Should we kneel at Mass?

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RCinMT said:
People ignore the priest? Seriously? If I were the priest I would just stop the mass and stand there.
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Oh definitely they ignore priests! And it goes both ways. I’ve seen people specifically ignore posture instructions. If a new priest comes in and says something about hand holding or such. I personally have to ignore priests when they instruct people to gather around the altar for the Eucharistic prayer, encourage you to remain standing when one should kneel, or any other personal innovation that comes along…
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
Yes, this was common in some western diocese and is now being phased out. There are some stragglers left.
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Villanova University does this at their Masses and it drives me nuts. Before Mass starts, the cantor says something like “in a sign of unity, please remain standing after the ‘Lamb of God.’”

When I attend their masses, I still kneel anyway. When I ask people (even a religious brother who was visiting) why they do it, no one has any idea.

The only thing I can possibly guess is that the foundation has a “bench like” base, which people sit on because they run out of seats. So people who are sitting there don’t have a kneeler. It’s the only thing I can think of regarding why they do it.

God Bless
 
DignumEtJustum said:
Of course we are to kneel at the Sanctus if not right through to Communion then again after the Pater Noster at the Agnus Dei until at least after the Domine non sum dignus and probably until we go up for Communion or remain kneeling if we are not in a State of Grace and therefore not receiving Communion. After Communion we should be kneeling until the closing of the tabernacle. Anyone suggesting otherwise is unfamiliar with the Roman Rite of the Catholic Mass.
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Are you not familiar with the guidelines for posture in the General Instruction of The Roman Missal?
In the Dioceses of the United States of America, they should kneel beginning after the singing or recitation of the Sanctus (Holy, Holy, Holy) until after the Amen of the Eucharistic Prayer, except when prevented on occasion by ill health, or for reasons of lack of space, of the large number of people present, or for another reasonable cause. However, those who do not kneel ought to make a profound bow when the Priest genuflects after the Consecration. The faithful kneel after the Agnus Dei (Lamb of God) unless the Diocesan Bishop determines otherwise.
 
HobbitShoe said:
Every Sunday at Mass, our pastor tells us to kneel after the Sanctus, and most of the congregation remains standing. There was an argument about this last week in RCIA, and the teacher claimed that when the priest says to kneel, we may remain standing “to represent the risen Christ.”

I asked our DRE about it. She confirmed what our RCIA teacher said, but was unable to provide any evidence to support the claim. She said this is what she learned from people around the time of the Second Vatican Council. Isn’t that hearsay? She also recommended that I read the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, so I did.

The GIRM says 1) we must be united in our postures at Mass, 2) this is accomplished by obeying the priest, and 3) kneeling during the consecration is mandatory for all churches in the United States.

I have had no luck finding alternative instructions. Our DRE said they might be in the Constitution on the Sacred Liturgy, so I read that as well. “Constitution” is the operative word in that title. The document set parameters for reviewing liturgical practices throughout the Church, but it did not make any specific changes except for a few decrees to complete ongoing projects. It said nothing about standing during the consecration.

I’m trying to understand our catechists, but I can’t find anything to support what they are teaching. The magisterial documents of the church could fill a library, so I’m asking you good folks at Catholic Answers for help. There are really three questions here:
  1. Should we always obey commands given by the priest at Mass?
  2. May we remain standing during the consecration if we are physically able to kneel?
  3. Where does the church encourage us to stand during the consecration to “represent the risen Christ?”
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Romans 14:11
For it is written: As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Philippians 2:10
That in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those that are in heaven, on earth, and under the earth

At Catholic Mass one is TRULY & actually in God’s VERY Presence: OF COURSE we SHOULD Kneel:thumbsup:
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
Oh definitely they ignore priests! And it goes both ways. I’ve seen people specifically ignore posture instructions. If a new priest comes in and says something about hand holding or such. I personally have to ignore priests when they instruct people to gather around the altar for the Eucharistic prayer, encourage you to remain standing when one should kneel, or any other personal innovation that comes along…
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This must be the reason that people do not know what is proper and what is not. They do not know when they are to trust the instruction given by the priest when he is asking them to do something that they know is wrong. But there are other instances when people should follow the instruction of the presider even if it is different from what they are used to doing.
 
Regarding comments from FrenzyJen and zab: I am now looking to see if our church has any special instructions from the bishop, but I suspect this is just a case of certain people thinking they know better than the priest.

It might be time to let this thread die. I would have marked it solved yesterday if the forum had that feature. Now it’s becoming an argument between libs vs. trads. Please remember that our catechists are real people who require loving correction, and many prayers.

