Some Questions On Mass Today

[Ace86]

Ok. I went to Mass today and the priest walked in with the deacon and didn’t have a procession. He simply greeted the congregation and said that we would be welcoming the new people who were entering the RCIA. (There actually was a procession of altar boys and girl altar boys, but without the priest). Anyways, he introduced them and everyone clapped. Then he skipped over the Penitential Rite and the Gloria and went straight to the readings. His homily was about a minute long; and then he skipped the Creed. The Liturgy of the Eucharist was okay I think; I didn’t notice if he changed the words. These kinds of things really make me angry.

 

[AlexV]

I believe some would call it fruit of the new springtime.

 

[Ace86]

I believe some would call it fruit of the new springtime.

 

[Pug]

I’m not sure what exactly happened at your mass, but perhaps they were following the Rite of Welcoming for when it is celebrated within the context of mass. Our parish doesn’t do it, so I am not really familiar with all of the adaptions common to it. You’d need to look it up in the RCIA book. Online, I was able to find some of it here. It is a pdf file.

I *think *the creed is still to be said. You’d have to check it out carefully. Since no one is likely to be used to the Rite of Welcoming, it could just be that they were uncomfortable with the order of it. I’d assume that, unless every mass at that parish seems odd.

 

[Ace86]

I’m not sure what exactly happened at your mass, but perhaps they were following the Rite of Welcoming for when it is celebrated within the context of mass. Our parish doesn’t do it, so I am not really familiar with all of the adaptions common to it. You’d need to look it up in the RCIA book. Online, I was able to find some of it here. It is a pdf file.

I *think *the creed is still to be said. You’d have to check it out carefully. Since no one is likely to be used to the Rite of Welcoming, it could just be that they were uncomfortable with the order of it. I’d assume that, unless every mass at that parish seems odd.

Yes that must have been it. Their sponsors signed them on their foreheads, ears, hearts, and whatever. I have never seen it done. But still, there was no procession, there was no Penitential Rite, no Gloria, and no Creed. At all.

 

[John_Lilburne]

Ok. I went to Mass today and the priest walked in with the deacon and didn’t have a procession. He simply greeted the congregation and said that we would be welcoming the new people who were entering the RCIA. (There actually was a procession of altar boys and girl altar boys, but without the priest). Anyways, he introduced them and everyone clapped. Then he skipped over the Penitential Rite and the Gloria and went straight to the readings. His homily was about a minute long; and then he skipped the Creed. The Liturgy of the Eucharist was okay I think; I didn’t notice if he changed the words. These kinds of things really make me angry.

Skipping the Creed is allowed is this Mass. It is difficult to tell from the liturgical book whether skipping the Gloria is permitted.

For the “Rite of Acceptance into the Order of Catechumens” it has in RCIA (USA number 68, Latin number 97):

“When the eucharist is to follow, intercessory prayer is resumed with the usual general intercessions for the needs of the Church and the whole world; then, if required, the profession of faith is said. But for pastoral reasons these general intercessions and the profession of faith may be omitted. The liturgy of the eucharist then begins as usual with the preparation of the gifts.”

But the ceremony before this seems to have been written as if this is not the beginning of a Mass. The priest is not wearing a chasuble, that he needs for Mass, but is described as having “alb or surplice, a stole, and, if desired, a cope of festive color” (n. 48, Latin n. 73).

The Roman Missal does not describe this Mass. It has the other Masses of Christian Initiation (Election, Scrutinies). This includes the 2002 Roman Missal, page 971, as well as the earlier 1975 edition.

So the instructions for the priest for this Mass are confusing. Perhaps it would be simplier to have it as a separate ceremony. But there is an understandable desire to have the whole community involved in this Rite of Acceptance.

Reference: The Rites Volume One, Liturgical Press, 1990, ISBN: 0-8146-6015-0.

 

[puzzleannie]

Yes that must have been it. Their sponsors signed them on their foreheads, ears, hearts, and whatever. I have never seen it done. But still, there was no procession, there was no Penitential Rite, no Gloria, and no Creed. At all.

if the Rite of Acceptance was done with all the bells and whistles, the candidates are greeted at the entrance of church, there is an opening ritual there which replaces the greeting and penitential rite, there is a procession as the candidates and priest come to the place where the rest of the rite will take place, usually in front of the altar. Since the various prayers and blessings take the place of the usual opening rites, those are not done. The reason your Mass was “interupted” by this event was because you, as one of the community, are supposed to be welcoming these people into the assembly, and if you listened to the part where you were called to stand and say Amen to the priest’s prayer on your behalf, and affirm by saying Yes your intent to support and welcome and guide them during their yourney, you would realize that you had an active part in this ceremony.

