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Aramis
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The GIRM says they should use Albs. Elsewhere it points out that albs are to be worn with Amice and Cincture, unless designed not to need them.
GIRM:
GIRM:
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Cathryn
Guest
I have a serious question. What is wrong with a woman wearing sturdy comfortable sandals with nylons? I am not speaking of flip flops, but open toed leather sandals with a strap on the back. Is there a modesty issue here?
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benedictgal
Guest
The cassocks and suprlice would not be a good idea at all for ao woman. An alb would be better.First of all, I absolutely agree with everything that Bilop said.
I definitely would like to see all EMHC’s (if we must have them) wearing a cassock and surplice. I would prefer that only the Priest distribute the Holy Eucharist and the idea of the Priest and Deacon sitting down and allowing lay people to distribute the Holy Eucharst shocks me. I think I would communicate with the Bishop on that one.
And, the cassock and surplice is a unisex garment because the sole woman Sacristan in my parish wears the cassock and surplice when she assists at Mass (and again, I would prefer that we have only men).
As to the readers, modest clothes for the women (and I mean no bare arms and shoulders and short shirts); for men, please long pants and shoes and socks (I am always amazed at men who come to Mass wearing shoes and no socks, what is that all about.
:knight2:
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Rickwood
Guest
GIRM 339. Acolytes, lectors, and other lay ministers may wear the alb or **other suitable vesture that is lawfully approved by the Conference of Bishops **
Anyone happen to know what that is for the USA? I presume it’s the cassock/surplice/cotta, but I would be interested in reading the documentation.
Anyone happen to know what that is for the USA? I presume it’s the cassock/surplice/cotta, but I would be interested in reading the documentation.
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benedictgal
Guest
I had to assist at the very last minute because no one showed up to help the priest administer the chalice. My dad also helped to administer the chalice, as well (he, too, is am EMHC).
I had to use the deacon’s alb (I’m tall and the ones they had were short–deacon wasn’t there, by the way). I served in crop pants (they are two inches above the ankle) and a brightly-colored blouse, and Birkenstocks (closed-toe, Maryjanes that were also multi-and brightly-colored). I asked the priest if the Birki’s were okay and he said it was fine. He was just happy that we were there.
To make matters worse, the person who was supposed to read didn’t show up either, so Father asked if I could help him there, as well. There were no other readers in the assembly, so I did it. He says that inasmuch as he understands that we aren’t supposed to do more than one thing, he was short-handed, or should I say, no-handed at this point. The servers didn’t even show up. Bottom line is that my father and I divided up the duties.
It’s not something that I would advocate on a regular basis, but, please, if you are signed up and assigned on a certain day, show up.
The bottom line is that wearing hosiery with the shoes is fine. Heck, if you have to do that at an office, why should you not do that for Mass?
What bothered me was having one lady show up in a low-cut blouse and very tight capri-pants. She was scheduled to read. I offered to lend her my blazer (it matched her “outfit”), but, she said, “No, thank you. God doesn’t mind as long as I have the right intention”. I felt like telling her, “Maybe, but, please respect His house and the celebrant.”
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Cristiano
Guest
In my parish the altar servers wear the cassock and surplice, the instituted acolytes wear the alb, the readers, EHMCs, and cantors should wear a reverent attire.
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benedictgal
Guest
According to the 1997 document issued by the Congregation for the Clergy on the collaboration between the ordained clergy and the faithful, this is the standard for vesture:
This is the key to the whole thing. We need to be careful as to what applies to us and what is proper for the clergy.
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Rickwood
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Again, I would really like to read what the bishops for the USA have published. Amazed you actually have instituted acolytes. What diocese are you in?
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EmBee
Guest
I believe I was the first (only?) person to specify closed toed shoes, so I’ll answer as to why I personally don’t like open toed shoes. All the jobs I’ve held have either required or strongly encouraged closed toed shoes. Working retail in college, closed toed shoes were encouraged because it minimized potential injuries (dropping things on ones foot, etc.). Working in food service, closed toed shoes were required because of sanitary issues. Working in a laboratory, closed toed shoes were required because of both potential hazards (acids/bacteria/what have you), hygiene (trying to maintain a clean environment), and enforcement of a “business-casual” dress code (putting your best foot forward at work doesn’t necessarily mean that time has been taken to ensure that said foot is aesthetically ready to be put forward …).
Frankly, most sandals (with or without nylons) would probably be fine for an EMHC to wear, but that requires personal discretion. I think, for a dress code at least, it’s easier to make a generaliztion rather than allow for case-by-case exceptions. For me, less choices in dress code means less chances that someone abuses the dress code.
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PatrickJT914
Guest
Yes there should be some kind of dress code. I’m not exactly sure what it would include or not include. It would depend on if you are regularly assigned to a Mass or whether you got asked at the last minute to fill in.
In my parish we used to have a medallion or a cross to wear around our necks while performing our duties. The medallion was circular it had an altar, on the altar was a cup (left side) next to the cup is an oblong loaf of bread. On the sides of the altar are two candles, one on each side. The size of the medallion was approximately 1 3/4 inches in circumference. (Not too big.) We once had an older gentleman EMHC who wore an alb while performing his duties at Mass. He either found out on his own or somebody told him about the laity are not supposed to wear clerical garb if they are doing a liturgical function at Mass. He stopped wearing the alb.
