Sola Fide in scripture

[sirach2v4]

I am a lifelong Catholic, but not a biblical theologian. I was reading 2 Co this evening and came across 2 Co 5:10 which (paraphrased) says that we will meet Christ on his judgment seat and be judged for the good and the bad that we have done in our lives.

So, I find the sola fide arguments very irrelevent, no matter how important they may be. As I get older, I don’t see myself sorting all this out, technically. I have to hang my faith and hope on verses like this.

 

[BeingSaved]

I don’t think that you would agree that someone chanting they believe exempts them from not obeying the commandments. And what happens if we don’t? Jesus himself told us.

.

Actually, if you could spell that out,…what happens if we don’t, the part you wrote before says, judgement.will happen, we will be judged,…
How can we be judged, if we are forgiven.
If I sin, and then ask forgiveness, and I am forgiven and cleansed, how can I be judged?
If Jesus forgives, AND cleanses me, what is left to be judged, and when would it be?

People cannot do all of God’s commands, which is why Jesus came and died on the cross?

Why would He judge me, if I ask His forgiveness, and He forgives me? If I am forgiven, and He goes further to cleanse me, then where is judgement.
?

 

[powerofk]

If what you seem to be trying to say is right, what happened to all that I typed to
you, right from bible, Abe and apostle Paul, what is the meaning of what is written from them, then?

I feel confused.
not just confused,…
I am afraid…
especially because I don’t really understand…

the other scriptures say what they do and they cant be thrown out…

how can I be judged for my sin, if jesus forgives and cleanses?and when would I be judged for it?

Jesus does forgive and cleanse. The trick is that we have to accept the forgiveness and the cleansing. Jesus can forgive any and all sins that we have - but we have to be willing to accept it and ask for it. Read the parables of Lazarus and the rich man, the prodigal son, the last judgment, the wise and foolish virgins, and the parable of the talents. These were all stated by Jesus Himself.

In Lazarus and the rich man, the rich man commits sins of omission (deliberately ignoring Lazarus). Because of this, the rich man was sent to eternal torment. The reason? Not showing love of neighbor.

The parable of the prodigal son shows the immense forgiveness of God. But to experience the forgiveness, the prodigal son pretty much has to hit rock bottom and see the consequences of his sins.

In the parable of the Last Judgment in Matthew, Jesus splits the faithful (these are all his supposed followers being judged!) into two groups. One group, the group that has shown love of neighbor by tending to their neighbors’ needs, is invited into Heaven. The other group has not tended to their neighbors’ needs, and is sent to Hell.

The parable of the 10 virgins at the wedding feast shows the urgency to be prepared. The foolish virgins who run out of oil have not properly disposed themselves for the second coming - in essence, they started faithful but ran out of stamina and fell away. The wise virgins remained faithful, and they were able to stay faithful until the end.

And of course, the purpose of the parable of the talents is to show how necessary it is to use what God gave you to build the kingdom of God. Everyone, no matter how important or unimportant, has a job to do, and if one doesn’t use their talents to build God’s kingdom, then you are sent to Hell.

Jesus mentions Hell almost as much, if not more, than He mentions Heaven. At the same time, God’s mercy must never be doubted. The most important two lines, though, that Jesus has regarding discipleship are these: “He who wishes to be my disciple must pick up his cross daily and follow me,” and, “Whoever does not love me more than his wife, mother, father, sister, brother, even his very self, cannot be my disciple.” Seriously.

Oh, and as a rebuttal to the faith alone argument, read the second chapter of the epistle of St. James. It appears that by the time the epistle of St. James was written, people had started to misinterpret Paul by thinking that they were saved by faith alone. St. James specifically states, “Faith without works is dead” and reiterates the same example of Abraham sacrificing Isaac as faith shining through works - and it was by Abrahams deeds that he was able to prove his faith to God.

