So I attended my first Vespers at an Eastern Catholic Church

[TrueLight]

It was at the end of a long day that started at 9 and ended at 4. I decided to attend the
Vespers service at the Russian Catholic Church, which started at 6. I had thought about going home because I had so much to do but I really wanted to do this.

The attendees at the service were:
The priest
The deacon
A server
Three choir members
2 people in the congregation, including me

As I entered the church a little early, I met a gentleman who stood in the vestibule who barely said hi.

I walked into the tiny church and saw another man who was sitting in one of two chairs set to the side. He was folding programs. I asked him if the service started at 6 he said yes. I asked for the bathroom and he directed me. When I came back, I asked if I could sit in the other chair and if it was okay if I took pictures. He said yes. He did not ask if it was my first time or other small talk. We sat next to each other silently.

I sat in one of two chairs that were off to the side. I tried to make conversation. I asked what time the service started and he told me. I asked where the bathroom was and he told me. I was not asked if I were visiting for the first time.

The priest came in and gave me a small smile. He said nothing else to me. I thought it was a matter of staying silent in the church, but then he went to the place in front behind the doors. The guy who was folding programs ended up being a deacon. He went behind the doors as well, to dress I presume. I could overhear the friendly banter between priest and deacon. The priest was speaking pretty loudly. They were speaking of personal matters. So I guess it’s okay to talk.

The guy who was outside came inside. He apparently was a choir member. Another younger one came in and said nothing to me. I was sitting by myself. He stood in the choir area. Another woman came who was apparently the choir director came in. The priest came out and lit some candle, not saying a word.

One attendee came and gave me a small nod.

The vespers service was okay. There was an issue with the music, but I won’t go into it here.

I never felt so ignored in my life.

After, I walked out and wondered why I bothered.

 

[kitkatty]

So sorry to hear of this experience. From your description of it I can understand you feeling the way you do. I have been to different parishes both Western and Eastern( not for Vespers though) and yes you can come across some of those. I m not saying you will do this but please dont judge all Eastern Catholic parishes by this experience. Also since beside the clergy and another person you were pretty much alone you didn`t really get to meet anyone in the parish, although it is probably a small number and I say that about the number of parishoners in a Russian Catholic parish from reading posts by Five Loaves.

 

[MisterCorduroy]

You will find that in most Eastern Catholic and Orthodox parishes that few people come to Great Vespers. Even in the vibrant Antiochian Orthodox parish I once attended we had 3-10 people out of 300.

I’ve been to several friendly Eastern parishes that welcomed me right away, but some of the more ethnic parishes can seem cold. This is often because the majority of parishioners are related to each other or grew up together and their lives are already “full”, so making new friends is low priority. They see people come and go, so it can take a year of regular attendance before you feel welcome. This is not uniquely Eastern as I have found this in Roman parishes too.

My first visit to an Orthodox parish resulted in my wife leaving offended and vowing never to go back. We persevered and stayed for 14 years, during which time I became a tonsured Reader and Pastoral Assistant. Even then I still often felt like an outsider.

I would encourage you to ask yourself what your motivation for going was. What were your expectations. Worshiping God is never a waste of time. When I go to Adoration at the local Roman parish no one greets me or talks to me, but it certainly isn’t a waste of time. The point of Vespers is to prepare for the Sunday Divine Liturgy as sundown is the beginning of the next day.

I hope that on your next visit you are able to focus on praying and listen to what the Holy Spirit is saying through the Psalms and readings.

 

[Diakonia]

I’m presuming that you went to St Michael’s. If so, I am horrified and apologize for the poor treatment you received. I’m acquainted with Father Economos Roman, the Administrator of the parish, and know St Michael’s to ordinarily be complimented for its welcoming outlook toward visitors. The only guess that I can even make (and it wouldn’t excuse this) is that the question about taking photos may have led someone to think you were a tourist, just dropping by to see the ‘other’ Catholics.

I’m going to follow-up on this. Meantime, I’d hope that you’ll visit it again, with hopefully very different results.

