Sin Attachments

[Psychotheosophy]

We are called to
Sacrifice sin in our lives,
And anything that attaches us to sin.

Detaching from food and water
Can lead to death.
Is this a sin?

And if this is a sin,
Is fasting a sin?

 

[Julian0404]

Starvation is not fasting. Fasting is the “temporary” pause from material comfort or sustanance to help us focus on our deaths, judgement and sacrifice of our Lord and to call out for special help and assistance from God. “Lord, as you suffered for us, I am now suffering for you, please hear and answer my prayer.”

A food or eating problem need not result in “death by starvation” to resolve. A “strict diet” of limited calories, or types of food would suffice to meet the Fasting and the prayer without the harm that starvation would induce to body and soul, if it is done voluntarily to death.

May I suggest “Weight Watchers”, as it is very professional and focused on teaching and support.

 

[JRKH]

We are called to
Sacrifice sin in our lives,
And anything that attaches us to sin.

Detaching from food and water
Can lead to death.
Is this a sin?

And if this is a sin,
Is fasting a sin?

I’m not sure if you are asking a specific question here or something more general so allow me to take a cautious approach.

You speak of detaching from anything that “attaches us to sin”. I’m not sure I understand your meaning here. Attachment to sin is to feel some attraction to the sin, or some satisfaction in the sin even after confessing it.

Food does not attach us to any sin that I know of unless you are refering to the sin of Gluttony.

Starving ones self to death would be a sin.

Fasting is not a sin when done properly and for the right reasons.
In reparation for sin. For the improvement of our discipline and reliance on God. For the asking of some favor. To draw us closer to Christ’s sufferings.

Peace
James

 

[StrawberryJam]

I’d need case studies on people who died of starvation due to (voluntary)overly pious ways, which I am sure could possibly exist after all. Would they get approval from the Vatican? I don’t think they want that honor if it is one.

 

[GEddie]

Starvation is not fasting. Fasting is the “temporary” pause from material comfort or sustanance to help us focus on our deaths, judgement and sacrifice of our Lord and to call out for special help and assistance from God. “Lord, as you suffered for us, I am now suffering for you, please hear and answer my prayer.”

A food or eating problem need not result in “death by starvation” to resolve. A “strict diet” of limited calories, or types of food would suffice to meet the Fasting and the prayer without the harm that starvation would induce to body and soul, if it is done voluntarily to death.

May I suggest “Weight Watchers”, as it is very professional and focused on teaching and support.

So the purpose of fasting is to focus on death? I haven’t heard that one before.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Weight Watchers?

I am sorry, but this takes the cake.

 

[Benadam]

We need practice dying to our bodies so when it happens we’ll be good at it.

 

[StrawberryJam]

We need practice dying to our bodies so when it happens we’ll be good at it.

With spiritual direction, right? Someone who knows your, well… I mean will guide you in the best way.

 

[Benadam]

With spiritual direction, right? Someone who knows your, well… I mean will guide you in the best way.

A must. Keep ya from shifting the goal from detaching to attaching,

 

[JRKH]

I’d need case studies on people who died of starvation due to (voluntary)overly pious ways, which I am sure could possibly exist after all. Would they get approval from the Vatican? I don’t think they want that honor if it is one.

I don’t know about “case studies” (not sure if you mean medical case studies or religious case studies) but there have been people in religious life who have gotten carried away with fasting and/or mortification. Such things are frowned upon by the Church. The reason being that what happens is the fast or orther mortification becomes the focus instead of God.

As an example in the secular world we could look at those with anorexia. They starve themselves for the wrong reasons. Karen Carpenter died as a result of this disease.

Peace
James

 

[Psychotheosophy]

With spiritual direction, right?

Good idea.
St John of the Cross wrote,
In “The Ascent of Mount Carmel”:

… an attachment to a creature makes a person equal to that creature, the firmer the attachment, the closer is the likeness to that creature, and the greater equality. For love effects a likeness between the lover and the object loved.

And,

We just assert that all the being of creatures compared with the infinite being of God is nothing, and that, therefore, a man attached to creatures is nothing in the sight of God, an even less than nothing, because love causes equality and likeness and even brings the lover lower than the object of his love. In no way, then is such a man capable of union with the infinite being of God. There is no likeness between what is not and what is.

Fasting is the “temporary” pause from material comfort or sustanance to help us focus on our deaths, judgement and sacrifice of our Lord and to call out for special help and assistance from God.

So,
Fasting as a prayer,
Helps us to be like Christ,
In following Him, by His grace,
In his suffering, death, and resurrection?

Attachment to sin is to feel some attraction to the sin, or some satisfaction in the sin even after confessing it.

Food does not attach us to any sin that I know of unless you are refering to the sin of Gluttony.