We are cleansed of our sins by the blood of Jesus - but we need to actually constantly and continually accept our salvation. Every second of every day we are given the chance to reject our salvation or to accept it. If, once having accepted Jesus’s salvation, we decide to reject it, Jesus will honor our decision. If, once having rejected Jesus’s salvation, we decide to accept it, there will be rejoicing in Heaven. When we die, we will be judged according to whether, at the time we died, we had accepted Jesus’s salvation. Yet it is not enough to simply say that one accepts Jesus’s salvation - one’s deeds must match one’s words - and that is shown by how well one followed the two Great Commandments: To love God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself. And if you truly love as Jesus commanded us to love, then your faith, your hope, and your love will shine brightly through your works.

 

[Milasol]

Actually, if you could spell that out,…what happens if we don’t, the part you wrote before says, judgement.will happen, we will be judged,…
How can we be judged, if we are forgiven.
If I sin, and then ask forgiveness, and I am forgiven and cleansed, how can I be judged?
If Jesus forgives, AND cleanses me, what is left to be judged, and when would it be?

People cannot do all of God’s commands, which is why Jesus came and died on the cross?

Why would He judge me, if I ask His forgiveness, and He forgives me? If I am forgiven, and He goes further to cleanse me, then where is judgement.
?

According to that interpretation then we can avoid the Commandments all together.
Now Jesus told us to obey those.

Yes we can be forgiven through the sacrament of reconciliation. A gift non-catholics don’t want to have.

What happens is that when we sin we voluntarily go away further from God as he is perfection love itself.

What do you mean people cannot do all of God’s commands? Yes we can do them and that is why He told us to. He sent His son who reinforced this.

And yes we will be judged as the bible states. You can ask for forgiveness but we will still be judged and I can’t find many protestants who disagree with this. We will be judged on what we did here on earth whether good or bad. This is our trial and one good deed is valued here a billion times more than it will be when all of truth is revealed to us.

That judgment itself 2 Corinthians 5:13 indicates judgement and purge of evil inside.

That along with the Sermon on the Mount are for me really scary. We are a condemned species (Adam sinned and condemned the human race). Jesus came down to open up for us the opportunity to go to Heaven, (our human race is forgiven our original sin is forgiven but not erased), but we must work our way there with a living faith. Faith through works.

No impurity enters heaven. None. No evil enters heaven. Those principalities and powers were cast out of it for eternity.

Not even one single little impurity enters heaven. None. As one impurity will prevent from beatific vision. Meaning from seeing God/being at the presence of Love itself.

 

[pablope]

Actually, if you could spell that out,…what happens if we don’t, the part you wrote before says, judgement.will happen, we will be judged,…
How can we be judged, if we are forgiven.
If I sin, and then ask forgiveness, and I am forgiven and cleansed, how can I be judged?
If Jesus forgives, AND cleanses me, what is left to be judged, and when would it be?

People cannot do all of God’s commands, which is why Jesus came and died on the cross?

Why would He judge me, if I ask His forgiveness, and He forgives me? If I am forgiven, and He goes further to cleanse me, then where is judgement.
?

You are judged by what you have done.

Romans 2:

6 God “will repay each person according to what they have done.”[a] 7 To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8 But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger.

Revelation 14:13

13 Then I heard a voice from heaven say, “Write this: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.”

“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labor, for their deeds will follow them.”

2 Cor 7:1
7:1 Since we have these promises, beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from every defilement of body and of spirit, making holiness perfect in the fear of God.

Heb 10

19 Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, 20 by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, 21 and since we have a great priest over the house of God, 22 let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water.

 

[BeingSaved]

According to that interpretation then we can avoid the Commandments all together.
Now Jesus told us to obey those.

Yes we can be forgiven through the sacrament of reconciliation. A gift non-catholics don’t want to have.

What happens is that when we sin we voluntarily go away further from God as he is perfection love itself.

What do you mean people cannot do all of God’s commands? Yes we can do them and that is why He told us to. He sent His son who reinforced this.

And yes we will be judged as the bible states. You can ask for forgiveness but we will still be judged and I can’t find many protestants who disagree with this. We will be judged on what we did here on earth whether good or bad. This is our trial and one good deed is valued here a billion times more than it will be when all of truth is revealed to us.