I personally would like to see the alb worn by EMHC’s it certainly would cover up any imperfections in dress. There has to be something that says yes, I’m still a lay person commissioned to perform an important role at Mass. But without worrying about whether looking like a priest or deacon. Or blurring the line between Holy Orders and the laity.
In my parish we used to have a medallion or a cross to wear around our necks while performing our duties. The medallion was circular it had an altar, on the altar was a cup (left side) next to the cup is an oblong loaf of bread. On the sides of the altar are two candles, one on each side. The size of the medallion was approximately 1 3/4 inches in circumference. (Not too big.) We once had an older gentleman EMHC who wore an alb while performing his duties at Mass. He either found out on his own or somebody told him about the laity are not supposed to wear clerical garb if they are doing a liturgical function at Mass. He stopped wearing the alb.
I personally would like to see the alb worn by EMHC’s it certainly would cover up any imperfections in dress. There has to be something that says yes, I’m still a lay person commissioned to perform an important role at Mass. But without worrying about whether looking like a priest or deacon. Or blurring the line between Holy Orders and the laity.
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Like
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bilop
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Correct, and only men should be serving at the altar or in the sanctuary.
In my post I recommended a return to minor orders, that would require only male lectors and acolytes, as only men can enter these orders.
If we want to encourage vocations to the Priesthood among boys, it is critical to return the altar to a masculine environment. At most masses I attend now, the sanctuary has one priest, 2 or 3 middle aged women EMHCs, 2 or 3 altar girls, and rarely a male lector. No wonder no boys want to serve!
A newly ordained Priest we are friends with is hoping to start the TLM at his new parish. I am hoping to serve for him,and train the boys there to serve.
God Bless
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EasterJoy
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As to a dress code, I think St. James would have had something to say about a dress code. (James 2:1-12) You must refrain from anything which would show favoritism towards the rich, nor can you sit in judgement of others. You can start from the proposition that a Catholic ought to be wearing modest clothing on an everyday basis, but you can’t start requiring things that a modest person of extremely limited means might not have in their daily wardrobe. Other than requiring that the body be modestly covered, then, that kind of scotches a dress code.
I’m not saying that all parishioners, EMHC in particular, should not be told to wear clothing appropriate to the solemnity of the Mass. Catholics should dress modestly at all times, in a way that reflects where they are. I am saying that any kind of enforcement poses definite pastoral problems, and would have to be handled sensitively, on a case-by-case basis.
I’m not saying that all parishioners, EMHC in particular, should not be told to wear clothing appropriate to the solemnity of the Mass. Catholics should dress modestly at all times, in a way that reflects where they are. I am saying that any kind of enforcement poses definite pastoral problems, and would have to be handled sensitively, on a case-by-case basis.
If you don’t recruit sufficient numbers of men and boys before giving the women and girls the pink slip, you might see one priest in the sanctuary at Mass, and that’s it. I share your desire to fill those seminaries, but I don’t know how many boys are going to want to answer the call when all they see are burned-out priests who can’t get any help.
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Rickwood
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That’s not true when it comes to the OF of the Latin Rite. In other words, at least 95% of the Masses/Divine Liturgies celebrated within the Church.
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KathleenElsie
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Many of us feel the same way. It should only be men (young and old) at the altar. Lets also get the minor seminaries back. So many Dioceses have closed them and the result is NO vocations for years at a time. It is time to end the drought and open the flood gates of true vocations.
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KCT
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A few weeks ago we were out of town and attended the local parish. The EMs all wore white robes. It was a shock to see women in white robes processing up the aisle w/ the priest.
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Rickwood
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Look at posting #18. Imagine a well-regarded pastor trying to implement such a dress code. A good pastor would give current lay ministers a voice in what the “uniform” would look like. He would be tactful and exceedingly gentle in implementing the dress code, and he would do it in a way to give everyone plenty of time to get on board at their own pace. He would also quietly make it known that the parish would pay for anyones’ “uniform” where money was an issue.
I think even the best pastors would receive some level of resistance. Some EMsHC might even quit. In all honesty that might not be such a bad thing. In time the extremely simple uniforms would become part of the parish’s heritage. It would not only guard against lay ministers dressing inappropriately for Mass, it would also send a quiet signal to the rest of the parish members. It would also build espirit de corps among the lay ministers. New EMsHC would realize they need to wear the uniform before they ever applied.
I think it’s great idea, but most pastors simply lack the courage, tact and fortitude to implement such a code.
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KathleenElsie
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On Tuesday we attended a Divine Liturgy at a small Byzantine Church. There was one priest, Father Paul ,and SEVEN ,yes SEVEN, of our young boys 13 and under that were at the ALTAR. Why, because the parents were interested enough to take them to Liturgy on weekdays and not just this one time but when physically possible. Father Paul welcomes us with our large families and presents a good example for our youth. God Bless all the priests that take time and make the effort to interact with the boys.
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UKcatholicGuy
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EMHCs are a scandal. St Thomas Aquinas declared it to be a mortal sin for a layman to touch the Blessed Sacrament! Imagine his horror at seeing not only layMEN manhandle the Host, but layWOMEN
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