 

[TrueLight]

The only guess that I can even make (and it wouldn’t excuse this) is that the question about taking photos may

Maybe. I only took pictures before Vespers started though and I took it for 5Loaves who asked me to take pictures.

 

[TrueLight]

I hope that on your next visit you are able to focus on praying and listen to what the Holy Spirit is saying through the Psalms and readings.

I did try and even sang a couple of “Lord have mercies” and tried to cross myself whenever anyone else did, but when I left, I felt lonely and sad.

I hope that on your next visit…

I think it will be a while before I venture out again.

 

[tbtcom1213]

I was there last week for their Vespers liturgy. It also coincided with the conclusion of the San Gennaro festival.

If you’re free next Saturday at the same time go to Divine liturgy at Saint George. Be sure to sit at the front by the processional crucifix. In that pew you’ll have access to the missal and someone will guide you.

 

[TrueLight]

I was there last week for their Vespers liturgy. It also coincided with the conclusion of the San Gennaro festival.

Was your experience the same?

If you’re free next Saturday at the same time go to Divine liturgy at Saint George. Be sure to sit at the front by the processional crucifix. In that pew you’ll have access to the missal and someone will guide you.

It wasn’t even a matter of being guided. I went to a DL at an Orthodox church before and I did have a guide, but of course I didn’t expect to have the same experience. I just thought because it was a small parish the folks would be happy to see visitors.

 

[AntalKalnoky]

I attended One Evening Vespers with Full Room, standing Only. VERY Solemn Profound Readings and Chants I didn’t Understand. :byzsoc::heaven: But it Was Most Devout Devotion to God, not a social. I can see how it is recognized Equivalent to Vigil Mass in Catholic Church. We don’t socialize at Mass either.

 

[TrueLight]

I attended One Evening Vespers with Full Room, standing Only. VERY Solemn Profound Readings and Chants I didn’t Understand. :byzsoc::heaven: But it Was Most Devout Devotion to God, not a social. I can see how it is recognized Equivalent to Vigil Mass in Catholic Church. We don’t socialize at Mass either.

Oh please. I’m not talking about socializing. And this issue exists in the Latin rite as well.

You don’t ignore your brother or sister in Christ.

It’s not like anyone came over to me after the service either.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Exactly one year ago, I set foot for the very first time in an UGCC parish. The priest was already doing the Proskomide so he was busy. The subdeacon greeted me when he walked in but after the priest signaled to him that there was somebody new in the parish. After Divine Liturgy I was invited to come down for coffee at the parish basement.

And I never stopped coming after that.

Every UGCC parish I’ve been to people have been warm and welcoming. But I have been to Latin parishes with a small congregation where nobody minded me.

 

[tbtcom1213]

Was your experience the same?

It wasn’t even a matter of being guided. I went to a DL at an Orthodox church before and I did have a guide, but of course I didn’t expect to have the same experience. I just thought because it was a small parish the folks would be happy to see visitors.

My experience was okay. I arrived at about 520 , asked the sacristan (?) If I could take pictures and he said yes so I photographed all the icons and the stunning vestments on. display. I then told him I would be back in time for vespers. I walked the route of thesan gennaro festival and quickly walked back despite the exuberant crowd. Fortunately the vespers started approximately six minutes late. The choir (two women and one man in a cassock ) were warning up and then began the intonations. During the service a couple of festival attendees passed by but it was me and two other persons attending the vespers. I thought it was beautiful. At the end the priest deacon and server. brought out the icon and venerated it with incense candles and osculations. A woman from the choir recognized me from the last time I was there. She invited me to the Sunday divine liturgy and was nice. I left after venerating the icons and that was that. I will post up my pictures on my blog.

 

[ciero]

I’m sorry you felt so unwelcome at St. Michael’s…my experience there has always been very welcoming. Every time I’ve been there it was like being in a sardine can…lots of people…with fellowship afterwards. I haven’t been for vespers in quite a few years though…I’m sure things would be different at a Sunday Liturgy.