That judgment itself 2 Corinthians 5:13 indicates judgement and purge of evil inside.

That along with the Sermon on the Mount are for me really scary. We are a condemned species (Adam sinned and condemned the human race). Jesus came down to open up for us the opportunity to go to Heaven, (our human race is forgiven our original sin is forgiven but not erased), but we must work our way there with a living faith. Faith through works.

No impurity enters heaven. None. No evil enters heaven. Those principalities and powers were cast out of it for eternity.

Not even one single little impurity enters heaven. None. As one impurity will prevent from beatific vision. Meaning from seeing God/being at the presence of Love itself.

What you wrote above, may be a primary difference between Cath. belief and Prot. belief.

In case this times out I will send this and do another post too, to include what I am thinking…

 

[Milasol]

What you wrote above, may be a primary difference between Cath. belief and Prot. belief.

In case this times out I will send this and do another post too, to include what I am thinking…

lol yea it happens to me too. So many times I spent a long time writing a long response and when I click on submit reply my time timed out. I hate it when that happens. Now I copy before clicking on “submit reply”.

Well it is a huge difference between Catholics and Protestants. It goes right to the core of the whole sola fide dilemma.

If one wants to believe in sola fide then one must eliminate more than half the bible. But we believe in fide et gratia. Faith and grace. And we believe that we can lose our grace with sin and that we must work to keep it and grow in it.

We believe that we are made in the image of God and that inside us is the essence of God and that sin takes us away from Him. When Adam sinned in the garden of Eden, God came to him and asked Adam “Where are you?” Not because He didn’t know where Adam was, but because sin separated Adam from God. So God asked him not because He didn’t know where Adam was but He asked him where are you in relation to me.

One can’t eliminate God’s justice, His judgment, His gifts, and of course His mercy. By believing in faith alone, one must then omit half his bible. So protestants do eliminate all the verses and a lot more from the bible and they misinterpret others. If one is to trust God then one must believe in ALL of His word and not just pick some verses that fit what Luther believed and omit the others.

One can believe that it is by faith that we gain grace and with grace we do good works. If we lose our grace then we don’t do good works. So it is a faith that is not a one time thing but rather an ALL the time belief.

Jesus came and saved our sins, including our original sin. He gave us gifts but He didn’t erase our free will. And as the scriptures say we will be judged.

 

[BeingSaved]

lol yea it happens to me too. So many times I spent a long time writing a long response and when I click on submit reply my time timed out. I hate it when that happens. Now I copy before clicking on “submit reply”.

Well it is a huge difference between Catholics and Protestants. It goes right to the core of the whole sola fide dilemma.

If one wants to believe in sola fide then one must eliminate more than half the bible. But we believe in fide et gratia. Faith and grace. And we believe that we can lose our grace with sin and that we must work to keep it and grow in it.

ok,…:crying: when I only read to here, I have tears,…and…hard to explain…this is something
that is not a physical sense or sensation, but I will use a physical similarily to try to explain
to you…
…when I read some of what you write, it is like a curtain pulls back a little, and I catch a little of the picture you are talking about, but not all…I don’t know why not all of the picture
is clear,…I still cannot see …clearly…what you mean, but just a little bit of it,…then my tears,…some tears,…tears like this mean, H. Sp. is speaking…(sometimes without words) He is present…in my reading your text…

The Sensation: I can describe, is similar to if I ate 2 or more tablespoons of honey…
the sweet sweet sense after you swallow the honey…is what is similar…not really on my tongue, but, hard to explain,…not really a physical sensation…but similar…
…this is coming from reading what you write,…
…
I have a fair amount of Word of God inside me already,…and I am trying to understand
what you say and how it fits with what is already deposited in me…(also there is some fear popping up,…as not too long ago I was anti-Catholic myself, and I come from people who are anti c. in fam. and church.,…where things about Cath. are spoken of neg.
and fear that pops up is
fear of
being deceived…
missing God,…
…
I was open to hear from scripture from my prev. Cath. friend…explaining Cath. things that
Prot. dislike, from scripture, explaining why, I think why is as important as what,…

I will go back to read more of what you say,…
but ask you, how does what you say
FIT IN with Abraham believing and getting a credit of righteousness, and
Paul’s writing of Law and Sin nailed to cross, and Paul saying I died to Mr. Law at my baptism, and became alive to Jesus, to marry him? Saying Law cannot have anything more to do with me, since I am married to Jesus now? How does what you say fit in with
these scriptures?

