Social Consequence of Gay Marriage

  • Thread starter Thread starter Brandon_Rimmer_1
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Yesterday’s taboos? Marrying a 13 year old was legal in the US in the 1950s, look at Jerry Lee Lewis.

Ages of consent have been extremely variable over time.

rossum
The question is do we want to go back to the times when girls could be plucked for marriage so young?

I hope you read the complete REAL Women of Canada articles. It also brought up the mobilization of polygamy advocates there as a result of SS’M’. Does society wish to return to polygamy as an acceptable family structure?
,
 
The question is do we want to go back to the times when girls could be plucked for marriage so young?

I hope you read the complete REAL Women of Canada articles. It also brought up the mobilization of polygamy advocates there as a result of SS’M’. Does society wish to return to polygamy as an acceptable family structure?
You were the one who was looking to “yesterday”:
We know from experience that yesterday’s unthinkable taboos are today’s “alternative lifestyles”.
As to polygamy, your unchanging God seems to have been perfectly happy for the Biblical patriarchs and kings to have had multiple wives. Which particular version of “yesterday” would you like to return to? Maybe with modern science and human cloning we could give everyone 700 spouses, of whatever sex they wanted, just like Solomon.

rossum
 
I enjoy being here at CAF…it is one of the more…“considerate” religious sites…there are exceptions of course in any discussion.🙂

I simply wish to share my opinion…interesting how one’s shared opinion becomes “proslytizing” when it’s not shared by some people.

You are certainly within your rights to petition the moderators I be “disiplined” or even banned.

I am very glad that President Obama came “out of the closet” in regards to same sex marriage…

Your question “Have you tried proslytizing in forums of people of other faiths like in Muslim…” sounds very close to my Quaker ears “When did you quit beating your wife?”
No matter how it is answered is damning IMO…at best it would mean I need to defend myself…I don’t need to IMO. How you wish to portray my motives and feelings is certainly within your perogative friend.

Peace to you.
She (he?) whatever, also tried to suggest I was not Catholic when I disagreed with her on public policy, though not with Church teaching.

Long rants with few links to any objective or reliable source for what is a lot of bogeyman posting seems a bit off track for a discussion forum.

It’s also a sin, IMO, the sin of calumny, to try and demonize an entire group of God’s children based on a lot of specious rhetoric. This is hate-mongering at it’s worst and has no place in a discussion thread.

There have not been gay families long enough to draw any conclusions. There are certainly many many one-parent families, which also seem to not fit the mold of maximum probability for positive expectation that a stable two-parent family has.

Unfortunately, the rate of stability in two-parent, two-gender families is woefully small.
 
InSearchofGrace, I’m still waiting for the published, peer-reviewed studies you were thinking of when you said:
Never mind that a large body of social scientific research indicates that children thrive best with a mother and father who teach them gender identity and sex role expectations.
I’m under the impression that such scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies do not exist.
 
She (he?) whatever, also tried to suggest I was not Catholic when I disagreed with her on public policy, though not with Church teaching.

Long rants with few links to any objective or reliable source for what is a lot of bogeyman posting seems a bit off track for a discussion forum.

It’s also a sin, IMO, the sin of calumny, to try and demonize an entire group of God’s children based on a lot of specious rhetoric. This is hate-mongering at it’s worst and has no place in a discussion thread.
The person doing the hate-mongering is not InSearchofGrace. (Which I agree has no place in a discussion thread.)

Think about it.
😉
 
InSearchofGrace, I’m still waiting for the published, peer-reviewed studies you were thinking of when you said:

I’m under the impression that such scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies do not exist.
Well, what do we have here. A new CAF member from the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster who wants to be spoon-fed with “scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies” that show children thrive best with a mother and a father, who will teach them gender identity and sex role expectations. Studies which he is prepared to reject!

