Single women with married male friends -- good idea, or bad idea?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Gertabelle
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
G

Gertabelle

Guest
I am 47 years old, and a single mom (divorced with decree of nullity). I don’t have any male friends

I have some very close female friends who are married, but I barely know their husbands – even my son’s godfather! – because I think it’s a bad idea for me, as a single woman, to be friends with married men.

When we’re all together at someone’s house (or Boy Scout events, or church functions), we all seem to enjoy each other’s company very much. These are good men who love Our Lord and His Church. But I would never call or email or just go over and visit with them one-on-one like I do with my female friends. For me, it’s just part of “guarding my heart” to not let a relationship develop there.

About a year ago, I did need to have several private conversations with one married man – regarding Cub Scout matters and my needing to take over as Cubmaster for awhile. But I kept our two phone calls very much to the point, expressing my need for advice and guidance, nothing more. I also made sure to ask about his wife and to send her my love.

What are your thoughts about this? Should unmarried women stay away from friendships with married men? My younger friends (early 20-somethings) find this idea difficult and even unnecessary, since their once-single male friends are now married, why should their relationships with them change?

I’d appreciate your feedback very much on this.

God bless you.

Gertie
 
I am in my late twenties and I agree with you that (single) women should not have friendships with married men. I believe the personal problems should be discussed with priests or female friends.
 
I agree too.

I don’t think it’s a good idea for a single woman to be close friends with a married man and I don’t think it’s a good idea for a single man to be close friends with a married woman.

Unless that single friend is a friend of the couple.

I just don’t think it’s wise for a married woman or man to go out to dinner, lunch or whatever with a single friend without their spouse with them.

edited to add…I’m in my early thirties and was married at the age of 28. When my husband and I were dating I had male friends who were single and we hung out sometimes…but I don’t do that anymore.
 
Gertabelle said:
What are your thoughts about this? Should unmarried women stay away from friendships with married men? My younger friends (early 20-somethings) find this idea difficult and even unnecessary, since their once-single male friends are now married, why should their relationships with them change?
Click to expand...
Do these younger single friends actually have any close married male friends, or is this just their opinion? The don’t think marriage changes anything? Spouses get the #1 spot, and I think anyone whose close friend of the opposite sex has gotten married would be well aware of how much changes.

I personally don’t care if my husband has casual friendships with women, single or married. But close, intimate friendships? No. We have a hard enough time finding time for each other and our families and friends as it is, especially now with a baby. So for either one of us to take a significant amount of time away from things that are more important wouldn’t be fair or prudent.
 
Gertabelle said:
I am 47 years old, and a single mom (divorced with decree of nullity). I don’t have any male friends

I have some very close female friends who are married, but I barely know their husbands – even my son’s godfather! – because I think it’s a bad idea for me, as a single woman, to be friends with married men.

When we’re all together at someone’s house (or Boy Scout events, or church functions), we all seem to enjoy each other’s company very much. These are good men who love Our Lord and His Church. But I would never call or email or just go over and visit with them one-on-one like I do with my female friends. For me, it’s just part of “guarding my heart” to not let a relationship develop there.

About a year ago, I did need to have several private conversations with one married man – regarding Cub Scout matters and my needing to take over as Cubmaster for awhile. But I kept our two phone calls very much to the point, expressing my need for advice and guidance, nothing more. I also made sure to ask about his wife and to send her my love.

What are your thoughts about this? Should unmarried women stay away from friendships with married men? My younger friends (early 20-somethings) find this idea difficult and even unnecessary, since their once-single male friends are now married, why should their relationships with them change?

I’d appreciate your feedback very much on this.

God bless you.

Gertie
Click to expand...
I think you have done well. If you have male friends who marry or even who are courting in a serious way, make it a point to include their wife/intended in the friendship, treating them as you would a brother and his wife and being sensitive to her natural wariness of your position in her husband’s affections. To the extent that you carry on the friendship in the absence of the wife, such as meeting for lunch or that sort of thing, I’d say a) to have all the same boundaries in place that you would have for a priest or seminarian and b) to make sure the wife is feels that she has been invited whenever you socialize with her husband, save those group work functions that are exclusive to the work group by their nature. (In that case, see boundary (a).) As an example, if she can’t make it on a certain date, see if the date can be changed so that she can join you.