 

[ciero]

Exactly one year ago, I set foot for the very first time in an UGCC parish. The priest was already doing the Proskomide so he was busy. The subdeacon greeted me when he walked in but after the priest signaled to him that there was somebody new in the parish. After Divine Liturgy I was invited to come down for coffee at the parish basement.

And I never stopped coming after that.

Every UGCC parish I’ve been to people have been warm and welcoming. But I have been to Latin parishes with a small congregation where nobody minded me.

My experience with the Ukrainians has been quite mixed over the years. 3 times I have been told I was not welcome to attend services because I wasn’t Ukrainian. Once in San Francisco, once in Denver and one in Pennsylvania, all in Ukrainian “catholic” churches. Other parishes were quite welcoming, some were indifferent.

 

[TrueLight]

I’m sorry you felt so unwelcome at St. Michael’s…my experience there has always been very welcoming. Every time I’ve been there it was like being in a sardine can…lots of people…with fellowship afterwards. I haven’t been for vespers in quite a few years though…I’m sure things would be different at a Sunday Liturgy.

Maybe the people were shy. I don’t know. The choir members may have been focusing on getting themselves together. I did expect the priest to be friendlier though.

 

[Elizium23]

I received a very warm welcome when I visited a Byzantine Catholic parish. I rode my bicycle and arrived early. The priest met me in the narthex and said hello. I said I am a Roman Catholic, and he said “well, we won’t hold that against you” with a smile. I found a seat by the icon of St. Katherine of Alexandria. Then the fun started - the police arrived and wanted to search me. A neighbor had reported that I was “going through the parking lot, looking in cars.” I had been looking through cars, trying to find a bicycle rack or likely place to tie my bike. When the police officer finished searching me, the priest told me apologetically that the neighbors keep a close eye on the church, which seems like a good thing. Over the course of a few more visits, I got to know some of the parishioners. One had been seeking the right place for himself, had tried various Orthodox churches, and he made it known that many of the Eastern churches were ethnically oriented and not welcoming to outsiders. Some other people I met were Roman Catholics who were disillusioned with the Latin Church’s liturgy. Others were ethnic Slavs; one woman was impressed with the way I pronounced the words as we sang a hymn and asked me if I was Slavic. (I am not, I just love languages and I am a natural mimic.) I asked if I could join the choir, but Father said he’d like to see me on a more regular basis. Soon after that, I decided that the commute was too hard, and I’d better give a fair chance to my local Latin parish, and I did not return.

But I developed a great love for the Eastern Churches during my visits there, and in a nutshell, I found that parish to be quite welcoming. I highly suggest that you give another chance to the East. It will be worth it.

 

[ciero]

Maybe the people were shy. I don’t know. The choir members may have been focusing on getting themselves together. I did expect the priest to be friendlier though.

I have always found Fr Romanos to be very friendly & welcoming…maybe try giving them another chance…the Liturgy next time. What was the problem with the choir…they were always very good, but then again I haven’t been in a while.

 

[TrueLight]

But I developed a great love for the Eastern Churches during my visits there, and in a nutshell, I found that parish to be quite welcoming. I highly suggest that you give another chance to the East. It will be worth it.

I visited this Orthodox Church a few months back.

In all fairness, I emailed the pastor beforehand and he had a guide waiting for me at the DL. Everyone was nice and welcoming. Someone gave me the blessed bread (forgot what you call it) on the way back from communion and whispered "welcome’ to me. After the DL we went downstairs and had food. They told me to come back for Vespers.

Too bad it’s not an Eastern Catholic church.

 

[TrueLight]

I have always found Fr Romanos to be very friendly & welcoming…maybe try giving them another chance…the Liturgy next time. What was the problem with the choir…they were always very good, but then again I haven’t been in a while.

LOL what I meant is that they may have been studying their music.

 

[ciero]

LOL what I meant is that they may have been studying their music.

Maybe…I don’t know who is directing the choir now but it used to be Father’s wife.