So,
Attachment is not only an attraction to sin,
But becoming equal to the creature
With which one is attached
(such as food or water?)

Though, not becoming God,
Who is not a creature.

…there have been people in religious life who have gotten carried away with fasting and/or mortification. Such things are frowned upon by the Church. The reason being that what happens is the fast or orther mortification becomes the focus instead of God.

So,
Fasting must somehow be a prayer to be spiritually beneficial?

 

[JRKH]

So,
Fasting as a prayer,
Helps us to be like Christ,
In following Him, by His grace,
In his suffering, death, and resurrection?

So,
Attachment is not only an attraction to sin,
But becoming equal to the creature
With which one is attached
(such as food or water?)

Though, not becoming God,
Who is not a creature.

So,
Fasting must somehow be a prayer to be spiritually beneficial?

In seeking God it is necessary not to become so attached to anything that it usurps God’s place as head of our heart. Therefore we must be careful what significance we attach to anything in our life.
Food is necessary for the health and survival of the Body and thus is a tool we need to maintain our life for God. Fasting allows us to place food in it’s proper perspective.
If fasting gets out of hand, as in one who brags about how long they fast, or how often, then the fasting has become the object and not the Glory of God.

As an example lets consider the marathon runner, or more specifically one who wishes to run a marathon. This person, in setting such a goal then focuses all of their energy on that goal. They begin training and they subjegate every other activity to the Goal of running in, and completing, the marathon.
Their excersize is focused, not on the excersize, but on the goal.
Their diet is focused, not on the food, but on the goal
Their sleep habits are focused, not on the sleep, but on the goal.
and so on…

So long as these things remain in their proper order, the person will be properly prepared to complete the race. However, if the person gets too much into the excersize they may wind up muscle bound and unable to go the distance. If the person diets too severely they will not have the energy to go the distance. If the persons sleep habits are out of whack, they will not be properly rested before the race.

In the spiritual marathon, it is important to remember that union with God is the Goal. That every tool at our disposal must be properly geared toward that goal. Every activity must become a prayer and witness to God. Whether we are talking about Food, prayer, service to others, or whatever, ALL must be properly focused on God.

Peace
James

 

[puzzleannie]

We are called to
Sacrifice sin in our lives,
And anything that attaches us to sin.

Detaching from food and water
Can lead to death.
Is this a sin?

And if this is a sin,
Is fasting a sin?

certainly deliberately starving yourself is a sin, but its guilt may be mitigated by a disorder such as anorexia. fasting is not the same as starving yourself. It is giving up certain types of food or drink at certain controlled limited times as a penance and as an aid to resisting temptation.

detachment is also not the same as giving it up completely, it means rather letting go of the hold that item has on our emotions and passions. For instance, detachment from food and drink means giving up emotional eating, over-eating, gluttony, hoarding, and activities or attitudes in regards to food which are disordered.

if the person OP refers to has an attachment to food or drink that amounts to sin, hard to imagine but we will go with it, that person much more likely needs psychological counselling or a doctor’s advice.

 

[Psychotheosophy]

In seeking God it is necessary not to become so attached to anything that it usurps God’s place as head of our heart.

A usurpation is a taking by force.
It denies either God’s power over sin,
Or our free will.

There isn’t anything
That usurps God’s place
In our hearts

St. John of the Cross makes sense.

God has power over sin.
But we can not become like God.
We can become like Christ,
Who is 100% man.

Since Christ is 100% God.
Than if we become like Christ,
We can share in His
Power over sin.

Therefore,

It is important after baptism,
Into the Church (the “Bride of Christ”)
To not choose the Life of Christ
To be dead within our hearts.
Or we become like widows.

 

[Psychotheosophy]

A usurpation is a taking by force.
It denies either God’s power over sin,
Or our free will.

…Or a man may feel abandoned by God,
Or may feel that his sins are unforgivable.

But,

God meets us there,
On the cross,
And for those who are willing,

Heals our relationship with Him,
(Which remains mysterious)
In Christ.

If God is Happiness, Unity, Life, etc.,
And sin is separation from God,
Then sin is the cause,

Of suffering, illness, and death, etc.,
But a perfect healing
Rids these forever.

Therefore,

Fasting is not about having power
Over food and water.
Fasting is about having power

Over sin,
By climbing upon the cross,
With Christ.

 

[JRKH]

A usurpation is a taking by force.
It denies either God’s power over sin,
Or our free will.

There isn’t anything
That usurps God’s place
In our hearts

St. John of the Cross makes sense.

God has power over sin.
But we can not become like God.
We can become like Christ,
Who is 100% man.

Since Christ is 100% God.
Than if we become like Christ,
We can share in His
Power over sin.

