Some surprising statements on the Catholic Answers website.

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CSN:
Can’t people look at statements made by right wing fundamentalists and paint all Christians with the same brush?
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The difference is this: the Islamic RELIGION calls for violence, the Christian RELIGION does not.
 
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CSN:
What about Judaism? Basically our Old Testament…

Isn’t that fairly violent ?
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Be Blessed,
Straight talk on a serious issue. I am given pause by those who fear discussing facts for concern of hurting feelings… Being too sensitive allowed this movement to grow IMHO.

CSN,
What is you point? Your first question was if the article was out of place, but you did not elaborate when asked too. I would also ask what in the tone of the article was surprising to you?

Your second question was about right wing fundamentalists, but seemed off topic to me. Are you equating Jihad to right wing fundamentalists? How so?

I also don’t see what the OT has to do with today’s Jihad. Your original question wasn’t about the Qur’an, it was about the article you sited.

I’m confused.

Peace,
CS
 
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Shadowcry:
Christianity is a religion of peace? Really how can you say a religion is a religion of peace or violence? The adherents of religions can sin, that doesn’t make the religion a religion of violence.

I cannot understand how you would come to your viewpoint, could you please elaborate
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Shadowcry,

Christianity has had its share of criminals that have committed heinous acts, there is no denying that, however they have done so in defiance of the teachings of Christianity. Muslim terrorists who have made statements about their crimes have claimed they do so in the name of Islam and according to its teachings. I have often read that we must judge a religion on it’s teachings and not on the actions of it’s adherents. What are we to believe when the criminal actions of some Muslims coincide with what they claim to be the true teachings of Islam? What are we to believe while other Muslims cheer the crime or remain silent and refuse to condemn the crimes or the violent interpretation of certain teachings? “What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson
 
George Waters:
Shadowcry,

Christianity has had its share of criminals that have committed heinous acts, there is no denying that, however they have done so in defiance of the teachings of Christianity. Muslim terrorists who have made statements about their crimes have claimed they do so in the name of Islam and according to its teachings. I have often read that we must judge a religion on it’s teachings and not on the actions of it’s adherents. What are we to believe when the criminal actions of some Muslims coincide with what they claim to be the true teachings of Islam? What are we to believe while other Muslims cheer the crime or remain silent and refuse to condemn the crimes or the violent interpretation of certain teachings? “What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say.” – Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Well in the 1500s the governments of many Christian nations ( Spain and Portuagal for exaple) spread Christianity through the sword.

So what have you to say about that.
 
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Shadowcry:
Well in the 1500s the governments of many Christian nations ( Spain and Portuagal for exaple) spread Christianity through the sword.

So what have you to say about that.
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I say that those governments were not acting in accordance with the teachings of Christianity. The ends do not justify the means. It was wrong.
 
What abotu the church in the fourth century who gained so much influence in the roman empier that it killed the 'Ethnikoi" for refusing to convert to Chritianity.
 
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Shadowcry:
What abotu the church in the fourth century who gained so much influence in the roman empier that it killed the 'Ethnikoi" for refusing to convert to Chritianity.
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See my previous post. I will not justify any crime, regardless if it was done (especially when it was done) in the name of Christianity.
 
So doens’t this make Christianity a religion of peace. Really a religion cannot be catergozized as peaceful or violent. To do that is so arrogant.
 
I find it interesting that when Muslims need to cite an example of Christian violence they must go back 500 - 1500 years.

To cite examples of Muslim violence, all one need do is open today’s newspaper.

Let’s live in the here-and-now, shall we?

Paul
 
I’m not Muslim.

I can say whatever I want.

If you live in the here and now shouldn’t you submit to secularism?
 
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Shadowcry:
So doens’t this make Christianity a religion of peace. Really a religion cannot be catergozized as peaceful or violent. To do that is so arrogant.
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I would say that Christianity is a religion of peace, yes though as I said in post #24 we have our share of criminals who have acted contrary to Christianity. You asked for someone to elaborate. I have done so. If you wish to view the opinions of others based on experience or knowledge as arrogant so be it. That is your right. I was simply giving you the courtesy of an answer.
 
Well to me it is arrogant. To you it maybe acceptable either way that is your opinion.
 
