Shouldn’t Catholicism and Orthodoxy be identical?

[levi86]

Why is it that the Orthodox Church and the Catholic Church have differing Tradition? By the time that the Orthodox Church broke away from Rome ALL Catholic doctrine was clearly defined by the Church Fathers. If the Catholic Church was truly universal shouldn’t the two Churches be almost identical in theology? The differences between the two surely didn’t develop after the great schism; in particular I refer to purgatory.

Doesn’t this difference in theology indicate that there were always dramatically different views within the Church before the schism, how could the Church have been universal if their beliefs weren’t?

Doesn’t this difference in Tradition discredit our practice of adhering to sacred Tradition?

Thanks
Levi.

 

[richbansha]

levi86:

Why is it that the Orthodox Church and the Catholic Church have differing Tradition? By the time that the Orthodox Church broke away from Rome ALL Catholic doctrine was clearly defined by the Church Fathers.

They differ because they developed in two distinct cultures, two different languages with two completely different sets of leaders and scholars that shaped them in accord with different philosophies.

If the Catholic Church was truly universal shouldn’t the two Churches be almost identical in theology? The differences between the two surely didn’t develop after the great schism; in particular I refer to purgatory.

Actually, the remarkable thing is how close the two are after all of these centuries. The differences started the day Constantinople was founded. That allowed the native Greek clergy and scholars came into their own.

Doesn’t this difference in theology indicate that there were always dramatically different views within the Church before the schism, how could the Church have been universal if their beliefs weren’t?

Dramatic differences? I think that overstates it. To this day, they have a valid mass and their members can stand as godparents to our children. Remember, the Orthodox are not heretics like the Arians and Donatists were. They are merely badly mistaken on some of the finer points.

Doesn’t this difference in Tradition discredit our practice of adhering to sacred Tradition?

Why should it? Our sacred tradition stands no matter what the Orthodox are up to these days. Instead of Purgatory they might take George Carlin’s lead and send their souls to a garage in Buffalo. What does that have to do with us?

 

[Roche42]

Considering the propensity in the early Church for people from the eastern portion of Christendom to fall into heresy, it seemed to happen every century, I would say its shocking that the two Churches are so similar today. Like Rich said, there are very few doctrinal differences. For me it seems like a tremendous testament to the importance of Sacred Tradition, not an argument against it.

 

[Mickey]

…and keep in mind that the Eastern Catholics adhere to most of the theology of East, while remaining in communion with Rome.

 

[Contarini]

levi86:

Why is it that the Orthodox Church and the Catholic Church have differing Tradition? By the time that the Orthodox Church broke away from Rome ALL Catholic doctrine was clearly defined by the Church Fathers.

No, it was not. Catholic doctrine keeps getting defined more and more clearly. I’m not sure where you get this weird idea from.

If the Catholic Church was truly universal shouldn’t the two Churches be almost identical in theology? The differences between the two surely didn’t develop after the great schism; in particular I refer to purgatory.

Read Jacques Le Goff, The Birth of Purgatory. General ideas about a state of purgation after death do go back to the early Church, but the specifics of the medieval doctrine of purgatory didn’t fully develop till the 12th century.

I think that some differences between East and West (including attitudes to purgation) do go back fairly early. But there’s a slow divergence–there is no clear-cut division until the later Middle Ages.

I think the remarkable thing is that Catholicism and Orthodoxy have been more or less separate for about a thousand years, and yet their beliefs are almost identical.

That’s how it looks from a Protestant perspective. I’ve come to understand Orthodoxy enough to realize that there are significant differences, but it’s easy for both Catholics and Orthodox (especially Orthodox) to exaggerate those differences. For someone coming from a Protestant perspective, the similarities are overwhelming. And this is a huge challenge for us. The question I want to push on my fellow Protestants is–given these huge areas of agreement, how can we Protestants claim that doctrines/practices like devotion to the saints, etc., are simply “Roman” corruptions?

It’s all in how you look at it!

Edwin

 

[Mickey]

Contarini:

I think the remarkable thing is that Catholicism and Orthodoxy have been more or less separate for about a thousand years, and yet their beliefs are almost identical.

Yes. As a Byzantine Catholic, I can go to the Orthodox Liturgy and not miss a beat–except for the fact that we pray for the pope.