Therefore,

It is important after baptism,
Into the Church (the “Bride of Christ”)
To not choose the Life of Christ
To be dead within our hearts.
Or we become like widows.

Usurp may well have been a poor choice of term. I apologize.
But the underlying thought is still valid.
We, by our attachment to sin push God from our heart. We give ourselves over to this sin and become like St John of the Cross says, “dead within our hearts”.
So rather than say the attachment “usurps”, we can say that “WE give over” to the sin by our attachment to it, that place which is rightly God’s.

Peace
James

 

[Psychotheosophy]

Usurp may well have been a poor choice of term. I apologize.
But the underlying thought is still valid.
We, by our attachment to sin push God from our heart. We give ourselves over to this sin and become like St John of the Cross says, “dead within our hearts”.
So rather than say the attachment “usurps”, we can say that “WE give over” to the sin by our attachment to it, that place which is rightly God’s.

Peace
James

Though, we are not Life itself.

Offending (sinning against) the infinite God,
Is an infinite offense.
It requires an infinite payment
For reparation.

St John of the Cross wrote,
In “The Ascent of Mount Carmel”:

We just assert that all the being of creatures compared with the infinite being of God is nothing, and that, therefore, a man attached to creatures is nothing in the sight of God, and even less than nothing, because love causes equality and likeness and even brings the lover lower than the object of his love. In no way, then is such a man capable of union with the infinite being of God. There is no likeness between what is not and what is.

Even if we give our lives as payment,
(let alone fasting),
It is a payment
Of nothing.

…Over sin,
By climbing upon the cross,
With Christ.

But,

Since
Christ = God = Perfect Love,
A sacrifice done with Perfect Love.
Is a powerful act of reparation for sins.

 

[JRKH]

Though, we are not Life itself.

Offending (sinning against) the infinite God,
Is an infinite offense.
It requires an infinite payment
For reparation.

Even if we give our lives as payment,
(let alone fasting),
It is a payment
Of nothing.

But,

Since
Christ = God = Perfect Love,
A sacrifice done with Perfect Love.
Is a powerful act of reparation for sins.

In St Catherine of Sienna’s Dialogues it is addressed similarly.
What God seeks in reparation of sin is perfect contrition for there is no finite physical penance or pain that can recompence the infinite God.

From The Dialogues of St Catherine
However, I wish that you should know, that not all the pains that are given to men in this life are given as punishments, but as corrections, in order to chastise a son when he offends; though it is true that both the guilt and the penalty can be expiated by the desire of the soul, that is, by true contrition, not through the finite pain endured, but through the infinite desire; because God, who is infinite, wishes for infinite love and infinite grief.

…their every pain, whether spiritual or corporeal, from wherever it may come, receives infinite merit, …inasmuch as they possess the virtue of desire, and sustain their suffering with desire, and contrition, and infinite displeasure against their guilt, their pain is held worthy.

Thus we see that it is not pain and penance for their own sake that is pleasing to God but the properly ordered acceptance of pain and penance in perfect contrition.
Pain and suffering will, by their nature be finite. Proper and perfect Contrition is infinite.

Peace
James

 

[Psychotheosophy]

In St Catherine of Sienna’s Dialogues it is addressed similarly.
What God seeks in reparation of sin is perfect contrition for there is no finite physical penance or pain that can recompence the infinite God.

From The Dialogues of St Catherine
However, I wish that you should know, that not all the pains that are given to men in this life are given as punishments, but as corrections, in order to chastise a son when he offends; though it is true that both the guilt and the penalty can be expiated by the desire of the soul, that is, by true contrition, not through the finite pain endured, but through the infinite desire; because God, who is infinite, wishes for infinite love and infinite grief.

…their every pain, whether spiritual or corporeal, from wherever it may come, receives infinite merit, …inasmuch as they possess the virtue of desire, and sustain their suffering with desire, and contrition, and infinite displeasure against their guilt, their pain is held worthy.

Thus we see that it is not pain and penance for their own sake that is pleasing to God but the properly ordered acceptance of pain and penance in perfect contrition.
Pain and suffering will, by their nature be finite. Proper and perfect Contrition is infinite.

Peace
James

God is infinite.
We are not infinite

We naturally desire Happiness.
The more we sacrifice to have Happiness,
The more we Value that Happiness,
The more we Value sacrifice and Happiness.

Sin is infinitely displeasing to God.
In Christ we can share in that infinite displeasure,
And associated infinite grief,
And annihilation of anything displeasing.

In Christ, suffering will end.
And our contrition will end.

 

[Psychotheosophy]

God is infinite.
We are not infinite.

Since God is Unity,
And we are not,
By sharing
In the Cross of Christ,
God helps us where we lack,
And overcome disorder and decomposition.