Sinning against the Immaculate Heart of Mary

[dje101]

Hello,

I was reading an article about the “operation: storm heaven” prayer movement that Cardinal Burke is starting, and it said that there are many things it is intended for, one of which was “make reparation for the sins and offenses committed against the Immaculate Heart of Mary”. Coming from a protestant background and still pretty new to the faith, this is somewhat confusing. I am only recently (as in, within the last couple of weeks) started to get interested in Mariology, so I don’t have very much knowledge when it comes to things related to Marian spirituality.

Could someone please explain what this means, and clarify why we would need to make reparations for sins committed against Mary rather than against God? I know we don’t worship her, but the wording is somewhat confusing to me. Thanks.

 

[PS3510]

A person can offend God by committing a sin against another person (for example, if you badmouth a priest). The reparation is offered to God for the offense.

Jesus requested reparation for sins against the Immaculate Heart of Mary in a revelation to Sr. Lucia, one of the seers at Fatima, in connection with what is known as the “Five First Saturdays“ devotion. For a list of the five main offenses that can be committed and a bit of the history of this devotion, see:

http://www.motherofallpeoples.com/2004/09/the-five-offenses/

God bless.

 

[thistle]

A person can offend God by committing a sin against another person (for example, if you badmouth a priest). The reparation is offered to God for the offense.

Jesus requested reparation for sins against the Immaculate Heart of Mary in a revelation to Sr. Lucia, one of the seers at Fatima, in connection with what is known as the “Five First Saturdays“ devotion. For a list of the five main offenses that can be committed and a bit of the history of this devotion, see:

motherofallpeoples.com/2004/09/the-five-offenses/

God bless.

You should also point out to the OP that Catholics are not obligated to believe in private revelations or follow what they say.

 

[AmbroseSJ]

You should also point out to the OP that Catholics are not obligated to believe in private revelations or follow what they say.

Although, the five offenses described in the link are all offenses against sound doctrinal teachings of the Church. IOW, they are not contrived or vision-based alone.

First: blasphemies against the Immaculate Conception
Second: against her Virginity
Third: against the Divine Maternity, refusing, at the same time, to receive her as the Mother of mankind
Fourth: those who seek publicly to implant, in the hearts of children, indifference, disrespect, and even hate for this Immaculate Mother
Fifth: those who revile her directly in her sacred images

 

[Beryllos]

Hello,

I was reading an article about the “operation: storm heaven” prayer movement that Cardinal Burke is starting, and it said that there are many things it is intended for, one of which was “make reparation for the sins and offenses committed against the Immaculate Heart of Mary”. Coming from a protestant background and still pretty new to the faith, this is somewhat confusing. I am only recently (as in, within the last couple of weeks) started to get interested in Mariology, so I don’t have very much knowledge when it comes to things related to Marian spirituality.

Could someone please explain what this means, and clarify why we would need to make reparations for sins committed against Mary rather than against God? I know we don’t worship her, but the wording is somewhat confusing to me. Thanks.

It is confusing to some good Catholics too. I say keep it simple. Love God. Love one another.

 

[auctoris]

I too am a newbie still in RCIA.

First, I think it was good to point out the fact that “Jesus requested reparation for sins against the Immaculate Heart of Mary in a revelation to Sr. Lucia” is a private revelation. Catholics are not compelled to believe or take action based on private revelation.

Second, what is “the Immaculate Heart of Mary” and how can someone “sin against it”?

How is the “Immaculate Heart” of Mary different from the “Heart” of Mary? How are either different that simply saying “sinned against Mary”?

Protestants have a lot of “insider” language that means nothing to most people. This is an example of Catholic language that means nothing to non-Catholics.

Can you use common everyday words and explain “Immaculate Heart of Mary” and how it can be “sinned against”? Can you explain it like you would to a six year old?

Thank you

 

[thenobes]

I too am a newbie still in RCIA.

First, I think it was good to point out the fact that “Jesus requested reparation for sins against the Immaculate Heart of Mary in a revelation to Sr. Lucia” is a private revelation. Catholics are not compelled to believe or take action based on private revelation.

Second, what is “the Immaculate Heart of Mary” and how can someone “sin against it”?

How is the “Immaculate Heart” of Mary different from the “Heart” of Mary? How are either different that simply saying “sinned against Mary”?

Protestants have a lot of “insider” language that means nothing to most people. This is an example of Catholic language that means nothing to non-Catholics.

Can you use common everyday words and explain “Immaculate Heart of Mary” and how it can be “sinned against”? Can you explain it like you would to a six year old?

Thank you

Auctoris,

Mary’s heart was totally directed to and dedicated to God. Mary is also a Type of the Church, that is, she is a true symbol of the Church. Sins against her heart are disparagement of total devotion to God, and also especially in regard to the the Church, mockery and disparagement of such devotion and of those having such total devotiion.