I know I am the seed of Abraham, “if you be Christ’s then are you Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise”, Christ is the SEED singular, Paul wrote, and I am “in Christ” so I am the seed too and all the promises are mine too.

 

[powerofk]

Honestly, there are only two laws you must follow: Love God with all your heart, all your mind, all your soul, and all your strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. If you do these two things, there is no need to worry about the minute details of the law. Why? Because in living a life of true, sacrificial love (called agape in Greek or caritas (charity) in Latin), your faith and love will shine through your actions. In true, sacrificial love, there is no selfishness, no pride, no arrogance, no greed. Do you believe that every person you meet is created in the image of God? Do you believe that whatever you do to another person, you do to Jesus? Do you forgive any and all wrongdoings done to you (remember, forgiving someone else doesn’t mean that you are saying that what the person did is okay - it’s saying that you give up your right to be angry and that you will stop letting the anger and hurt control your life)? The teachings of the Church on everything go back to the Laws of Love. If you do something that is not loving, you have sinned. Plain and simple. We will be judged, above all else, on how well we have shown love. And we can only truly love if we accept the graces of God given by faith.

 

[Milasol]

I will go back to read more of what you say,…
but ask you, how does what you say
FIT IN with Abraham believing and getting a credit of righteousness, and
Paul’s writing of Law and Sin nailed to cross, and Paul saying I died to Mr. Law at my baptism, and became alive to Jesus, to marry him? Saying Law cannot have anything more to do with me, since I am married to Jesus now? How does what you say fit in with
these scriptures?

I know I am the seed of Abraham, “if you be Christ’s then are you Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise”, Christ is the SEED singular, Paul wrote, and I am “in Christ” so I am the seed too and all the promises are mine too.

I know what you mean. I used to be someone who didn’t even believe in Jesus. I believed in God, but always disregarded Jesus as a divine figure. I used to think yes the history is there but I don’t know if I can get into it.

Many protestants seeing I was Catholic tried and tried to convert me. I could feel that some of them did it out of good will, but a lot of them didn’t. I was young and not a bible scholar or anything. But I have lived the Catholic faith in its purest form. Where I come from, everyone was Catholic. I have lived to close to God and the entire community of saints and angels. All together from earth praising God.

I then moved. I never understood why protestants were so anti-catholic. I was young and couldn’t explain the marvel of the Church and how incredible it is to be connected so much with Heaven even from earth. Our mass is centered on the sacrifice of the lamb as all the apostles did and all of the early Christians did up till 1600. The Eucharist is the center of our mass. And I believe that our mass is also celebrated in heaven. For God, that sacrifice is not a past tense history event. For Him is now and always present time.

They tried and tried but a few thing kept me in the Church. That was the Eucharist and that Jesus Himself said that there will be one universal Church visible to the entire world. The sacraments that are extremely biblical and are gifts that unfortunately our protestant brother and sisters don’t take advantage of. And "Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I complete what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church” St. Paul inn Colossians 1:24

But yes, why is it that protestants have almost this irrational hatred towards Catholics. And most of them don’t know at all how they inherit most of their beliefs from the Catholic Church. Not even the trinity is in the Bible and protestants believe in it. That was provided by the Catholic Church. So I really don’t understand why.

Not to say that Catholics can’t reciprocate that zealotry, but I tell you one thing. Not once I heard one bad thing about protestants or any other religion from Catholics. And I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic schools, catechism, never missed mass, went on pilgrimages, my entire family is of a very orthodox “order” called Opus Dei, etc. Not once I heard a single bad thing about protestants.

