Sola fide?

[bmullins]

Sola fide, is something I grew up believing. It was justification through faith alone. I was under the impression that the Catholic church did not teach sola fide, but that:

1. Man is justified by faith and through grace
2. Sanctification and justification are the same process
3. works provide grace. Grace sanctifies, ergo grace justifies.

So, do Catholics believe in sola fide? Or not?

 

[Catholic4Christ]

We don’t believe in sola fide in the way that some Protestants do. However, faith is what directs us to salvation, so it isn’t as cut-and-dry as it may seem.

For instance, my mother is a Methodist, so I have some Methodist background. To Methodists, faith is what bestows grace. Continued sin, however, can mean that your faith is no longer strong. A fall from grace is possible. Being repentant and avoiding sin shows that your faith is strong again, thus grace is renewed.

Sound familiar? That’s basically what Catholics believe. I mean, yeah, we have Confession and such as our means of grace being restored, but the idea is basically the same.

On the other hand, there are issues like Baptism that complicate things. Catholics believe that Baptism is ordinarily necessary for salvation (this is why we tend to baptize infants). It wipes away original sin. Methodists believe that Baptism is an ordinance demanded by God (just like Catholics), so they also Baptize infants. However, they don’t necessarily believe it has an effect on one’s soul in and of itself, simply that it is something God wants us to do.

Obviously, there’s more to it than that. I was just using the two views of Christianity that I’m most familiar with. The main point is, both Catholics and Protestants believe that faith in God is what motivates us to live Christian lives and be saved. But you will never hear a Catholic say that they believe in sola fide exactly the same way many Protestants do.

 

[promethius]

Sola fide, is something I grew up believing. It was justification through faith alone. I was under the impression that the Catholic church did not teach sola fide, but that:

1. Man is justified by faith and through grace
2. Sanctification and justification are the same process
3. works provide grace. Grace sanctifies, ergo grace justifies.

So, do Catholics believe in sola fide? Or not?

Ephesians 2:8-10 says the Catholic position on salvation in entirety:

We are saved by grace
this grace is not of our own
it comes to us through faith
we are not saved by works of the law
our faith is made living through GOOD works
these good works were ordained for us by Christ

Sola fide is a heresy because it says that we can somehow save ourselves by our own faith. God saves us by His grace (and that is the ONLY thing that will save us), which acts through our faith living in good works.

 

[bmullins]

So works and sacraments give us grace, but it’s not our own grace, God’s grace. So we receive merit from good works and sacraments, but it’s not our own merit, God’s merit? The more I hear about it the more I don’t see much of a difference in what my old church teaches and what the Catholic church teaches.

Essentially, what I was taught growing up is. We are saved by faith. We do works, because we are saved by faith. We don’t earn anything for them, because we’ve already received everything as a gift… and there is nothing to be earned. We do them out of love for God because of his gift of grace and love for our fellow man.

 

[promethius]

So works and sacraments give us grace, but it’s not our own grace, God’s grace. So we receive merit from good works and sacraments, but it’s not our own merit, God’s merit? The more I hear about it the more I don’t see much of a difference in what my old church teaches and what the Catholic church teaches.

Eh… I would word it thus:

We do a good work by enaging in the sacraments. The sacraments are channels by which God gives us His Grace. By God’s grace, particularly by His SAVING grace (only attainable when we are NOT in a state of mortal sin), we are given merit.

The mere act of choosing God, an act of faith, is made real by the work of choosing God in the sacraments, by opening ourselves to His grace. If we are not opened to His grace through our choices (works), then we are of a dead faith, and therefore do not receive grace either.

Works and faith do not feed one off the other (ie, we cannot work ourselves into good faith and grace, nor can faith produce a life of works). They go hand in hand: faith inspires us to good works, which build our faith, which inspires us to good works, which build our faith, and so on (and this upward spiral is an opening of the flow of grace into our souls!). This is why it is important to avail ourselves of the saraments often and to live a life of Christian charity.

Essentially, what I was taught growing up is. We are saved by faith. We do works, because we are saved by faith. We don’t earn anything for them, because we’ve already received everything as a gift… and there is nothing to be earned. We do them out of love for God because of his gift of grace and love for our fellow man.

Not what we teach: works are an act of the will, not something which is DEMANDED by faith. Works and faith go hand in hand (as I said above). We don’t “earn” anything, but by doing works we build our faith up, and faith is the vessel by which grace enters our lives. Good Christian works are absolutely essential in the life of the Christian.

 

[David]

My understanding is Catholics believe we are saved by grace alone.
We can say we are saved by faith, but not faith alone.
The works we do are cooperating with God’s grace.
I think sanctification and justification are not the same.
hope that helps
Peace
David

 

[Barbkw]

It’s God’s grace that any of us are here. So that is the ultimate given. Nothing we do can change the grace which God gives to humanity. Nothing can change the gift that Jesus paid for us by His death. His sacrifice is also ultimate.

As God the Son, Jesus freely took on and continues to take on humanities’ sins. He waits on each of us to repent of our sins so that He can forgive and heal us. He brings us into Himself, because we must go through Him to God the Father.