Tell you what, Biblepoe, I would accommodate you but I don’t want to hold your hand completely. You have to do a little work towards your own education. What I will do for you, however, since you reacted to this paragraph from my post,
Never mind that a large body of social scientific research indicates that children thrive best with a mother and father who teach them gender identity and sex role expectations. This was the conclusion of a Committee of the French National Assembly, which recommended, in January 2006, that France not accept same-sex marriage due to its detrimental effect on children. The French Committee criticized studies on same-sex parenting that claimed it had no ill effects on children, on the basis that these studies lacked scientific rigor, included inadequate sampling, and showed a lack of objectivity.
is to provide the link to the report on which the French National Assembly based its rejection of legalization of same sex ‘marriage’ on June 15, 2011. Good day for the France, don’t you agree? The French National Assembly declared: Children now have rights and "to systematically give preference to adult aspirations over respect for these rights is not possible any more.”

Here is the link to the certified report in pdf format in English, condensed to 142 pages, with the original in French, consisting of 453 pages.

REPORT SUBMITTED
ON BEHALF OF THE MISSION OF INQUIRY
ON THE
FAMILY AND THE RIGHTS OF CHILDREN


I am sure you have the ability to obtain the links to the studies embedded in said report and call them up.

Here’s another, Do Mothers and Fathers Matter, a brief article with links to the studies.

Okay, get those fingers working and prime that brain of yours for analytic thinking! 🙂
,
 
Well, what do we have here. A new CAF member from the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster who wants to be spoon-fed with “scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies” that show children thrive best with a mother and a father, who will teach them gender identity and sex role expectations. Studies which he is prepared to reject!,
To be fair and balanced, could you also provide links to studies that show that a test tube baby wouldn’t be best raised by two test tubes? 😃 Of different genders of course.
 
What do you think they will be?

Let’s imagine the Constitution is amended to allow for gay marriage. What will be the cultural and political consequences, and why do you think that these things would happen?
Well, I think it’s kind of secondary, which incidentally is a point mentioned by Edward Feser in the opening chapter of his The Last Superstition.

The primary thing is that homosexuality is itself a moral evil, and this would be true even if there were no ruinous social consequences of homosexuality. If sodomy made flowers spring from everyone’s noses, it’d still be evil. So state-subsidized sodomy (i.e., evil) is a special form of evil: it amounts to a kind of compelled complicity in evil.
Unfortunately, the rate of stability in two-parent, two-gender families is woefully small.
OK, so it’s worth asking: why is that so?

Well, we know why it’s so. The state liberalized “divorce,” and did so on grounds similar to what you’re suggesting should be used to legalize gay “marriage.”

As you point out, this has been absolutely ruinous for families. So clearly, the solution is to get rid of it. Legislate divorce away, and legislate into effect ruinous consequences for parents who destroy their families for no good reason. That’s not even a theological issue at this point. Divorce has done extraordinary harm to society and introduced nothing substantively good.

It surprises me that gay “marriage” advocates always say this, and it surprises me because it’s not really a good or even particularly interesting argument. Somehow the logic goes:
  1. Heterosexuals divorce a lot.
  2. ???
  3. Therefore gay marriage.
Sorry, but I don’t see it. The same people who say the heterosexual divorce crisis somehow legitimates gay “marriage” are the same ones who precipitated the heterosexual divorce crisis in the first place – i.e., liberals, with the complicity of mainstream Protestants and heterodox Catholics. Obviously, these people should not be trusted with any more power than they’ve already been given, since everything they touch turns to ****.

Look, it’s like this. Suppose I have a dishwasher with two factory settings: A and B. On A, the dishwasher cleans my dishes. One day, I decide to turn it to B. It melts my dishes and spews dirty water all over the kitchen. Is it rational for me to decide that this proves that A wasn’t really all that good, since the second I moved away from A, bad things happened, therefore I must keep at B forever and wait until things improve? Because that’s kind of the logic here – as soon as we legalized divorce, people started divorcing, therefore traditional marriage never worked in the first place and state-subsidized sodomy for everyone!! Err, no.

