theology for the sacrament of confirmation. Thanks for sharing this. My personal confirmation was the same.

 

[Brendan]

And this is a perfect example you are giving of the very poor chatechesis, we have given over the years. .

I would have to say that I had much better catechesis, but I think that it a lot to do with the presence of a significant number of Eastern Catholics at my Catholic school.

A Rutherian parish was a ‘feeder’ parish into our school, so about 1/4 of my classmates had been Chrismated at infancy, and they were even going up for Communion at school Masses while they were in Kindergarten.

So it would have been VERY difficult for any religion teacher to claim that Confirmation was an ‘adult’ Sacrament.

 

[thewanderer]

I would have to say that I had much better catechesis, but I think that it a lot to do with the presence of a significant number of Eastern Catholics at my Catholic school.

A Rutherian parish was a ‘feeder’ parish into our school, so about 1/4 of my classmates had been Chrismated at infancy, and they were even going up for Communion at school Masses while they were in Kindergarten.

So it would have been VERY difficult for any religion teacher to claim that Confirmation was an ‘adult’ Sacrament.

Yes, it was encountering Eastern Catholics that helped fix my false theology of this sacrament as well. Thats why I think it is so important to lower the age and remove it from this idea of being a rite of passage awarded for knowing ones faith. I don’t see how else to fix the widespread misconceptions about the sacrament.

 

[Lapey]

Yes, it was encountering Eastern Catholics that helped fix my false theology of this sacrament as well. Thats why I think it is so important to lower the age and remove it from this idea of being a rite of passage awarded for knowing ones faith. I don’t see how else to fix the widespread misconceptions about the sacrament.

could not agree more.

 

[canis73]

Even though I am a cradle catholic (I´m 39), I have only recently tried to get a better understanding of the Church. This post, among others I´m coming across on a daily basis, has been quite an eye opener. Appreciate everyone´s (name removed by moderator)ut!

 

[EasterJoy]

Oh don’t worry, I have prayed and still pray for the change. We will have a new bishop by the end of the year, as our current bishop is retiring. So hopefully with a new bishop we can see change.

For those who like the older age and think its “working well”. Where is the scripture or sacred tradition to back up what you say is good. There is nothing to back up the thought that older is good or right, only a misunderstanding of the theology of the sacrament.

Does the sacrament confer supernatural grace and infuse recipients with the fullness of the Spirit’s gifts, or is this a method of keeping people in CCD for the sake of the program? We have some soul searching to do to rectify these discrepancies in this deacon’s opinion.

I used to tow the bishop’s line as well, I now see number of young people who drop out as they see no point until they are asked to be a God parent. I would say, even though our confirmation class is full, we only retain a third of the entire group of juniors through confirmation. In other words, two thirds of the confirmation age kids with their families registered at our parish, dropped out of CCD soon after first communion.

Does our program work well for the ones that are there? It sure does, I would put our program against any other in the area. But you cannot help those who are not present. I would challenge everyone else to call your rectory staff and ask these questions, how many registered in this age group and how many of those are in CCD. I bet you will be surprised how poorly we are doing.

It seems to me that it might be better if confirmation were understood as the end of initiation and the start of a lifetime of defending the faith, but particularly the difficult job of defending the faith through one’s choices during high school, which is something that will require a habit of growing in the faith for that lifetime. IOW, grade school students should be confirmed and told plainly that they need to prepare themselves in order to be ready for the witness to the faith that is going to be required of them only more and more as they grow older.

I’m saying that this is the message: You’re a confirmed Catholic. Of course you’re going to continue your education. Our parish has several ways for you to do that. Here they are. Which one fits you? I don’t think we can presume that one way is going to work for everyone, but we ought to assume that everyone can find a real way to do it.

 

[tafan]

It seems to me that it might be better if confirmation were understood as the end of initiation and the start of a lifetime of defending the faith, but particularly the difficult job of defending the faith through one’s choices during high school, which is something that will require a habit of growing in the faith for that lifetime. IOW, grade school students should be confirmed and told plainly that they need to prepare themselves in order to be ready for the witness to the faith that is going to be required of them only more and more as they grow older.