The main rule is this: You cannot be a married man’s friend unless you are a friend of the marriage. The only exception is that you should help someone being abused if they need help to escape their abuse, but even in that case I’d say to help your male friends to find male help if that seems warranted. (You do not help by giving an abuser rationalizations for her abusiveness by giving her a reasonable pretext for jealousy.)

Finally, if a wife thinks your place in her husband’s affections is concerning and possibly not appropriate, respect her sense of things. Yes, she may be over-reacting, but she may also sense things in her husband that you do not. Trust her sense of the situation, and be a friend to her marriage in all things, even if it means distancing yourself from a friend altogether. If she is isolating him from his friends and relatives inappropriately, that is for him to handle, but starting with his male friends and his actual family. That a wife is not wild about socializing with her husband’s female friends is not a red flag. Let her have that boundary, if she wants it.
 
In general, I don’t think that a married person should go seeking friendships with people of the opposite sex. However, if two people are already friends before they get married, I think there are appropriate ways for them to remain friends. As with all premarital friendships, they are going to change once one of them gets married and has a family. That’s natural.
 
Allegra said:
In general, I don’t think that a married person should go seeking friendships with people of the opposite sex. However, if two people are already friends before they get married, I think there are appropriate ways for them to remain friends. As with all premarital friendships, they are going to change once one of them gets married and has a family. That’s natural.
Click to expand...
Yep!👍
 
Allegra said:
In general, I don’t think that a married person should go seeking friendships with people of the opposite sex. However, if two people are already friends before they get married, I think there are appropriate ways for them to remain friends. As with all premarital friendships, they are going to change once one of them gets married and has a family. That’s natural.
Click to expand...
I think if you’re friends beforehand it’s totally okay to remain friends. I have friends from college and high school I still talk to who are married. I think you’re being too cautious. That’s an antiquated belief in my opinion. As far as friendships changing any friendship changes after marriage, not just opposite sex. This is ridiculous. That you don’t socialize with your child’s godfather is especially weird in my opinion as well.
 
It’s also a matter of who the people are.

Over the course of my life, it would be fair to say that my closest friends have been girls/women. Even now that I’m a 48 year old married man, a couple of my closest friends are women I work with. But they’re married, and I don’t socialize with them outside of work.

And I’ve always been very open with my wife–and I’ll say things like, “Betty Sue and I went out for coffee today.” My wife is fine with that.

HOWEVER, as a married man, I’d be uncomfortable having a friendship with a single woman unless my wife were also part of the friendship. Would I have any concerns at all about being alone with said single woman to discuss Cub Scouts? Absolutely not. Would there be a problem if I started helping the unmarried female friend with her home repairs when my wife wasn’t present? Mmmm…yeah, probably. (matter of fact, a married male neighbor started spending too much time helping a divorced single mom who lives next door to him…and his wife put a stop to it. 😉 )
 
I’ve always tended to be between the “baby boomers” of 50’s and the “flower children” of the teens in the 60’s. I think men and women can be and should be friends, but a good deal of caution should be taken.

Mostly, I consider how a relationship was started.

When a relationship had any romantic undertones then it’s best to do as you say and keep those away.

When there was clearly no romantic beginning and mostly this a friend of a friend or friend of a family member, or husband of a friend then I think it would be good to foster these friendships. With you being single you may need to see how men interact with life. Yet, there is no need and it would be a bit strained to spend lots of time alone with these male friends.

There are exceptions that a non-romantic relationship has been solidly established after a period of an undeveloped, but could have been romantic situation. These are the tough calls, sometimes you have to really know how you, they, and either spouses might feel and if there is anything out of sorts to not ever be alone with them.
 
Gertabelle said:
About a year ago, I did need to have several private conversations with one married man – regarding Cub Scout matters and my needing to take over as Cubmaster for awhile. But I kept our **two **phone calls very much to the point, expressing my need for advice and guidance, nothing more. I also made sure to ask about his wife and to send her my love.
Click to expand...
I would not called 2 phone calls with a member of the opposite sex when the purpose is to help run a committee or club a friendship.