God created us with free will, and it must be our free will choice to desire Christ. When we take the steps to convert our free will, God shows us the next step toward Himself. It’s gradual, our relationship with Christ often stumbles, we fall short. We’re encouraged, through the practice of humility to continue approaching the Trinity. We build faith.

Eventually, the faith building creates in us a fuller awareness of reprosicity toward God and other peope. We feel that we need to give back to God, in the ways that God wills it.

Grace, faith and works.

 

[Newsy]

In the protestant circles that I used to frequent, Faith Alone was a tenet of the faith. But, the definition was always hard to grasp, sometimes it was in agreement with the Catholic definition and sometimes it was directly opposed. Many times it was misconstrued to refer to “one saved, always saved” (i.e. you need to do nothing good other than believe). I have always had a problem understanding the idea that “to be saved, you must only repent and give your heart to Jesus” isn’t including works. It seems to me that, no matter how you slice it, we must believe and do ‘something’ to be saved, so that is Faith and Works.

To tell the truth, I am not sure I have a great grasp of the “Sola Fide” thing, but I am sure not everyone else does either.

 

[bmullins]

To tell the truth, I am not sure I have a great grasp of the “Sola Fide” thing, but I am sure not everyone else does either.

I thought I had a grasp on it myself, but every time I hear it talked about in Catholic circles, I find that the understanding of it is vastly different from person to person. (Or seems to be.) I may just need to spend more time in prayer and studying to truly grasp it. It could just be over my head at the moment.

 

[Luvtosew]

Man if it wasn’t for the saving grace of God where would we be, were just all doing the best we can, being only human. Its a good thing he loves us and made a covenant with Noah that he’d never destroy mankind again, everytime I see a rainbow I’m reminded of that, and I haven’t seen a rainbow in a long long time.

I know everyone thinks something different even among just Catholics.

 

[jschutzm]

I thought I had a grasp on it myself, but every time I hear it talked about in Catholic circles, I find that the understanding of it is vastly different from person to person. (Or seems to be.) I may just need to spend more time in prayer and studying to truly grasp it. It could just be over my head at the moment.

Hearing Catholics and Protestants debate it, and having my in-laws and wife all Protestant… I see it this way.

Most Protestants and Catholics actually believe in the same thing. It is just sad that they use different words to express it.

A Catholic would never say “Sola Fide” or “faith alone” except to preach against it. However, it is clear that faith is a HUGE part of Catholic salvation theology.

Likewise, a Protestant will never say that it takes faith and works, because even the mere mention of the word “works” smacks of Catholicism.

The two will often argue in circles, ceding minor points but all along claiming that the other has it wrong.

The Catholic saying that faith without works is dead and Protestants saying that no action on our part will ever ‘merit’ you heaven.

I once heard an MP3 debate between John Martigoni (Southern Baptist turned Catholic) and an ex-Catholic Priest turned Protestant. What I came away with is that BOTH were saying nearly the exact same things but using different words.

And honestly, at my wife’s Baptist church they preach about living a life and bearing fruit, but they still claim that we are saved by Faith alone and not by works. But that works are an inevitable result of choosing Christ and following him, aka “being a Christian”

But professing any “alone” theology is completely contrary to the Catholic faith. So I doubt you’ll ever see Catholics embrace a Sola. It is too limiting and narrow.

 

[Pax]

Suffice it to say that scripture never teaches salvation by faith alone. Moreover, scripture quite clearly states in the book of James that a man is justified by faith and works and not by faith alone[James 2:20-26].

When Paul speaks of of justification apart from the Law, and uses Abraham as his example, he is demonstrating that when we are first reconciled and brought into friendship with God that it is totally gratuitous. There is nothing that we do prior to that moment or subsequent to that moment that makes us right with God when he gives us grace, regenerates us, and makes us adopted sons and daughters. Catholics and Protestants can all hold hands and sing “alleluia” on that one.

The problem is that, once we are regenerated and made adopted sons and daughters of God, we must now live as members of the household of God. We have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, and we are to be led by the Spirit, and not by the ways of the world. It is for this reason that Paul says the following in Romans 8:12-14:

“So then, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh–for if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body you will live. For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.”

Paul says many similar things elsewhere in his letters, and it is clear that sin will bring death and condemnation. We do not earn heaven for it is a gift. We can, however, certainly turn it down through sin. Paul brings this home in one of the pithiest quotes of scripture that I have ever read. In Romans 6:23 we read the following:

“For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.”

Just think about that quote. The first half refers to what we can and sometimes do, while the second half refers to what God does. Death in the first half refers to death of the soul and condemnation…that is what we must take full responsibility for. God’s part is all about his lavish gifts of grace wrought by the work of Jesus in his passion, death, and resurrection. Salvation is a gift and cannot be earned. Works as defined by James justify just as faith justifies. Those works are by grace as outlined in Eph 2:8-10. Eph 2:10 says:

“For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.”