I’m saying that this is the message: You’re a confirmed Catholic. Of course you’re going to continue your education. Our parish has several ways for you to do that. Here they are. Which one fits you? I don’t think we can presume that one way is going to work for everyone, but we ought to assume that everyone can find a real way to do it.

Close but not quite right. The Eucharist completes initiation, not confirmation. It is the VERY FIRST statement the Church teaches us about the Eucharist in the Catechism.

As for assuming one way will work for everyone, you are probably correct. Nothing will work for everyone, we are a fallen people. However, when it comes to the order of the sacraments and the approximate age of receiving them, we can certainly say that one way is best for everyone.

 

[babochka]

So it would have been VERY difficult for any religion teacher to claim that Confirmation was an ‘adult’ Sacrament.

My siblings and I were the sole Ruthenians in our school. I was the only Eastern Catholic most of them had ever heard of, let alone met. I think the poor sisters nearly had a heart attack when the pastor assured them that I could receive communion. I was most definitely taught that it was an “adult” sacrament. Even though I knew better, that false theology still affected my understanding of the sacrament for years.

 

[Lapey]

I commend you on taking the responsibility of raising your child and teaching him the faith. I find it interesting though that you and so many others think that the Holy Spirit is not active in the daily lives of your children just because they have not received the Sacrament of Confirmation. Yes, teenagers are being torn apart by the secular world today. This is the exact reason they need to be well grounded and continue their catechesis so they can learn why the Church teaches what it does and the benefits received by putting God first in their lives.

This is where you confuse what we are saying, especially my words. No one is advocating ending CCD at confirmation. Formation in the faith is a lifelong constant endeavor. Thinking of the group we had last year in our class, I would say over 90% would continue classes after confirmation if we requested them to continue. What do you think Sunday school was in the old day? It wasn’t simply “sacrament prep”. It was faith formation even after reception of the sacraments.

Do you have adult faith formation opportunities in your parish? I’m not talking RCIA, just adult formation classes. We do have several during the year which are very well attended. Our last series of bible study classes had as high as 100 people in it. It was a series that lasted 6 weeks or so. This month we are starting the Old Testament course over again; that is two nights a month for a year. The registration is high enough that we enlarged our class room to hold up to 130 students at tables.

If confirmation were offered in 3rd grade, those same parent that send their kids not class for you now will send them after. I would bet it would be more though. Keep it the same or raise it, we will continue to lose more and more kids at a younger age. This is the trend throughout most of the USA; I can vouch for our diocese.

 

[maryjk]

could not agree more.

Me, too.

Sad thing? Our archdiocese just changed the age from “7th to 8th grade” to “11th grade.” They don’t ever give an age. It is always a grade.

And from 2 years of catechesis to 4 years. They start in 9th grade, and although they will receive the sacrament in 11th, but still “owe” another year of classes.

I hate that they are going in the wrong direction.

 

[GRATEFULONEjim]

As a deacon in the Church I assure you I know the numbers as well, and I do not believe your general estimate that you reach most, with the few left to go to another diocese. It’s just not believable; unless you discount all who left the programs but still live in your parish. Your blanket reasoning is also insulting at best.

There was no sugar on my words, you misused them to make it sound as though either I care less about kids than you or just to make me look bad for whatever reason. I do not owe you anything but this; as a deacon I work more with teens than you can ever dream of working, I’ve been directly involved for quite some time. I handle all of the diocesan level events, TEC (3 per year), CLI, rally’s, Jr. High events, Steubenville conference…oh, and by the way, teach confirmation with my wife, the parish youth coordinator. I am also charged with the duty of everything CCD and youth ministry for our parish by my pastor.

I assure you my words do not come from lack of experience or hands on work. So if you care to take the sugar coating off of someone’s words, I would suggest picking a lessor opponent, one who doesn’t know better than the story you are telling.