I have had several married friends because I was first friends with the husband. We would have a common interest, end up meeting while doing the common interest and I would eventually meet the wife.

As long as conversations and meeting locations are kept appropriate and I am positive he tells his wife EVERYTHING, I don’t see a problem with it.

In my experience however, once the kids came along, then the man’s time was REALLY limited and the friendship fizzled

Angie
 
When it works, it is usually related to:
  1. There is a professional / business / community / sport activity relationship and the interaction stays under this umbrella.
  2. The two were friends before the marriage and now all three are friends (husband, wife, single person).
Outside of these two, it is going to be tough.

If a married guy so much as meets a single person for coffee, he could be criticized. However, there are sports where guys and gals of any marital status wrestle each other, and it is fine, inside the training environment.

If a married person were to give a small present to an unmarried person, he could be criticized. However, if a married guy in a big company created a business deal where someone of either sex benefited massively, and all the interactions were professional, then that is fine.

That seems to be the way the social norms work.

There are people I would love to know better and some of them are not married. If I figure a way to work with them at some point, that would be incredible. If I don’t, my loss. Personally, I think God set up social norms in areas like this to make you work harder to create something.

However, if I try to get to know these people before working with them, it likely either won’t work or could blow up in my face. So, I interact enough to let them know I like them and everything is cool on my end. However, I am also cautious because outside of a working relationship, anything I say could be subject to misinterpretation or even attack. So I don’t say a lot. If someone(s) seem to be “attacking”, of course I respect their opinion and don’t interact until he / she tell’s me that we are cool. And I am not easily offended and don’t mind disagreement, debates, or whatever. Of course attackers may have to get in line. I debate deriding atheists all the time. I have had people rain submissions on me, up to 9 in a single class. One girl left a golf ball sized hematoma on my neck from a half assed choke hold that I eventually escaped from. I guess I passed the test, because in the next class she invited me to train with her and her girlfriend. Since, I am not doing that sport now, working relationships are the only option for me.

Also, if you are a believer, then I think it is o.k. to believe that God knows how to show you the way. A friend of mine moved to Los Angeles a few years ago, and I lost his phone number. Well, he lost mine as well. For a while, I wondered if he moved on and was not interested in continuing the friendship. Then recently he was doing some consulting for the State of California, and he needed help reviewing a case in an area of my expertise. So he left a message for me at work, and we were able to reconnect. So, things have a way of working out, especially if you stay in faith.
 
Anglewannabe said:
I would not called 2 phone calls with a member of the opposite sex when the purpose is to help run a committee or club a friendship.
Click to expand...
We’d known each other for about four years through Scouts – lots of leader meetings and activities such as camping, hiking, service projects, den meetings, etc. – and his two daughters have sung in my choir for years. I’ve been to his home many times – choir potlucks, bridal shower for his older daughter, Easter brunch, and so on.

Those two phone calls came out of our years of being family friends, and they were the only time we ever had one-on-one time. That was my point anyway – one-on-one time with a married man is just not something I do in general.

Gertie
 
dedo said:
If a married guy so much as meets a single person for coffee, he could be criticized. However, there are sports where guys and gals of any marital status wrestle each other, and it is fine, inside the training environment.
Click to expand...
Wrestling the opposite sex is a clear violation of modesty. Some dioceses and schools have prohibited such contact including tackle football.
 
Without referring to other posts: I think people need friends of both sexes to stay sane. There’s nothing wrong with friendships between single and married people. Occasion of sin obviously still needs to be avoided, and scandal, but it takes a somewhat easy-to-scandalize mind to be scandalized by contact sports per se.
 
There will always be attractions. Especially among younger folks. However, age and busy lifestyles tend to reduce the temptations.
 
Coco82 said:
I think if you’re friends beforehand it’s totally okay to remain friends. I have friends from college and high school I still talk to who are married. I think you’re being too cautious. That’s an antiquated belief in my opinion. As far as friendships changing any friendship changes after marriage, not just opposite sex. This is ridiculous. That you don’t socialize with your child’s godfather is especially weird in my opinion as well.
Click to expand...
I think you have confused my post with the OPs. My child’s Godfather is my brother and I certainly socialize with him.
 