The Liturgy of the Word is integral to every RCIA rite and should not have been curtailed, although the homily may have been shorter, and by rights should have linked the story of blind Bartimeus to the conversion experience the new catechumens are taking part in. The Sundays with readings like this one that are so pertinent to RCIA are often chosen for the Rof A for this reason. the homily could also have made the point, as our priest did, that Bartimeus had to keep shouting down the crowd who was preventing him from disturbing their view of Jesus by his clamor, and he had to shout to make himself heard above their indifference.

The Creed should definitely not have been omitted, and the prayer of the Faithful should have included some petitions for the catechumens, or it could used the actual petitions and intentions included in the Rite, in which case that would have replaced the Prayer of the Faithful.

too bad your priest did not do a better job explaining what is happening, are you sure there was not a long article in last week’s bulletin (like we had) explaining what would be going on, perhaps listing the names of the candidates?

 

[Ace86]

if the Rite of Acceptance was done with all the bells and whistles, the candidates are greeted at the entrance of church, there is an opening ritual there which replaces the greeting and penitential rite, there is a procession as the candidates and priest come to the place where the rest of the rite will take place, usually in front of the altar. Since the various prayers and blessings take the place of the usual opening rites, those are not done. The reason your Mass was “interupted” by this event was because you, as one of the community, are supposed to be welcoming these people into the assembly, and if you listened to the part where you were called to stand and say Amen to the priest’s prayer on your behalf, and affirm by saying Yes your intent to support and welcome and guide them during their yourney, you would realize that you had an active part in this ceremony.

The Liturgy of the Word is integral to every RCIA rite and should not have been curtailed, although the homily may have been shorter, and by rights should have linked the story of blind Bartimeus to the conversion experience the new catechumens are taking part in. The Sundays with readings like this one that are so pertinent to RCIA are often chosen for the Rof A for this reason. the homily could also have made the point, as our priest did, that Bartimeus had to keep shouting down the crowd who was preventing him from disturbing their view of Jesus by his clamor, and he had to shout to make himself heard above their indifference.

The Creed should definitely not have been omitted, and the prayer of the Faithful should have included some petitions for the catechumens, or it could used the actual petitions and intentions included in the Rite, in which case that would have replaced the Prayer of the Faithful.

too bad your priest did not do a better job explaining what is happening, are you sure there was not a long article in last week’s bulletin (like we had) explaining what would be going on, perhaps listing the names of the candidates?

Well I understand if they have the option to omit those things, but is it really necessary?? If you’re welcoming newcomers and catechumens, then why not have the whole Mass for them?? I was quite frankly disappointed.

 

[John_Lilburne]

… The Creed should definitely not have been omitted, …

The Creed (the Profession of Faith) can be omitted from this Mass:

“then, if required, the profession of faith is said. But for pastoral reasons these general intercessions and the profession of faith may be omitted.”
Rite of Christian Initiation of Adults, n. 68, Latin n. 97. (From The Rites Volume One, Liturgical Press, 1990, ISBN: 0-8146-6015-0, page 66).

 

[puzzleannie]

Well I understand if they have the option to omit those things, but is it really necessary?? If you’re welcoming newcomers and catechumens, then why not have the whole Mass for them?? I was quite frankly disappointed.

The liturgy follows a prescribed form and the prescribed form when something like one of the RCIA rites, or baptism of infants within Mass, or a sprinkling rite, or a special feast like Palm Sunday with a procession – these are some examples – is to omit certain of the introductory or penitential rites in lieu of the other ceremonies. Some of these choices are optional on the part of the priest, some are not. In most cases the substituted rite contains the elements of the rite that has been omitted, but in a different form. Next time this happens, try to listen carefully to the “new” prayers and actions and see of this isn’t true.

 

[prv]

Ok. I went to Mass today and the priest walked in with the deacon and didn’t have a procession. He simply greeted the congregation and said that we would be welcoming the new people who were entering the RCIA. (There actually was a procession of altar boys and girl altar boys, but without the priest). Anyways, he introduced them and everyone clapped. Then he skipped over the Penitential Rite and the Gloria and went straight to the readings. His homily was about a minute long; and then he skipped the Creed. The Liturgy of the Eucharist was okay I think; I didn’t notice if he changed the words. These kinds of things really make me angry.

Now, I’m not sure about a precession with the altar servers w/o the clergy…did the servers process with the music? The rest of it, I guess, would be okay, if permiited by the rubrics.