Now, if you would like to get back to the subject and stop insulting and putting people down who have differing opinions, please be my guest. If you care to continue with the arrogant I know best mentality, well then I am done with you.

Peace,
Deacon Gary.

I do not or have not insulted anyone or put anyone down, and I object to you insinuating that I have. My posts have been charitable and I have weighed the evidence that has been purported objectively.

I know all the families in our parish…All of them. I can attest assuredly, although for some reason you think otherwise, that we are reaching most if not all of the children that are of age to be enrolled for catechesis for Confirmation prep.

I commend you on your decision to serve the Church as a Deacon, but that does not award you any privileges during a discourse here. There is no such thing as a greater or lessor opponent in my eyes. I judge no one and view everyone as an equal here.

I have documented the procedure that our diocese uses for conveyance of the Sacrament of Confirmation and I believe that what we are doing has shown tremendous positive influence on each and every young person who has gone through the program. There is currently no plan in our diocese to change a program that has a proven record of results. You disagree with this. Fine. I respect your opinion.

We have Confirmation teams from each parish which consists of 8 catechists. Each parish within our Vicariate hosts the class once per month on a Sunday from 3-7. After the completion of the 11th grade school year of Sunday classes, each student is interviewed individually by the Vicar. The following September, when catechesis is complete and each student has met the Vicar’s approval, the bishop comes and administers the Sacrament. Like it or not …that’s the way it is done here. Do you disagree? Yes. Is that going to change anything here? No.

 

[Lapey]

I do not or have not insulted anyone or put anyone down, and I object to you insinuating that I have. My posts have been charitable and I have weighed the evidence that has been purported objectively.

I know all the families in our parish…All of them. I can attest assuredly, although for some reason you think otherwise, that we are reaching most if not all of the children that are of age to be enrolled for catechesis for Confirmation prep.

I commend you on your decision to serve the Church as a Deacon, but that does not award you any privileges during a discourse here. There is no such thing as a greater or lessor opponent in my eyes. I judge no one and view everyone as an equal here.

I have documented the procedure that our diocese uses for conveyance of the Sacrament of Confirmation and I believe that what we are doing has shown tremendous positive influence on each and every young person who has gone through the program. There is currently no plan in our diocese to change a program that has a proven record of results. You disagree with this. Fine. I respect your opinion.

We have Confirmation teams from each parish which consists of 8 catechists. Each parish within our Vicariate hosts the class once per month on a Sunday from 3-7. After the completion of the 11th grade school year of Sunday classes, each student is interviewed individually by the Vicar. The following September, when catechesis is complete and each student has met the Vicar’s approval, the bishop comes and administers the Sacrament. Like it or not …that’s the way it is done here. Do you disagree? Yes. Is that going to change anything here? No.

Question…how big is your parish? How many families?

 

[EasterJoy]

Close but not quite right. The Eucharist completes initiation, not confirmation. It is the VERY FIRST statement the Church teaches us about the Eucharist in the Catechism.

As for assuming one way will work for everyone, you are probably correct. Nothing will work for everyone, we are a fallen people. However, when it comes to the order of the sacraments and the approximate age of receiving them, we can certainly say that one way is best for everyone.

Thank you for clarifying that…I meant that the sacraments of initiation in total ought to be completed with the idea that they are the* foundation *of formation. As it is now, it is almost as if confirmation is being held out as a *reward *for formation. I think it gives the wrong message about the role of sacramental grace in the development of a saint. It is God’s grace first, resulting in a saint, not the other way around.

 

[tafan]

Thank you for clarifying that…I meant that the sacraments of initiation in total ought to be completed with the idea that they are the* foundation *of formation. As it is now, it is almost as if confirmation is being held out as a *reward *for formation. I think it gives the wrong message about the role of sacramental grace in the development of a saint. It is God’s grace first, resulting in a saint, not the other way around.