I am a single woman with a married male friend. I have known him since childhood, therefore obviously way before he was married . There was never any romantic history between us.

While we are certainly still friends, there has definitely been a change in the friendship since his marriage. We don’t talk as much, and certainly his wife has taken over a lot of the emotional support role I had. I understand and accept that.

I have also unfortunately been in the situation of befriending a man at work who was already married, and developing a strong attraction to him. After some incidents that bordered on emotional adultery, he moved away for a new job, and at that time I decided it was best if I no longer kept in touch with him.

I think single women CAN be friends with married men, but with a strong sense of boundaries. I think there’s also a difference between being friends of a couple, and being friends with the man only, with no real interaction with the wife.
 
Gertabelle said:
We’d known each other for about four years through Scouts – lots of leader meetings and activities such as camping, hiking, service projects, den meetings, etc. – and his two daughters have sung in my choir for years. I’ve been to his home many times – choir potlucks, bridal shower for his older daughter, Easter brunch, and so on.

Those two phone calls came out of our years of being family friends, and they were the only time we ever had one-on-one time. That was my point anyway – one-on-one time with a married man is just not something I do in general.

Gertie
Click to expand...
Well, since you know him well, all the more reason for me to think 2 one-on-one calls for a specific purpose is innocent
 
I see no problem with members of married couples having single (or married, widowed, or engaged) friends of the opposite gender. I agree that attempts should be made to befriend and include the other spouse where possible, but I see no reason for a blanket prohibition against mixed gender friendships.

As a woman, I benefit from having several close male friends, both married and single. I enjoy sharing ideas and interests with likeminded people. My interests and personality are more stereotypically “masculine” than those of most women, and in many situations, I find I mesh better with men than women (though I do have several close female friends). My husband benefits from this in several ways, both directly and indirectly.

A) I’m an extrovert who is energized by fulfilling social interaction, so my friendships make me a happier person. The probability of finding people with whom to have fulfilling interactions increases if one gender isn’t artificially excluded. My husband is an introvert and can’t meet that need of mine entirely, though he is my favourite person to be around. He also has his own need for periodic solitude to recharge himself, and I like to give him the headspace he needs.

B) As a modern society, we place unrealistic expectations upon husbands and wives to be everything to their spouses-- friend, lover, companion, co-parent, nurturer, protector, intellectual partner, domestic support, fellow traveller, spiritual guide, etc. When we expect our spouses to be the primary source of our life satisfaction, we place unfair expectations on them. I am in favour of relieving the undue burden placed on spouses to fulfill each other in every possible way. Focus on the core and outsource the rest as needed to friends and family! If I lift weights, participate in advocacy, discuss corporate strategy, speak another language, or play in a band with a friend or family member, I am getting personal fulfillment that I need to be a positive contributor to my family, marriage, and health.

C) My husband benefits from my being socialized among men. Having experience hearing a male perspective from friends assists me in perspective-taking in my marriage. I’m better able to appreciate my husband’s qualities and contributions, and it helps me communicate more effectively than if my only social interactions with men were with their wives alongside.

D) Competition is good for marital attraction. I don’t mean this in the sense of sexual competition. My husband seeing me appreciated–even platonically–by other men helps him value me highly and enhances his incentive to be appealing to me, and vice-versa. We both feel proud to be married to one another, and the fact that we are both appealing to the opposite sex makes our being married all the sweeter. Having even indirect competition forces us to hold ourselves to high standards and continue to grow and evolve together.

E) Our friends’ relationships benefit because they have a lab-like environment in which to observe DH’s and my marriage. We live our faith, and I think that’s inspiring to others. Having a relevant example gives others tacit permission to be counter-cultural in their lives and embrace Chuch teaching.

F) Our son benefits, because he’s plugged into a wider support group with a broader set of interests. He sees gender stereotypes as effectively non-existent and learns that women and men are truly equals (equals with beautiful, subtle differences).

All that being said, I heartily encourage my husband to have female friends for the same reasons. It makes him a better man, husband, and father to be around women other than me, both married and single.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top