Secularism in its essence is anti-Mary.

-Steve

 

[auctoris]

Auctoris,

Mary’s heart was totally directed to and dedicated to God. Mary is also a Type of the Church, that is, she is a true symbol of the Church. Sins against her heart are disparagement of total devotion to God, and also especially in regard to the the Church, mockery and disparagement of such devotion and of those having such total devotiion.

Secularism in its essence is anti-Mary.

-Steve

Is there a difference between sinning against Mary, “Mary’s Heart”, and “Mary’s Immaculate Heart”?

So it means “sinning against devotion to God”? It means “being secular”? It means being “against God”?

Please use words a six year old would understand. If you say “disparagement of total devotion” to a six year old, you are going to get a blank stare.

If you were going to involve Mary or her heart, how would you describe the sin?

Thank you

 

[Wesrock]

Well, to keep it simple, sins against Mary are insults to Jesus’ mother, our queen, and His kingdom, and therefore insults against Him Himself. God chose Mary to sanctify and bring about the Incarnation. Her place in the plan of salvation and Heaven is not her own doing, but God’s own work, perhaps one of His greatest. Sins against her are insults to God (not because she is in anyway divine, she is not, but because she is one of God’s own great works). More can be said regarding Mary’s place in Christology and ecclesiology, but I’ll stop there. I’ll just say any veneration given to her (or the saints) is a veneration of God’s work and does have a Christological basis, and from there it follows that it’s appropriate to give reparations for sins against her immaculate heart.

 

[auctoris]

Well, to keep it simple, sins against Mary are insults to Jesus’ mother, our queen, and His kingdom, and therefore insults against Him Himself. God chose Mary to sanctify and bring about the Incarnation. Her place in the plan of salvation and Heaven is not her own doing, but God’s own work, perhaps one of His greatest. Sins against her are insults to God (not because she is in anyway divine, she is not, but because she is one of God’s own great works). More can be said regarding Mary’s place in Christology and ecclesiology, but I’ll stop there. I’ll just say any veneration given to her (or the saints) is a veneration of God’s work and does have a Christological basis, and from there it follows that it’s appropriate to give reparations for sins against her immaculate heart.

Can you provide and example of a “sin against Mary’s Immaculate Heart”?

Also, could it also be called simple a “sin against Mary”?

Thank you

 

[AmbroseSJ]

Can you provide and example of a “sin against Mary’s Immaculate Heart”?

Also, could it also be called simple a “sin against Mary”?

Thank you

To reiterate:
These are the five offenses listed:

First: blasphemies against the Immaculate Conception
Second: against her Virginity
Third: against the Divine Maternity, refusing, at the same time, to receive her as the Mother of mankind
Fourth: those who seek publicly to implant, in the hearts of children, indifference, disrespect, and even hate for this Immaculate Mother
Fifth: those who revile her directly in her sacred images

e.g. The first one: Blasphemies against the Immaculate Conception. This is a Dogma of the Catholic Church. A blasphemy of this type obviously offends Our Blessed Mother, but it is also a sin against the Church and therefore against the Body of Christ, thus against God.

All of the offenses listed are of this type.

e.g. The Fourth: this is a sin against not only our Blessed Mother, but again, against the Church and her teaching and therefore against the Body of Christ, and thus God.

What’s so difficult to understand?

Maybe it’s the idea that there can be a sin against the Immaculate Heart of Mary that seems novel. But even SINNERS can be OFFENDED by things said or done to them!

It would certainly be a far more serious offense if it was directed against our Heavenly Mother and Queen, the Mother of God.

I would be genuinely surprised if this was a real problem with Catholics. If anything, a Catholic can be KNOWN by his love of the Blessed Virgin Mother of God.

When I see a statue of the Mother of God in someone’s yard or garden, I KNOW that a Catholic lives there.

 

[1Lord1Faith]

Hello,

I was reading an article about the “operation: storm heaven” prayer movement that Cardinal Burke is starting, and it said that there are many things it is intended for, one of which was “make reparation for the sins and offenses committed against the Immaculate Heart of Mary”. Coming from a protestant background and still pretty new to the faith, this is somewhat confusing. I am only recently (as in, within the last couple of weeks) started to get interested in Mariology, so I don’t have very much knowledge when it comes to things related to Marian spirituality.

Could someone please explain what this means, and clarify why we would need to make reparations for sins committed against Mary rather than against God? I know we don’t worship her, but the wording is somewhat confusing to me. Thanks.

“Our Lord wants his mother honored for all she suffered for him and with him. After all, she had no sins of her own. She suffered with Jesus to atone for our sins.”
Apostoli, Fr. Andrew, C.F.R. Fatima for Today, 2010.

Read that ^ carefully.