You are absolutely correct. And I will post the following again from the Catechism to provide backup for what you say:

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at **leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ **and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

The bold was added by me to stress the point. Leading and awakening someone does not come at the end of a child’s formation, it should be at the beginning.

 

[GRATEFULONEjim]

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

Let’s pick this apart…*Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. *How is an infant or very young person as suggested be prepared?

• To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands. * Again, lofty goals for young children, yet again alludes to making sure that sufficient catechesis and preparation is to occur.

 

[thewanderer]

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

Let’s pick this apart…*Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. *How is an infant or very young person as suggested be prepared?

• To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands. * Again, lofty goals for young children, yet again alludes to making sure that sufficient catechesis and preparation is to occur.

There was an earlier quote which made it clear that this preparation was only necessary when Confirmation is given to one who is old enough. Implying it is ok to receive it younger. The Eastern Catholic Churches are also proof that Confirmation (or Chrismation) does not require preparation for the efficacy of the sacrament. Which is kind of the point. It is a conferring of grace. That is what it is. Confirmation is not, in essence, a ceremony whereby one accepts the faith for themselves. Essentially, at its core, it is a ceremony whereby a special grace is conferred to an individual.

 

[CDB1718]

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

Let’s pick this apart…*Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. *How is an infant or very young person as suggested be prepared?

• To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands. * Again, lofty goals for young children, yet again alludes to making sure that sufficient catechesis and preparation is to occur.

It says they have to be prepared in accordance with their age and ability. The younger the person, the lower the threshold. The assumption is that the person will be around 7, or just figuring out right from wrong. It says that clearly. Around age 7 we want you to do these things.

The American bishops have an exemption that allows them to set a normative age between 7 and 16. They are an aberration. The experiment is leading to widespread heresy and to religious education teachers denying the sacramental nature of a sacrament and clergy saying that explaining the sacramental theology of Confirmation is sacramentalizing it.

Best case scenario for Confirming at the proper age:
Children have sacramental grace and through that grace continue to form their consciences including through formal catechetical programs.

Worst case scenario for Confirming at the proper age:
Children have sacramental grace but no catechesis.

Best case scenario for Confirming at a late age:
Children have catechesis and through that and seek out a holy life and sacramental grace.

Worst case scenario for Confirming at a late age:
Children have little to no catechesis and no sacramental grace.

If I have to choose between those worst case scenarios, I’ll choose children having sacramental grace with no catechesis. The best case scenario is also preferred.

 

[Hopey]

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

Let’s pick this apart…*Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. *How is an infant or very young person as suggested be prepared?

• To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands. * Again, lofty goals for young children, yet again alludes to making sure that sufficient catechesis and preparation is to occur.

I will tell you how I did it with very young to older (11).
First we start with the sacraments, especially reconciliation. We go, as a family, monthly. They know that the graces they receive from this, in addition to the Eucharist they will be receiving, help them live a life in Christ better, growing toward holiness.
Next they learn basic prayers and practice them in the morning and nightly. They are learning, through trial and error how God is leading with the help of the Holy Spirit.
Next they learn the highest form of worshiping God is the Mass. They learn that each time they assist at Mass, which means they are present - not necessarily DOING something, it is the reenactment of his death and resurrection.
Next they learn to help the community by going with their parents to volunteer at different functions - bake sales, cleaning church, protesting HHS mandate, walk for life, etc.
Those are just the beginnings.
If it were an infant, they would gradually be brought into this.
Our children were not clocked in or out, did not have to keep up with service hours because they knew they were to do as much as they could anyway when needed. Sometimes they were not needed.
At the same time, they were memorizing catechism q&a. They knew the gifts of the Holy Spirit, what each meant and were learning how to discern action or inaction (prayer time).
It isn’t impossible. It wasn’t that hard either.
I had heard that another reason they keep going up is that the youth do not have drivers license, in order to get all service hours, so they had to keep going up. They didn’t want the burden on the parents to take them places.

 

[Lapey]

1309 Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands.