Thanks again for your help, everyone! 👍
 
zab said:
Are you not familiar with the guidelines for posture in the General Instruction of The Roman Missal?
In the Dioceses of the United States of America, they should kneel beginning after the singing or recitation of the Sanctus (Holy, Holy, Holy) until after the Amen of the Eucharistic Prayer, except when prevented on occasion by ill health, or for reasons of lack of space, of the large number of people present, or for another reasonable cause. However, those who do not kneel ought to make a profound bow when the Priest genuflects after the Consecration. The faithful kneel after the Agnus Dei (Lamb of God) unless the Diocesan Bishop determines otherwise.
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I don’t generally attend the Ordinary Form of the Mass so it’s irrelevant to me anyways. What I do at the Extraordinary Form I often do at the Ordinary Form.
 
DignumEtJustum said:
I don’t generally attend the Ordinary Form of the Mass so it’s irrelevant to me anyways. What I do at the Extraordinary Form I often do at the Ordinary Form.
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If you are attending Mass in the Ordinary Form in a diocese that is supposed to remain standing after the Agnus Dei (or visiting such a diocese), then it is relevant to you. You are supposed to remain standing! So your comment "Anyone suggesting otherwise is unfamiliar with the Roman Rite of the Catholic Mass " remains in error.
 
zab said:
If you are attending Mass in the Ordinary Form in a diocese that is supposed to remain standing after the Agnus Dei (or visiting such a diocese), then it is relevant to you. You are supposed to remain standing! So your comment "Anyone suggesting otherwise is unfamiliar with the Roman Rite of the Catholic Mass " remains in error.
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Do you know of a diocese that has this rule currently?
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
Do you know of a diocese that has this rule currently?
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Archdiocese of Seattle is one.

From

seattlearchdiocese.org/Archdiocese/Policies/Documents/Eucharist.pdfEU 2. The following adaptations to the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) and as found in the Apostolic letter Redemptionis Sacramentum (117–119) are to be observed everywhere throughout the Archdiocese of Seattle:
2.a. The faithful remain standing after the “Lamb of God” until the end of the Communion Procession unless prevented by age, infirmity or some personal situation (e.g. small children, etc.).
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
Yes, this was common in some western diocese and is now being phased out. There are some stragglers left.
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Do you have any information to show that this is being “phased out” ? And I’m not referring to some people just ignoring the rule.
 
zab said:
Archdiocese of Seattle is one.

From

seattlearchdiocese.org/Archdiocese/Policies/Documents/Eucharist.pdfEU 2. The following adaptations to the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) and as found in the Apostolic letter Redemptionis Sacramentum (117–119) are to be observed everywhere throughout the Archdiocese of Seattle:
2.a. The faithful remain standing after the “Lamb of God” until the end of the Communion Procession unless prevented by age, infirmity or some personal situation (e.g. small children, etc.).
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Interesting. Seattle was my old stomping grounds. That would explain a couple months ago when visiting, Half… and I mean exactly half. If the people stood and half knelt.
One would think the current head of the archdiocese would be in favor of kneeling. Perhaps this will be interesting to watch.
 
zab said:
Archdiocese of Seattle is one.

From

seattlearchdiocese.org/Archdiocese/Policies/Documents/Eucharist.pdfEU 2. The following adaptations to the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) and as found in the Apostolic letter Redemptionis Sacramentum (117–119) are to be observed everywhere throughout the Archdiocese of Seattle:
2.a. The faithful remain standing after the “Lamb of God” until the end of the Communion Procession unless prevented by age, infirmity or some personal situation (e.g. small children, etc.).
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While they may stand for the procession ( communion line) they still must kneel for the consecration.
seattlearchdiocese.org/liturgy/faq.aspx
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
Interesting. Seattle was my old stomping grounds. That would explain a couple months ago when visiting, Half… and I mean exactly half. If the people stood and half knelt.
One would think the current head of the archdiocese would be in favor of kneeling. Perhaps this will be interesting to watch.
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To my knowledge there has been nothing coming from our present Archbishop that has changed the guidelines set by the previous Archbishop. There are a few in our parish that kneel at the elevation, but nowhere near half-at the most maybe 10 on a Sunday. And we have a “traditional” parish which offers Mass in the extraordinary form twice a month. Our Archbishop is still recovering from back surgery.
 
zab said:
Archdiocese of Seattle is one.

From

seattlearchdiocese.org/Archdiocese/Policies/Documents/Eucharist.pdfEU 2. The following adaptations to the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) and as found in the Apostolic letter Redemptionis Sacramentum (117–119) are to be observed everywhere throughout the Archdiocese of Seattle:
2.a. The faithful remain standing after the “Lamb of God” until the end of the Communion Procession unless prevented by age, infirmity or some personal situation (e.g. small children, etc.).
Click to expand...
zab said:
To my knowledge there has been nothing coming from our present Archbishop that has changed the guidelines set by the previous Archbishop. There are a few in our parish that kneel at the elevation, but nowhere near half-at the most maybe 10 on a Sunday. And we have a “traditional” parish which offers Mass in the extraordinary form twice a month. Our Archbishop is still recovering from back surgery.
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It takes a long time to turn the titanic around…
I’ll never forget the weird things at SU.
I do have some fond memories of some east side parishes…
 
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