 

[auctoris]

To reiterate:
These are the five offenses listed:

e.g. The first one: Blasphemies against the Immaculate Conception. This is a Dogma of the Catholic Church. A blasphemy of this type obviously offends Our Blessed Mother, but it is also a sin against the Church and therefore against the Body of Christ, thus against God.

All of the offenses listed are of this type.

e.g. The Fourth: this is a sin against not only our Blessed Mother, but again, against the Church and her teaching and therefore against the Body of Christ, and thus God.

What’s so difficult to understand?

Maybe it’s the idea that there can be a sin against the Immaculate Heart of Mary that seems novel. But even SINNERS can be OFFENDED by things said or done to them!

It would certainly be a far more serious offense if it was directed against our Heavenly Mother and Queen, the Mother of God.

I would be genuinely surprised if this was a real problem with Catholics. If anything, a Catholic can be KNOWN by his love of the Blessed Virgin Mother of God.

When I see a statue of the Mother of God in someone’s yard or garden, I KNOW that a Catholic lives there.

That’s a LOT of Catholic language to explain to six year old. I’m not much closer to knowing what is is other than it’s bad and it involves Mary. Can you use a six-year old vocabulary without words specific to Catholicism?

If I don’t “love the blessed virgin Mary”, am I not a Catholic?

Thank you

 

[Bonnie]

If I don’t “love the blessed virgin Mary”, am I not a Catholic?

Thank you

I hope not! I’m sure some people get their knickers in a twist because I don’t venerate Mary as so many seem to, but it is not a requirement. When I was where you are, the priest who was teaching me (no RCIA back then) asked me if I was running into any difficulties. I told him Mary was a stumbling block for me - not as the mother of Jesus, not even as the mother of God (as I understood Jesus is God) - but all the variations of devotion to her.

He asked me if I could trust the Church even if I couldn’t “trust” Mary - I said sure. He said OK.

 

[Wesrock]

Are you six years old, auctoris? I suppose I’m being a little rude and I apologize, but I think within Catholicism, our faith isn’t at a six year old level. Faith isn’t simple. Nor should it be. I think that’s an error some make, thinking faith should be simple. I’m pretty certain you understand what we mean by her immaculate conception, her perpetual virginity, her being Mother of God, and using icons in veneration or in defiling them in order to be insulting, and if there are gaps in your knowledge, I know you are capable in understanding these things. If you want a six year old level, it’s insulting Jesus’ mother. There’s more to it, but a six year old wouldn’t get it, and that’s fine. That’s for when they get older, and the specifics don’t need to be watered down for adults. God made us rational beings who become capable of understanding more as we age.

As for needing to love, Mary, I don’t think anyone is required to feel some type of deep emotion for the Blessed Mother or is required to engage in private devotion. But she is one of God’s great works, she is a fellow Christian, and she is our Lord’s mother and our Queen Mother. A level of respect is due, at least insofar as not blaspheming what God has done through her.

 

[auctoris]

Are you six years old, auctoris? I suppose I’m being a little rude and I apologize, but I think within Catholicism, our faith isn’t at a six year old level. Faith isn’t simple. Nor should it be. I think that’s an error some make, thinking faith should be simple. I’m pretty certain you understand what we mean by her immaculate conception, her perpetual virginity, her being Mother of God, and using icons in veneration or in defiling them in order to be insulting, and if there are gaps in your knowledge, I know you are capable in understanding these things. If you want a six year old level, it’s insulting Jesus’ mother. There’s more to it, but a six year old wouldn’t get it, and that’s fine. That’s for when they get older, and the specifics don’t need to be watered down for adults. God made us rational beings who become capable of understanding more as we age.

As for needing to love, Mary, I don’t think anyone is required to feel some type of deep emotion for the Blessed Mother or is required to engage in private devotion. But she is one of God’s great works, she is a fellow Christian, and she is our Lord’s mother and our Queen Mother. A level of respect is due, at least insofar as not blaspheming what God has done through her.

So how do I explain to a six year old what an “immaculate heart of Mary” is and give an example of a sin against it?

C.S. Lewis said that if we can’t explain a complex concept in the simple terms anyone can understand, then we probably don’t understand that concept ourselves.

I’m not trying to be difficult, but so far this entire thread keeps using Catholic words to define other Catholic words. I still don’t know why people say “Mary’s Immaculate Heart” instead of Mary. I still don’t know what an “immaculate heart” is. I don’t know why other words can’t be used to relate the concept since I don’t know what the concept is.

Both Protestants and Catholics often try to explain the faith using the language of their religion. But people usually need the truth spoken in their basic secular language. They can get to the complexities of the language later, but they can understand the initial concepts in their own language.

So, what action could I take that would be a sin again Mary’s immaculate heart and why id the term Mary’s immaculate heart used? How could you explain this sin to a Protestant without referencing Mary (cue the “I wouldn’t, they should come to my mindset first.”)?

