Soul for Aliens?

[Sir_Knight]

We are made in the image and likeness of God. Would it be an accurate assumption that if aliens do not appear human, then they do not have a soul and that if they did appear human, then they did have a soul?

 

[cecilia97]

Can’t believe I’m responding to a post in the Philosophy forum.

God does not have a body, He is spirit. The “image and likeness” that He gave us then cannot be our bodies, but our souls/spirit.

(I hope I have this part right) My pet dog has a “soul” but it’s not an immortal soul like mine. When her body dies her spirit and memories, etc, will cease to exist. Her soul was not created in the image and likeness of God.

If aliens exist, they were created by God just like everything else in the universe.

If aliens have immortal souls, then they would be souls created by God in His “image and likeness”. If aliens are more like what we call animals, like my dog, then they don’t have immortal souls. But they are still beings created by God.

 

[Sir_Knight]

Can’t believe I’m responding to a post in the Philosophy forum.

Didn’t know where else to put it.

If aliens have immortal souls, then they would be souls created by God in His “image and likeness”. If aliens are more like what we call animals, like my dog, then they don’t have immortal souls. But they are still beings created by God.

That’s my question.

 

[cecilia97]

Didn’t know where else to put it.

That’s my question.

Well, I don’t think we could draw any conclusions about an alien having an immortal soul based on appearance, since God has no appearance per se.

If we assume that the soul is the place where music, art, creative forms of self-expression come from, then maybe we could know about an alien based on those things. But self-awareness, care for offspring, communication, even the ability to learn skills…animals have those things without the benefit of an immortal soul.

Ever seen the TV special on elephants where all the “family” files past the bones of a dead elephant and gently snuffles them with their trunks? It appears soulful to me because I’m projecting my own feelings onto the elephants. So how would we know about an alien just by their actions? It’s a creepy thought!

 

[CapIV]

when God gave us His “image and likeness”, it doesn’t mean that we look just like God. It means that we were born with the Truth of God. If we were not, than there would be no right and wrong or morality. For example, animals are not born in the “image and likeness” of God so therefore they cannot be moral or immoral. They just act out their nature at all times.

At the present time, we don’t know anything about alien life. But if aliens were indeed contacted, we would then have to decide whether or not they had a capacity for reason or not.

 

[mschrank]

Anything that is alive has a soul.

Also, animals may not have immortal souls, but St. Francis seemed to think there was hope for animals as of yet. After all, all of creation including the doggies and kitties is yearning for the sons of God to be revealed in Glory.

 

[ricmat]

Image and likeness of God imbues humans with free-will, the ability to reason, the capability to love, and the capability to commune with God.

If aliens were to meet these characteristics, then it would be a strong argument for having a soul.

IMO

 

[mschrank]

Image and likeness of God imbues humans with free-will, the ability to reason, the capability to love, and the capability to commune with God.

If aliens were to meet these characteristics, then it would be a strong argument for having a soul.

IMO

Um no, my German Shepherd has a soul.

Seriously the confusion over what a soul is and does needs to be cleared up, it’s something that even most Christians seemed to be confused on.

Darn you Descartes, Darn you to Heck! (tongue in cheek of course, I have all confidence Descartes will make it out of purgatory eventually )

 

[ricmat]

Um no, my German Shepherd has a soul.

Seriously the confusion over what a soul is and does needs to be cleared up, it’s something that even most Christians seemed to be confused on.

Darn you Descartes, Darn you to Heck! (tongue in cheek of course, I have all confidence Descartes will make it out of purgatory eventually )

I interpreted the OP as asking if aliens might have souls, just like humans do.

We have immortal souls. German Shepards do not, although they have material souls. The characteristics I listed above are from the Catechism, starting with paragraph 365…

Also, the book “The Science Before Science” goes into souls in a lot of detail.

 

[mschrank]

Oh, you mean spiritual souls like humans do. Well, we didn’t need to have them so it all depends on what God wanted to do. Our bodies evolved naturally* so if God had not specially deigned to make us a special animal (rational animal) then we would not have spiritual souls.

*I say naturally, because I do not believe God waved his magic wand occasionally like IDers do, but I cannot really believe that the tendency to complexity can be wholly explained as of yet with the current theories.

 

[ricmat]

Oh, you mean spiritual souls like humans do. Well, we didn’t need to have them so it all depends on what God wanted to do. Our bodies evolved naturally* so if God had not specially deigned to make us a special animal (rational animal) then we would not have spiritual souls.

*I say naturally, because I do not believe God waved his magic wand occasionally like IDers do, but I cannot really believe that the tendency to complexity can be wholly explained as of yet with the current theories.

I have no idea where you are going with this. Are you carrying over an argument from another thread? Does this have anything to do with the OP?

 

[mschrank]

?

You’re asking if an alien has to have a spiritual soul, right? What kind of alien? A sentient, human-like alien? Then yeah, by definition it has to have a spiritual soul, it it’d be an non-rational animal and would not be thought of as human-like.

However there is no blanket answer. Depends on what God wants to do.

 

[ricmat]

?

You’re asking if an alien has to have a spiritual soul, right? What kind of alien? A sentient, human-like alien? Then yeah, by definition it has to have a spiritual soul, it it’d be an non-rational animal and would not be thought of as human-like.

However there is no blanket answer. Depends on what God wants to do.

I said that IF an alien had the characteristics of free-will, the ability to reason, the capability to love, and the capability to commune with God, then it would be a good argument in favor of “human like” souls (which are spiritual souls).