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CSN:
Can’t people look at statements made by right wing fundamentalists and paint all Christians with the same brush?
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I suspect you have not had much dealings with so called right wing fundamentalists. i have worked with them extensively in the pro-life ministry and am hard pressed to undrstand how anyone could compare these compassionate, God fearing, deeply spiritual people to Jihadists. Most of the attacks i see against them are based on their embracng of conservative politics
 
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Shadowcry:
I’m not Muslim.
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Really? You sound like a Muslim.
I can say whatever I want.
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I never said you couldn’t. But others are also free to point out the foolishness of what you say.
If you live in the here and now shouldn’t you submit to secularism?
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That’s a non-sequitur. I am a Catholic, and must live out my faith in the world that exists now. I am in the world, but not of the world. Do you really think that secularism is the only life choice for people today?

Peace to you,
Paul
 
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CSN:
I read this on the Catholic Answers main page, and was a bit surprised at its tone.

catholic.com/library/endless_jihad.asp

Does anyone else feel that it seems out of place?
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Not out of place at all. I was glad to see some reality for once on this issue. Westerners better wake up to the facts pointed out in the article.
 
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PaulDupre:
Really? You sound like a Muslim.

I never said you couldn’t. But others are also free to point out the foolishness of what you say.

That’s a non-sequitur. I am a Catholic, and must live out my faith in the world that exists now. I am in the world, but not of the world. Do you really think that secularism is the only life choice for people today?

Peace to you,
Paul
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Foolishness what foolishness. If I wanted to be an arrogant * * I could name call everyone one here for their beliefs but i am not so.
Maybe you should see the log in your own eye instead of pointing out the speck in another’s eye perhaps.

Secularism is not the only life choice out for people today but then you talk as if only now matters and it doesnt. The past is important .
 
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Shadowcry:
Well to me it is arrogant. To you it maybe acceptable either way that is your opinion.
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That is right, Shadowcry, we all have opinions. Some based upon experience and fact some based on simple likes and dislikes and some based on erroneous information and preconceived notions. What you or I may call arrogance someone else may call recognition of facts.

I am curious, why in your opinion can’t a religion be considered peaceful or violent based on its teachings and the actions of its adherents due to those teachings?

I agree the past is important. It seems too often that instead of learning from the past people want to use it to justify current bad behavior.
 
“Maybe you should see the log in your own eye instead of pointing out the speck in another’s eye perhaps.”

Muslim. Definitely muslim.

Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

(fyi shadow: inside joke for americans. welcome.)
 
I have not seen proper justification of the claim that violence itself is inherent in Islam. Islam was born in a very volatile society and faced persecution and the threat of destruction from its very inception. Thus, it is no surprise that we see violence in its early history. Likewise, the Old Testament was written in a society where war was a constant, yet when the Hebrew God commands genocide or tells the Israelite men that if they rape a pagan virgin, they have to take her as his wife (giving implicit approval to the rape), there is no attempt to label Judaism or Christianity as inherently violent. The name for God in in ancient times was Yahewh Sabboath, “the God of Armies”. Sound violent to you?

Christian and Church history is splattered with blood, imperialism, the crusades, the inquisition, ect. But these are against the fundamental teachings of Christianity you say? Those who performed these acts did not seem to think so, in fact, some of the greatest travesties in human history have had so called biblical support. Slavery used to be defended by the bible! Yet we decry this as a misinterpretation of scripture, not taking it in its context ect…similarly, moderate Muslims do the same. The extremisits are misuing the Qu’ran, are not looking at its in context and deriving dangerous interpretations.

Lets not forget that Islamic Civilization was once thriving above and beyond Christendom and made numerous, valuable, discoveries that the emerging West later relied on. The Middle East was not always the hotbed of fanaticism it is today.

What we have to recognize is that the Middle East is, to an extent, behind the Western world. It is ruled by dictatorships and theocracy, for years it was dominated and abused by Western powers which have left devastating effects, it suffers from cultural impositions and uncertainty. I do not deny that the Middle East has serious progress to be made in many regards, that it is more violent and less rational, however, these are complex socio-cultural-historical issues, and I think it is a grave error to blame this on the religion of Islam.

For example, Africa is a continent plagued by civil wars and violence. Is this to suggest that Africans are inherently violent, or do other factors stimulate the surge in civil wars?

Islam does mean peace. Its a peace that is achieved through total submission to the laws of God.
 
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