I understand if no one here can explain it in basic non-Catholic terms. I sometimes have to find information elsewhere. If/when I do, I’ll re-post it here in the most basic terms.

BTW, this is not just a Catholic thing. Protestants say things like “washed in the blood”. People have no idea what that means. When you ask them to explain it, they say somethin glike “No, you need to learn those words and why only those words will do.” I find that unsatisfactory, wrong, and just plain sinful.

I sympathize. It’s easy for me to tell someone their epistemology is existentially unviable and their metaphysical explanation of morality is logically incoherent. But they have no idea what I’m talking about until I break it down into their language.

 

[Bonnie]

I’m not trying to be difficult, but so far this entire thread keeps using Catholic words to define other Catholic words. I still don’t know why people say “Mary’s Immaculate Heart” instead of Mary. I still don’t know what an “immaculate heart” is. I don’t know why other words can’t be used to relate the concept since I don’t know what the concept is.

You have both a good point & a good question. I’ve always assumed (& we know where that gets us!) that “Immaculate Heart” was just a poetic way of referring to her essence. Just as Sacred Heart refers to the what Jesus is, rather than a part of him.

Some Catholics get really flowery when speaking of spiritual things. Not being a flowery person, I have some trouble relating, too.

 

[Wesrock]

I sympathize. It’s easy for me to tell someone their epistemology is existentially unviable and their metaphysical explanation of morality is logically incoherent. But they have no idea what I’m talking about until I break it down into their language.

Well, what are the traditional associations of the heart? Love, joys, and sorrows. The devotion to the immaculate heart of Mary is a devotion to her interior life. To her bearing and raising Christ. To the mysteries presented to her, from being chosen to bearing God, to finding him in the Temple and her child’s greater mission perhaps first hitting home. Perhaps the worries during his early ministry, people trying to kill him, and other members of the family thinking him mad. The joys she felt in her son’s life to the anguishing sorrow she felt during his passion. It’s a devotion to how Christ’s mother kept all these things in her heart (Luke 2: 51).

To keep it simple, it’s a devotion to and meditation on her personal relationship to and with Jesus throughout his life. That is a devotion to the immaculate heart of Mary. To sin against her immaculate heart? It’s an affront to that relationship and personal life she had with God and Christ. It’s to sin against a mother’s love for her child, in a mother with the purest of hearts and where the child is our Lord and our God.

 

[Beryllos]

 

[auctoris]

Well, what are the traditional associations of the heart? Love, joys, and sorrows. The devotion to the immaculate heart of Mary is a devotion to her interior life. To her bearing and raising Christ. To the mysteries presented to her, from being chosen to bearing God, to finding him in the Temple and her child’s greater mission perhaps first hitting home. Perhaps the worries during his early ministry, people trying to kill him, and other members of the family thinking him mad. The joys she felt in her son’s life to the anguishing sorrow she felt during his passion. It’s a devotion to how Christ’s mother kept all these things in her heart (Luke 2: 51).

To keep it simple, it’s a devotion to and meditation on her personal relationship to and with Jesus throughout his life. That is a devotion to the immaculate heart of Mary. To sin against her immaculate heart? It’s an affront to that relationship and personal life she had with God and Christ. It’s to sin against a mother’s love for her child, in a mother with the purest of hearts and where the child is our Lord and our God.

I think I am doomed to not understand. I’ll seek answers elsewhere.

May be so intertwined with specifically Catholic theology that there is no easy way to explain it. Maybe it’s my Protestant background (in RCIA now). I’ve been studying Mary but this just doesn’t make sense to me. I think it may be an esoteric aspect of Catholicism or for Catholics who put some particular emphasis on Mariology. I know for people like that it is hard for them to understand that many Christians go their entire lives without much thought about Mary as anything but a historical figure. For the non-Mary people, it is very difficult to understand the language being used since it comes across as so abstract and not directly related to the most important aspects of the Christian faith.

I know Mariologist believe it is tied intrinsically to the most important aspects of the faith. But also know lifetime Christians (Protestants and Catholics) who would read this thread, still have no idea what its talking about, and believe it doesn’t really matter in the first place.

So, I will assume it is some esoteric aspect I am missing until I find a better understanding elsewhere.

I would encourage Catholics to be careful in using “Catholicish” language as Evangelicals use “Evangelicish” language. Like, “She was slain in the spirit, blood bought, and washed in the blood as Jesus was the propitiation for our iniquities. We pray a hedge of protection as we offer ourselves up. Let the mercy seat of Melchizedek be satisfactory. May the angel of the Lord find the blood of the lamb on our doorway and pass over. Let us not have a jezebel spirit. Please let all the lost walk the aisle and find shelter beneath the cross.”

All of that means exactly nothing to most people. And that’s what “sinning against the Immaculate heart of Mary” sounds like to most people.