Sentience is pretty much defined as “ability to reason”, but without free-will, and the capability to love (God), there still would not be a human like soul.

I was confused when you mentioned ID in your last post.

 

[mschrank]

If an alien had those things, then they would definitely have spiritual souls.

Reason is related to the intellect and is proper to the spiritual soul.

In its general sense, therefore, reason may be attributed to God, and an angel may be called rational. But in its narrower meaning reason is man’s differentia, at once his necessity and his privilege; that by which he is “a little less than the angels”, and that by which he excels the brutes. Reasoning, as St. Thomas says, is a defect of intellect.

newadvent.org/cathen/12673b.htm

Will is also a function of the spiritual soul.

(Will is…) but a superadded formative energy, embodying a rational judgment; it is more than an epitome, or summing-up, of preceding (natural/animalistic) phenomena; it is a criticism of them…

newadvent.org/cathen/15624a.htm

 

[fhansen]

From what I understand, all of the aliens we know of have souls except for the ones from Europa, a moon right here in our own solar system. We’re not sure what the deal is there but are working to find out. What we do know is that philosophically the inhabitants are materialists, indifferentists, pessimists, and/or amoralists. Behaviorally they are a lot like us.

 

[mangy_dog]

We are made in the image and likeness of God. Would it be an accurate assumption that if aliens do not appear human, then they do not have a soul and that if they did appear human, then they did have a soul?

Hello Knight,

You’re probably “just asking” and you may or may not know that the “rabbit hole” goes a lot deeper than what your question implies.

Friendly recommendation…stick with the sound doctrine.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[Genesis315]

We are made in the image and likeness of God. Would it be an accurate assumption that if aliens do not appear human, then they do not have a soul and that if they did appear human, then they did have a soul?

Pope St. Zachary condemned the idea that there could be human beings on other planets, because it meant that they did not come from Adam and Eve (and all human beings come from two original parents). Likewise, the salvation of man is linked to the incarnation–God became man so man might become God. How would aliens be saved if they did have immortal souls and sinned? They couldn’t unless some other person of trinity became incarnate as an alien (since the aliens cannot be human beings)–but this has not happened–and according to St. Anselm, any other person of the Trinity becoming incarnate would not be wholly fitting (the Father-Son relationship is what made it fitting for the Second Person to lower Himself).

 

[ricmat]

Pope St. Zachary condemned the idea that there could be human beings on other planets, because it meant that they did not come from Adam and Eve (and all human beings come from two original parents). Likewise, the salvation of man is linked to the incarnation–God became man so man might become God. How would aliens be saved if they did have immortal souls and sinned? They couldn’t unless some other person of trinity became incarnate as an alien (since the aliens cannot be human beings)–but this has not happened–and according to St. Anselm, any other person of the Trinity becoming incarnate would not be wholly fitting (the Father-Son relationship is what made it fitting for the Second Person to lower Himself).

Obviously, aliens couldn’t have human souls if they weren’t descended from Adam and Eve. But Pope St. Zachary obviously never heard of Stargate SG1 (just a joke!).

Do angels have souls? I think that was seriously debated at one time.

If the Church has dogmatically declared that “only humans” can have souls, then I’ll go with that. But if it hasn’t, I can see the possibility that there might be some non-human creatures with intellect, free-will, the ability to love, and who are searching for God. How God would handle that situation…beats me. But I’m sure he could do it if he wanted to

 

[mangy_dog]

Pope St. Zachary condemned the idea that there could be human beings on other planets, because it meant that they did not come from Adam and Eve (and all human beings come from two original parents). Likewise, the salvation of man is linked to the incarnation–God became man so man might become God. How would aliens be saved if they did have immortal souls and sinned? They couldn’t unless some other person of trinity became incarnate as an alien (since the aliens cannot be human beings)–but this has not happened–and according to St. Anselm, any other person of the Trinity becoming incarnate would not be wholly fitting (the Father-Son relationship is what made it fitting for the Second Person to lower Himself).

St. Zachary did the right thing and St. Anselm made it clearer. The Son is the Saviour, that is His Divine role.
Even if (and this is a very big “if”) the universe were full of human or “humanoid” (for all you SG-1 fans) beings, Christ sacrafice would have been super-abundant for all creation because it is the sacrafice of a Divine Being, the maker of heaven and earth and of all that is seen and unseen. No need to die and resurrect over and over again on different planets.
Now, as we understand (and often times we don’t) the expulsion of the fallen angels from heaven, they retained their angelic powers and because they could not …devour the [Child] born of the Woman and because they could not harm the Woman - they went to wage war against man. Angelic beings can appear in coporeal form, eat food, struggle physically with Jacob…and that’s just the good angels.
Considering that God limits the powers of fallen angels (to what degree we don’t know) and that Lucifer had asked God for a longer period of time and increased power - and was granted this…we can only speculate what these UFO’s and alleged alien creatures are. The rabbit hole goes a lot deeper. It is not worth dicussing. Best to stick with the sound doctrine.

Pax Domini sit semper vobiscum.

 

[Sir_Knight]

Lucifer had asked God for a longer period of time and increased power - and was granted this

Come again? Satan asked God for more power and more time for the obvious purpose of corrupting more souls and God, who, according to scripture, wants all to be saved, granted this request to Satan?

Is this officially documented somewhere or is this part of some private revelation?