Here is an insert explaining Paul
“Paul writes to the Galatians to make them understand that by God’s grace they are no longer under the law. When the Gospel was preached to them, there were some among them of Jewish origin known as circumcisers - though they called themselves Christians - who did not grasp the gift they had received. They still wanted to be under the burden of the law. Now God had imposed that burden on those who were slaves to sin and not on servants of justice. That is to say, God had given a just law to unjust men in order to show them their sin, not to take it away. For sin is taken away only by the gift of faith that works through love. The Galatians had already received this gift, but the circumcisers claimed that the Gospel would not save them unless they underwent circumcision and were willing to observe also the other traditional Jewish rites.”

If you ask me, protestants believe in the bible is admirable, however I do not understand why they then omit, ignore, and misinterpret almost half the bible. Like right now, Paul didn’t say he was outside the law. He was saying it to the Jews who have converted that there is no need to follow the old law, meaning the old Jewish laws. He was specifically talking about circumcision. So I don’t understand why use that to prove faith alone. See, I see that all the time from protestants. Complete misinterpretation.

One can’t grab just some verses and omit the others. It is all of the bible. And for me only the Catholic faith has been able to interpret with the guidance of the Holy Spirit the bible to the fullest and most plentiful. For me it is only the Catholic Church that elevates the human being to be with our eternal community in heaven praising God from earth. Just like we will do for eternity. And this is coming from someone who resented the Catholic Church. I was the black sheep of my family of 10 and I rebelled and went against it. I used to say so many bad things about it. Many were lies and just a consequence of my pride, but I was horrible and hurt Jesus so much.

Not long ago I prayed to God. After like 15 years of not praying I asked him “give me faith”. That is all I asked him. And wow he did deliver. It hit me like a truck. I believe so much. I can feel the Holy Spirit working on me. I am still getting used to this. I am so grateful for this. I also cry because I can’t believe how much more I see now.

 

[BeingSaved]

ok,…:crying: .

the smiley is way more dramatic, than what happened with me, that I wrote you,…
,for me, my eyes watered, no sobbing like the smiley, (but it was the only teary smiley I found)

(not from eye strain) but this sometimes happens when I encounter the Holy Spirit,…He is in me, and sometimes I encounter Him in others and in words spoken or written, esp. in the Bible. Sometimes a whole verse, or, just one word will touch me like this, and my eyes tear up…

(being more clear, so you can understand me through the typing…)

 

[Milasol]

the smiley is way more dramatic, than what happened with me, that I wrote you,…
,for me, my eyes watered, no sobbing like the smiley, (but it was the only teary smiley I found)

(not from eye strain) but this sometimes happens when I encounter the Holy Spirit,…He is in me, and sometimes I encounter Him in others and in words spoken or written, esp. in the Bible. Sometimes a whole verse, or, just one word will touch me like this, and my eyes tear up…

(being more clear, so you can understand me through the typing…)

Yes I understood that. I completely understood but I don’t know how to communicate it. I’m sorry if I didn’t.

I sense His presence inside me too. I asked Him to come help me with grace.

You feel Him because we are in Pentecost and because I specifically asked Him to help me this week. I have been praying a Novena. It is a prayer one prays asking for grace to the Holy Spirit. He ALWAYS delivers. Before I wrote to you I asked him to help me.

This is what I’m praying right now every night:

“On my knees before the great multitude of heavenly witnesses, I offer myself, soul and body to You, Eternal Spirit of God. I adore the brightness of Your purity, the unerring keenness of Your justice, and the might of Your love. You are the Strength and Light of my soul. In You I live and move and am. I desire never to grieve You by unfaithfulness to grace and I pray with all my heart to be kept from the smallest sin against You. Mercifully guard my every thought and grant that I may always watch for Your light, and listen to Your voice, and follow Your gracious inspirations. I cling to You and give myself to You and ask You, by Your compassion to watch over me in my weakness. Holding the pierced Feet of Jesus and looking at His Five Wounds, and trusting in His Precious Blood and adoring His opened Side and stricken Heart, I implore You, Adorable Spirit, Helper of my infirmity, to keep me in Your grace that I may never sin against You. Give me grace, O Holy Spirit, Spirit of the Father and the Son to say to You always and everywhere, “Speak Lord for Your servant heareth.” Amen.”