Let’s pick this apart…*Preparation for Confirmation should aim at leading the Christian toward a more intimate union with Christ and a more lively familiarity with the Holy Spirit - his actions, his gifts, and his biddings - in order to be more capable of assuming the apostolic responsibilities of Christian life. *How is an infant or very young person as suggested be prepared?

• To this end catechesis for Confirmation should strive to awaken a sense of belonging to the Church of Jesus Christ, the universal Church as well as the parish community. the latter bears special responsibility for the preparation of confirmands. * Again, lofty goals for young children, yet again alludes to making sure that sufficient catechesis and preparation is to occur.

First “pick apart”- Even the Latin Rite mandates an infant in danger of death is to be confirmed. Theology of the ancient Church supports the option and practice of confirmation as an infant. These CCCs and the canons definitely support confirmation should be available to a child at the age of reason, 7, if prepared. I assure you, some of the seven year olds are very well prepared but their parents are not aware of their right to have them confirmed even though their bishop does not fully agree. The Vatican has spoken on this subject, it has ruled in the favor of the parents and against a US diocesan bishop. The 11 year old girl was ordered to be confirmed. If more of our committed parents knew of this there would be many more young people confirmed no matter what the diocesan policy states.

Second “pick apart”- It’s easier to teach a 7 year old these faucets of the faith than a 16 year old who has decided he/she is smarter than you and their parents. Furthermore, the battle with the world and hormones is in full swing so much of the time is spent on other issues not specifically on what needs to be taught, again this is just plain old fact.

I would love to teach 7-12 year olds all of these teachings rather than the 15-17 year olds we currently teach in confirmation here which is done in their junior year no matter the age. Many of them are over 16 when confirmed. Not that I do not enjoy teaching the older kids, I love it. It would just be easier, the younger ones show a greater propensity to trust and accept truth without questioning the truth rather than the older kids; that is just fact.

Then look at the other side of confirmation as it pertains to education and catechesis; I host “chapel night” every Tuesday night for teens of all ages; totally voluntary and all year long. We regularly get 15 to 30 teens every week, most of them already confirmed. There is no evidence that if kids were confirmed earlier, say 3rd grade, they would stop coming to classes afterwards at any higher rate than they do now before confirmation.

Bottom line, confirmation is NOT an adult sacrament. It is the second of the three sacraments of initiation and needs to be restored to that order. This will happen, but the Church works in centuries so you and I probably won’t see it happen…although, with the current momentum you just never know.

 

[tafan]

Bottom line, confirmation is NOT an adult sacrament. It is the second of the three sacraments of initiation and needs to be restored to that order. This will happen, but the Church works in centuries so you and I probably won’t see it happen…although, with the current momentum you just never know.

Deacon, I have really appreciated all of your comments on this subject. However, I sincerely hope you are wrong about this. And I think there is a good chance you are. In our diocese, there were several parishes who started doing a restored order (my parish was one of the first). Unfortunately for my kids, they were in the Catholic school, and the Diocese had a strict requirements for the school kids to be confirmed in the 8th grade. The new Bishop came in and decided to study the issue and unfortunately did away with the restored order.

But, there are other diocese in this country moving in the right direction. I was told all of the Diocese in Canada are moving to the correct order. The Latin America churches, to my knowledge, never bought into this insanity of late confirmation dates. I think that the US was the place where it became wide spread. As the older Bishops retire and younger Bishops see that we are out of sync with the Universal Church, it will change.

I even think that having a Pope from Latin America might speed things up.

But 15 years ago, none of us who now support this, even though we were active, practicing Catholics at the time, knew we were wrong. Now we do. It will change, and quicker than you think. Yes the Church works slowly in many things, but this is not really a change for the universal Church, just for the US. It is simply a matter of the RE establishment (and that is certainly who drives this stupidity, the DREs around the country) learning the error of their ways.

Even GRATEFULONEjim now recognizes that a late confirmation date is a “drastic” action by the Bishops and that the sacrament is not well understood because of the current practice.