So in the full context of Eph 2:8-10 it is clear that our faith and works are by God’s grace. We are God’s workmanship and we are created in Christ Jesus for good works. We are not our own workmanship. It is also important to note that we are not created in Christ Jesus just for the sake of “faith/belief.” Moreover, the works we are to do were prepared by God “beforehand”. That is to say, “before” we were even gratuitously justified by grace through faith. Paul tells us that:

“…those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the first-born among many brethren.{Rom 8:29].” Being conformed to the image of Jesus is a reflection of Eph 2:10, and it for this reason that Paul never stated that “salvation is by faith alone.” Likewise, in order to eliminate any possible misunderstandings or misconceptions, the apostle James quite clearly states that works also “justify” and that a man is not justified/saved by faith alone.

Pondering these things makes it clear why Catholic teaching condemns Pelagianism(works righteousness), but also condemns the teaching of sola fide.

I hope this helps.

 

[Ignatius]

Sola fide, is something I grew up believing. It was justification through faith alone. I was under the impression that the Catholic church did not teach sola fide, but that:

1. Man is justified by faith and through grace
2. Sanctification and justification are the same process
3. works provide grace. Grace sanctifies, ergo grace justifies.

So, do Catholics believe in sola fide? Or not?

Sola Fide is “faith flone” in English. If I search my English translation of the bible for the term “faith alone” I find one place where it speakes of “faith alone”, James 2:17-24.
So, the question really should be “what does the Bible say about faith alone?”

 

[kra130]

Protestants and Catholics have the same view on Sola Fide. We both agree that “it is by grace we have been saved through faith” We also agree that works are necessary. I think 1 John 2:3-5 says it clearly
“And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, 5 but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him: 6 whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked.”
The real hold up here is that we Protestants know that we cannot earn salvation on our own. Some of us myself included don’t even think we have the power to choose God on our own Romans 3:10 says “as it is written:‘None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God.’” we hold tightly to Faith being the only means of salvation but we also know that if works do not come out of this life then we are lying to ourselves and everyone else.

 

[Newsy]

Protestants and Catholics have the same view on Sola Fide. We both agree that “it is by grace we have been saved through faith” We also agree that works are necessary. I think 1 John 2:3-5 says it clearly
“And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, 5 but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him: 6 whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked.”
The real hold up here is that we Protestants know that we cannot earn salvation on our own. Some of us myself included don’t even think we have the power to choose God on our own Romans 3:10 says “as it is written:‘None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God.’” we hold tightly to Faith being the only means of salvation but we also know that if works do not come out of this life then we are lying to ourselves and everyone else.

Catholics defeated the heresy that taught we could earn our salvation by our works.

My question is, if we don’t choose God and we are pre-destined by Him, is it still love? I know that I love God, not as fully as I should, but I love Him. By your statement, it seems that we have no choice in the matter. Love that is not freely given is no love at all.

 

[promethius]

Protestants and Catholics have the same view on Sola Fide. We both agree that “it is by grace we have been saved through faith” We also agree that works are necessary. I think 1 John 2:3-5 says it clearly
“And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. 4 Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him, 5 but whoever keeps his word, in him truly the love of God is perfected. By this we may know that we are in him: 6 whoever says he abides in him ought to walk in the same way in which he walked.”

No arguements here, except that Catholics don’t hold to sola fide AT ALL (the words sola fide mean, literally, faith ALONE, which is incompatible with the idea of grace being the means by which we are saved).

The real hold up here is that we Protestants know that we cannot earn salvation on our own.

Catholics don’t believe that we earn our salvation on our own either. Rather, we believe that RECEPTION of grace is a cooperative act. Namely, if grace is the breeze, faith is the window, and works is opening the window to let the air in. That is the proper understanding of Ephesians 2:8-10… we are ordained (commanded) to do the good works of Christ, that we might have faith through which grace can save us… but only grace will save us.

Some of us myself included don’t even think we have the power to choose God on our own Romans 3:10 says “as it is written:‘None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God.’”

That presents a contradiction, because Christ was righteous. If Romans 3:10 meant all individual people without exception, then this would be an error in the bible. Elijah and Moses were also counted righteous, as was Abraham and several others.

So if Romans 3:10 is not refering to all individuals without exception, what IS it referring to? If you flip to Romans 3, the answer quickly becomes apparent: Paul is discussing whether or not the gentiles need to become jews before they can become Christians and he is speaking to compare and contrast the TRADITIONS of the gentiles and the Jews, thus in context Paul is referring present tense to the fact that NO TRADITION, Gentile or Jew, is currently the righteous one seeking God, that they are all bygone ways of men and that Christianity is the answer.

It would have been VERY odd of St Paul to write regarding various traditions, take a one sentence break to talk about individual worth, and then launch right back into discussing traditions as a whole again with not transition in between. The fact of the matter is this: when Paul says no one is righteous he is NOT talking about individuals.

we hold tightly to Faith being the only means of salvation but we also know that if works do not come out of this life then we are lying to ourselves and everyone else.

Conversely, as James lets us know, it is entirely possible to have faith and have no works, and this he terms “dead faith”