 

[BeingSaved]

I am a lifelong Catholic, but not a biblical theologian. I was reading 2 Co this evening and came across 2 Co 5:10 which (paraphrased) says that we will meet Christ on his judgment seat and be judged for the good and the bad that we have done in our lives.

So, I find the sola fide arguments very irrelevent, no matter how important they may be. As I get older, I don’t see myself sorting all this out, technically. I have to hang my faith and hope on verses like this.

CEB
2 Cor 5:10 We all must appear before Christ in court so that each person can be paid back for the things that were done while in the body, whether they were good or bad.
LEB
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, in order that each one may receive back the [things] through the body according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

 

[Milasol]

the smiley is way more dramatic, than what happened with me, that I wrote you,…
,for me, my eyes watered, no sobbing like the smiley, (but it was the only teary smiley I found)

(not from eye strain) but this sometimes happens when I encounter the Holy Spirit,…He is in me, and sometimes I encounter Him in others and in words spoken or written, esp. in the Bible. Sometimes a whole verse, or, just one word will touch me like this, and my eyes tear up…

(being more clear, so you can understand me through the typing…)

This is what I came to know about the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is a fire. The fire of the Holy Spirit is a burning fire. Love burns. Seraphs are so consuming with the love of God that they cover their faces in humility. All they can do is praise Him in awe. And my goal is to be with them at the presence of God praising Him. And the Holy Spirit helps me to start knowing that same burning Love from here. And to start getting my soul more ready for beatific vision. That is what the Holy Spirit does. It is a person with force calling all souls. It is God omniscient om(name removed by moderator)resent. It is so strong. The more grace we have the more we feel the Holy Spirit working on us because the more grace we have the closer we are to God. The more He works the more one feels happiness and also the more we suffer. For love is suffering. Suffering and sorrow increase in proportion to Love. The more we love someone the more we suffer when we offend Him. The more we suffer when we sin.

 

[BeingSaved]

Honestly, there are only two laws you must follow: Love God with all your heart, all your mind, all your soul, and all your strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. If you do these two things, there is no need to worry about the minute details of the law. Why? Because in living a life of true, sacrificial love (called agape in Greek or caritas (charity) in Latin), your faith and love will shine through your actions. In true, sacrificial love, there is no selfishness, no pride, no arrogance, no greed. Do you believe that every person you meet is created in the image of God? Do you believe that whatever you do to another person, you do to Jesus? Do you forgive any and all wrongdoings done to you (remember, forgiving someone else doesn’t mean that you are saying that what the person did is okay - it’s saying that you give up your right to be angry and that you will stop letting the anger and hurt control your life)? The teachings of the Church on everything go back to the Laws of Love. If you do something that is not loving, you have sinned. Plain and simple. We will be judged, above all else, on how well we have shown love. And we can only truly love if we accept the graces of God given by faith.

deep and beautiful , what you have written, shows everything in a nutshell,…"all your heart, mind soul and strength, at first glance, easy, …after pondering,…seems difficult to impossible. love neighbor as self, also…seems impossible,…even if I relate that to some
neighbours to my home now, this would be a completely uphill challenge…
…
yes, so, it is impossible,…like the commandments, that no one has ever kept all of,…
except Jesus,…

you are right about grace of God given by faith, to us to Do it,…supernatural empowerment,…when you get right down to it, love is really supernatural,…
it is not ‘natural’ to give …not our human natural state,…we are self interested by nature,…
us first, everyone else can fend for themselves, is the natural way of human kind.

