Sin, it's consequences and psychiatric illness

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John was later diagnosed manic-depressive. He raped his wife and beat his kid severely during his manic period, he got condemned and went to jail for a couple of years. He was very sorry afterwards because he loved his wife and 6 kids. They were married 15 years. She filed for divorce after the crime.

Was the man culpable for his sins?
What would be a just restitution?
Was she right to file for divorce even though he had started his medication and was never violent again?
What should John do when he was a free man again?
 
:confused:

Most of your questions have nothing to do with sin.

His culpability on a moral level depends on all sorts of factors. Bipolar disorder comes with a broad variety of symptoms which can impair people’s cognitive function to varying degrees, so it’s impossible to give a blanket answer simply based on the fact that he has it.

As for whether the wife should divorce him - that has nothing to do with morality, certainly, it’s a prudential judgement. Divorce may be necessary to protect her safety, and the safety of any children they might have.

It’s fine and well to say that he’s not been violent since getting treatment, but it only takes one further episode - ever - and she could end up dead, so the danger can’t be ignored.

Again, questions of what is appropriate restitution and what would be appropriate for him to do when he is released, are also prudential questions, not moral ones. Depends on what he is able to do, what support services and other resources are available to him, and what those he has hurt want him to do for them, if anything.
 
I’m studying some case questions in moral theology, thanks for your answer.
 
Years ago I took some paralegal classes (I actually took all the necessary classes, but couldn’t get in the second internship. So I ended up with a certificate and not a diploma). In one of the classes we went on a tour of a prison. The only “cell block” they had let us in was for those who were of lower IQ. I hate to use the term “Retarded.” Anyway, these men had commited some crime or other. I guess it had been decided that they knew well enough that what they did was wrong.

When it comes to mental illness, I believe the same thing goes. Is the person at a point where they know what they are doing, or did, was wrong. I don’t belive anyone should be let go with a diagnosis, but for those who were mentally impaired should be put in some other institution for “treatment” or whatever you want to call it.

I’m mentally ill myself. I don’t think I was ever at a point where I could have done injury to someone and not know it was wrong. But that’s just me. There are millions of others out there who might get to the point beyond that.

I remember a story I came across several years ago. In England, there was a woman on trial for murdering her boyfriend. Her mother managed to get her diary in as evidence. Apparently when had her period she was like a different person. Kind of like Dr. Jekill (sp?) and Mr. Hyde. I’m not sure what the verdict was.
 
There are souls in hell. Why? Because they enjoy doing evil and find doing good, boring, unexciting, unfulfilling, confining, etc.
Code: 
 There are criminals in jail with partial mental illnesses that are "sorry" that they were caught and are "sorry" that there are consequences for evil behavior.

 Can a man say "I love you" and enjoy the excitement of rape, assault, etc.  Of course, he can say it, but he can also have an oblique meaning for "I love you".  He can mean I love you conceptually, but I still enjoy hurting you.

  Is he sick?  Is he evil? Is he a product of a dysfunctional life?
We don’t know fully.
We protect the innocent. We try to get help for the sick. We pray for those mislead and hope against hope that the sinner comes home and receives God's Mercy(Something we don't humanly comprehend: since Mercy cannot be earned).
 
Michael, Either you’re mentally ill or you’re not. It’s kind of like saying a woman is “slightly” pregnant. She is, or she isn’t. The severity of the illness is what’s looked at.

Me, I expect that if I were to break the law (not that I’m planning to at this point), I would expect to bear the whole burden without excuse. Right now, everything is under control. Not that I’m cured, but that it’s under control. With continued medication and therapy I will be ok. But you also have to remember that not all mentally ill people acknowledge the fact that they need medication.

My advice? Pray for all of them. Only God can read the heart.
 
Was the man culpable for his sins?

That we don’t know unless we know more about the severity of the illness.

What would be a just restitution?

To leave his wife and kids alone, and have contact with them only on their terms.

Was she right to file for divorce even though he had started his medication and was never violent again?

YES, because she has to protect herself and her children. There are no guarantees once violence has occurred.

What should John do when he was a free man again?

Accept the consequences of his sin with grace. Never, EVER try to convince his wife that she has some obligation to remain married to him or have anything to do with him.

BTDT. Can you tell?
 
I’ve also been a victim of a psychotic boyfriend, so I’m answering from that POV. He was bipolar, too, and so am I, so I know a bit about it.

Was the man culpable for his sins?

Probably, up to a point. The severity of his illness counts. But also, he should have realized by then (15 years of marriage) that he needed to avoid getting angry.

What would be a just restitution?

If you’re asking about time in jail, he should either serve the usual sentence, or be confined in a mental institution until someone responsible thinks he could maintain sanity in the general population. He should be given parole based on his future behavior.

His victims should all have restraining orders - no calls, no visits, no going within a certain distance of them, no hanging out in the kids’ school parking lot, etc etc. Any violation - back to the slammer.

Was she right to file for divorce even though he had started his medication and was never violent again?

Absolutely. She has to protect herself and the kids, and the fact that he did these horrible crimes proves he can’t be trusted.

“Started” his medication, yeah, right. My “Mr. Psychotic” did his crimes when he decided he was well enough to go off his meds without the doctor’s consent.

What should John do when he was a free man again?

Make moral restitution by, first and foremost, continuing to take his meds and be under the supervision of a doctor, no matter how well he feels. Any unprescribed stopping should be grounds for putting him back in custody. If he stops his meds, he will repeat his crimes.

Second, he should stay away from anyone he has hurt, or threatened to hurt, unless they invite him, on their own. I.e. them saying “OK” after he calls and cries and begs, or threatens, doesn’t count.

I’ve been blessed by a tragedy. “Mr. Psychotic” finally took his own life. I no longer have to look over my shoulder, and neither does his ex-wife, their three kids, her new husband, and the people who turned him in for stabbing the wife and molesting his daughter. I think there were 14 or so of us on the police protection list.

It has been 25 years, and he’s been dead for 24 of them, and I *still *get tense whenever I see the model and color of truck he drove in my rear view mirror. (Thank goodness they are rare now.)

The damage is permanent. It is not undone by an apology, or jail time, or money. The only thing that undoes it is safety. And I have a couple of friends whose abusers are still alive. It’ll be a *long *time before they feel completely safe.

Heart of Jesus, broken for our sins, have mercy on us.

Ruthie
 
One thing that some of you have not considered…is the fact that a large per cent of Bipolar/Manic Depressive people stop taking their medications. Often times the medications make them feel listless and they don’t like that, so they quit taking the meds. When that happens…the cycles can be deeper and more difficult to deal with.

Perhaps the wife was well aware of that, and did not, due to the general nature and character of the husband, trust him to faithfully keep to a prescribed regiment of medications necessary to prevent onsets of the illness. Her move to divorce him may well have been a “sef-defense” mechanism or reaction caused by impending fear or fears for the future. If the husband was “historically” unreliable in a day to day sense, then her fears could be viewed as fairly well grounded.

Was he guilty of “sin”? Yes, no, maybe. That is a “quantitative” judgment that would have to be made by a Psychiatrist or two determine the severity of the illness and the persons level of cognition where right and wrong are concerned. The man could possibly be so afflicted that he has no cognitive ability to determine right from wrong, or he could be mildly enough afflicted to be able to discern the difference between right and wrong, but still be wily enough to use the illness in a manipulative fashion, and try to mask guilt or evade guilt under the guise of “illness”.

Its far from a “cut and dried” question…far too many variables available to make a definitive answer…and barring firsthand experience and access to diagnostic information…the only answers can be “highly speculative” at best.
 
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