Obviously, it’s not a very sound way of thinking. A worked. B doesn’t. Therefore we should abandon B and go back to A, unless we want to deal with spewing jets of dirty water and molten ceramic. Likewise, traditional family structures worked (that’s why they’re “traditional” and not “peculiar to a particular place at a particular time”), and all the ruinous innovations introduced largely by perverts to satisfy their obscene lusts without social consequence haven’t worked, i.e., they’ve given us broken families, feminized poverty, homeless/illiterate kids, etc. Among certain subcultures where this nonsense has hit the worst (i.e., American blacks), the effect has been absolutely ruinous – a whole generation of American blacks have been left effectively fatherless (the illegitimacy rate being north of 75%), a sizable portion of which has wound up murdered or in prison. People deserve a better and saner social order than that. They deserve to have one that reflects basic considerations about human nature rather than gnostic (and frankly Satanic) ideas about what human nature ought to be, ought to look like – if only we were gods! So perhaps we should throw the perverts in jail or burn them at the stake or something and go back to traditional family structures like every other sane, healthy society for, like, the entire history of mankind.
 
Biblepoe;9338261:
InSearchofGrace, I’m still waiting for the published, peer-reviewed studies you were thinking of when you said:

I’m under the impression that such scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies do not exist.
What I will do for you, however, since you reacted to this paragraph from my post,
Never mind that a large body of social scientific research indicates that children thrive best with a mother and father who teach them gender identity and sex role expectations. This was the conclusion of a Committee of the French National Assembly, which recommended, in January 2006, that France not accept same-sex marriage due to its detrimental effect on children. The French Committee criticized studies on same-sex parenting that claimed it had no ill effects on children, on the basis that these studies lacked scientific rigor, included inadequate sampling, and showed a lack of objectivity.
is to provide the link to the report on which the French National Assembly based its rejection of legalization of same sex ‘marriage’ on June 15, 2011.
A political report submitted to a legislature by a group of people who do not have doctorate degrees is not the same thing as “A large body of social scientific research”. If you do have “A large body of social scientific research” you would have been able to meet my request for you to reference scientific, published, and peer-reviewed studies.
Here’s another, Do Mothers and Fathers Matter, a brief article with links to the studies.
I’ve seen a ton of articles like this that deceptively reference studies in a way that made them look like they said one thing when they really said another. If you think that any of the particular studies that article cites backs up your statement that “A large body of social scientific research indicates that children thrive best with a mother and father,” reference it here on this threat and lets have a discussion about it.
 
I would request that all posters review the following guidelines for discussion among Catholics and non-Catholics. Also, please remember that charity is essential to our discussions here, and that you can always consult Church Teaching on Same Sex Issues to clarify the official church position. This thread is now closed. Thank you all for your cooperation.

Our Forums exist for Catholics to dialogue with one another and become more knowledgeable in their faith. Additionally, we welcome non-Catholics to dialogue, discuss, debate, educate us about their faith, or be educated about ours. We do not require that posters subscribe to the doctrines or dogma of Catholicism; we do require of all posters, Catholic and non-Catholic, that they not disrespect Catholicism or any other faith.

Catholics who post here mirror those in the general population, displaying wide differences in the extent of their individual catechesis, how observant each is, his degree of faithfulness to the Magisterium, and the strength each has in his faith. That our Catholic members span such a continuum is the precise reason why the content and tenor of your posts under diverse identities is a matter of concern.

When Catholic posters who recognize weaknesses in their own faith are confronted with conflicting or challenging statements by non-Catholics, they generally perceive a need to question the good-faith basis of the statements and determine whether they are at odds with Church teaching, rather than blindly subscribe to them. However, presented with doubts by one who purports to be a Catholic questioning his faith, the risk is greater that the “weak” or under-catechized Catholic will “buy into” or sympathetically identify with the concerns expressed.

We have a responsibility to protect those who come here, whether to strengthen their faith or to learn about Catholicism, from persons who propound an erroneous view of Church teachings or seek to undermine them, not in above-board, straightforward discussion, dialogue, or debate, but by surreptitiously introducing doubt into the air, subtly proselytizing under the guise of personal discernment. This is its own form of disrespect for the Catholic faith and is disruptive to the forums.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top