 

[Milasol]

…supernatural empowerment,…when you get right down to it, love is really supernatural,…
it is not ‘natural’ to give …not our human natural state,…we are self interested by nature,…
us first, everyone else can fend for themselves, is the natural way of human kind.

That is amazing. You are so right. It is not natural of the flesh. Well said. You put it so simple yet so undeniably true.

 

[BeingSaved]

This is what I came to know about the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is a fire. The fire of the Holy Spirit is a burning fire. Love burns. Seraphs are so consuming with the love of God that they cover their faces in humility. All they can do is praise Him in awe. And my goal is to be with them at the presence of God praising Him. And the Holy Spirit helps me to start knowing that same burning Love from here. And to start getting my soul more ready for beatific vision. That is what the Holy Spirit does. It is a person with force calling all souls. It is God omniscient om(name removed by moderator)resent. It is so strong. The more grace we have the more we feel the Holy Spirit working on us because the more grace we have the closer we are to God. The more He works the more one feels happiness and also the more we suffer. For love is suffering. Suffering and sorrow increase in proportion to Love. The more we love someone the more we suffer when we offend Him. The more we suffer when we sin.

ok, now I’m :crying:…not a sad cry,…I picture the Father and what you have written, and what that burning is. .sometimes His love feels like fast river water whoosh or gush - sometimes there is a fire- …seraphim…burning ones…, burning because they are so close to Him,…
…you getting ready now…

the more grace we have, the closer we are to God…

 

[BeingSaved]

Im not sure exactly what grace is, I am thinking super empowering, supernatural, or is it just Love, and because it is so foreign to us,…it seems like it is supernatural?

Paul wrote be a partaker of my grace…sounds like he had his own allotment and enough to share…

seems like power, Acts 2 says Dunamis, power of H. Sp akin to root word of dynamite.

 

[BeingSaved]

This is what I’m praying right now every night:

“On my knees before the great multitude of heavenly witnesses, I offer myself, soul and body to You, Eternal Spirit of God. I adore the brightness of Your purity, the unerring keenness of Your justice, and the might of Your love. You are the Strength and Light of my soul. In You I live and move and am. I desire never to grieve You by unfaithfulness to grace and I pray with all my heart to be kept from the smallest sin against You. Mercifully guard my every thought and grant that I may always watch for Your light, and listen to Your voice, and follow Your gracious inspirations. I cling to You and give myself to You and ask You, by Your compassion to watch over me in my weakness. Holding the pierced Feet of Jesus and looking at His Five Wounds, and trusting in His Precious Blood and adoring His opened Side and stricken Heart, I implore You, Adorable Spirit, Helper of my infirmity, to keep me in Your grace that I may never sin against You. Give me grace, O Holy Spirit, Spirit of the Father and the Son to say to You always and everywhere, “Speak Lord for Your servant heareth.” Amen.”

I am …floored, …by this

 

[Milasol]

Im not sure exactly what grace is, I am thinking super empowering, supernatural, or is it just Love, and because it is so foreign to us,…it seems like it is supernatural?

Grace or gratia is a supernatural gift of God given to intellectual beings. Us and His angels.
It is given to us for our salvation. With faith we can receive grace but with sin we lose it as sin drives us away from God and the further we are the less we receive this gift.
And that is why Catholics believe that faith is not a one time ordeal but a constant struggle for gaining more grace.
It’s all about grace. Never forget this. When we die and if we have no grace then we can’t get closer to God. It’s all about grace. And we can grow in it while we are here. This is our trial period.

Remember when Jesus said at the end of his sermon on the Mount “Everyone therefore who hears these my words and acts upon them, shall be likened to a wise man who built his house on rock.”
That is a foundation and even if it’s a mere pile of pebbles for us. They will cease to be a pile of pebbles if we contemplate them with a Cathedral in mind. A few pebbles don’t do anything but a vast amount will built the foundation and if we add more pebbles, we will build the walls and roof pointing towards the heavens.

Jesus was referring to our foundation of the soul and He meant for us to do this with grace (His gift).