souls in hell

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samuraisedge18

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it is said that the worst part of hell is that God does not exist there. for the damned souls that go to hell, if during their life they hated God or didn’t acknowledge him, do you think they regret it? if they didn’t want anything to do with God, why should they care? Or do you think that since God watches over and guides the world that they suffer because of the complete chaos in hell due to the lack of God’s presence? Since on earth God gives everyone a chance to acknowledge him. Or do you think they also suffer the kind of physical pain like burning?
 
I think the worst thing for those in hell is the fact that they have no communion with God. There is no hope of it for those in hell and they fully realize it. God respects our free will so if we don’t choose Him on Earth he will not make us be with Him in Heaven for eternity. With that being said I think the some souls in hell regret that they did not want a relationship with God, but it is a little to late for regret and it increases their anger toward God.

God Bless,
Matt
 
marty1818 said:
I think the worst thing for those in hell is the fact that they have no communion with God. There is no hope of it for those in hell and they fully realize it. God respects our free will so if we don’t choose Him on Earth he will not make us be with Him in Heaven for eternity. With that being said I think the some souls in hell regret that they did not want a relationship with God, but it is a little to late for regret and it increases their anger toward God.

God Bless,
Matt
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but what do you think makes them regret denying God?
 
At one time, I thought that hell was simply, “where God is not.”

But that in itself seems rather odd. For God is everywhere, and if God is not somewhere, then “somewhere” doesn’t exist. But since we believe that souls do persist in hell, then we must say that God exists there too.

How I understand hell now is this: When we die and approach God, many are going to have different reactions toward facing the Divine. Some will rejoice (the saints), others will be powerfully penitent and sorrowful though their love of God and God’s love for them will sustain them (purgatory). Finally, there will be a third group so angry at God or so full of despair that they will feel a certain pain in the presence of God. These men and women are in hell, and they will remain there, persistent in their hatred or despair, never wanting to be happy with him, being unable to understand how one could be happy.

In short, God is present everywhere. Hell is full of the presence of God, but to such a degree that those in hell are in torment.
 
This oldie somehow seems apropos in this thread:

Boyle’s Law

A thermodynamics professor had written a take home exam for his graduate students. It had one question:

“Is Hell exothermic (gives off heat) or endothermic (absorbs heat)? Support your answer with a proof.”

Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle’s Law (gas cools off when it expands and heats up when it is compressed) or some variant. One student, however, wrote the following:

First, we need to know how the mass of Hell is changing in time. So, we need to know the rate that souls are moving into Hell and the rate they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a soul gets to Hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving. As for how many souls are entering Hell, let’s look at the different religions that exist in the world today. Some of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, you will go to Hell. Since there are more than one of these religions and since people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all people and all souls go to Hell.

With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in Hell to increase exponentially. Now, we look at the rate of change of the volume in Hell because Boyle’s Law states that in order for the temperature and pressure in Hell to stay the same, the volume of Hell has to expand as souls are added. This gives two possibilities.

#1 If Hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter Hell, then the temperature and pressure in Hell will increase until all Hell breaks loose.

#2 Of course, if Hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in Hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until Hell freezes over.

So which is it? If we accept the postulate given to me by Ms. Therese Banyan during my Freshman year, “That it will be a cold night in Hell before I sleep with you,” and take into account the fact that I still have not succeeded, then #2 cannot be true, and so Hell is exothermic.

The student got the only A.
 
johnnykins said:
This oldie somehow seems apropos in this thread:

Boyle’s Law

A thermodynamics professor had written a take home exam for his graduate students. It had one question:

“Is Hell exothermic (gives off heat) or endothermic (absorbs heat)? Support your answer with a proof.”

Most of the students wrote proofs of their beliefs using Boyle’s Law (gas cools off when it expands and heats up when it is compressed) or some variant. One student, however, wrote the following:

First, we need to know how the mass of Hell is changing in time. So, we need to know the rate that souls are moving into Hell and the rate they are leaving. I think that we can safely assume that once a soul gets to Hell, it will not leave. Therefore, no souls are leaving. As for how many souls are entering Hell, let’s look at the different religions that exist in the world today. Some of these religions state that if you are not a member of their religion, you will go to Hell. Since there are more than one of these religions and since people do not belong to more than one religion, we can project that all people and all souls go to Hell.

With birth and death rates as they are, we can expect the number of souls in Hell to increase exponentially. Now, we look at the rate of change of the volume in Hell because Boyle’s Law states that in order for the temperature and pressure in Hell to stay the same, the volume of Hell has to expand as souls are added. This gives two possibilities.

#1 If Hell is expanding at a slower rate than the rate at which souls enter Hell, then the temperature and pressure in Hell will increase until all Hell breaks loose.

#2 Of course, if Hell is expanding at a rate faster than the increase of souls in Hell, then the temperature and pressure will drop until Hell freezes over.

So which is it? If we accept the postulate given to me by Ms. Therese Banyan during my Freshman year, “That it will be a cold night in Hell before I sleep with you,” and take into account the fact that I still have not succeeded, then #2 cannot be true, and so Hell is exothermic.

The student got the only A.
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i kind of understand what you mean. forgive me if you feel that i should have understood youre answer but are you saying that souls in hell get more miserable as more souls enter? are the souls tormenting each other? how does this answer my question?
 
samuraisedge18 said:
i kind of understand what you mean. forgive me if you feel that i should have understood youre answer but are you saying that souls in hell get more miserable as more souls enter? are the souls tormenting each other? how does this answer my question?
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It is a joke…

Hell is not a “physical” place. We can not locate hell on a map.
 
samuraisedge18 said:
it is said that the worst part of hell is that God does not exist there. for the damned souls that go to hell, if during their life they hated God or didn’t acknowledge him, do you think they regret it? if they didn’t want anything to do with God, why should they care? Or do you think that since God watches over and guides the world that they suffer because of the complete chaos in hell due to the lack of God’s presence? Since on earth God gives everyone a chance to acknowledge him. Or do you think they also suffer the kind of physical pain like burning?
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From my reading of Scripture, especially 2 Esdras (non-canonical) and personal experience:

Yes, they do regret it. They see the Father. They see the difference between good and evil. They suffer at the sight of their sin and rebellion. Our Father shows it to them.

Yes, they sense physical pain.

Peace…

MW
 
samuraisedge18 said:
it is said that the worst part of hell is that God does not exist there. for the damned souls that go to hell, if during their life they hated God or didn’t acknowledge him, do you think they regret it? if they didn’t want anything to do with God, why should they care? Or do you think that since God watches over and guides the world that they suffer because of the complete chaos in hell due to the lack of God’s presence? Since on earth God gives everyone a chance to acknowledge him. Or do you think they also suffer the kind of physical pain like burning?
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As we all know once we have passed the next stop is judgement. At this judgement we will be in front of God. If I never believed in God while on earth or denied Him…the truth of God as I stand in front of Him will open my eyes. As sentence is passed and I travel to Hell and the absence of God I will realize one thing…God was always with me while on earth. And now he is not.

Example - If you tell a person from 1500 years ago what air is they probably wont believe you. But just because they dont believe doesnt make it not true. If suddenly there is no air…same person would realize that you were correct.

Even if you don’t beleive in God, He is with you. You may not feel Him. But He is there. Imagine your soul without God, and that is Hell.

Only my thoughts 🙂
 
Zahmir said:
At one time, I thought that hell was simply, “where God is not.”

But that in itself seems rather odd. For God is everywhere, and if God is not somewhere, then “somewhere” doesn’t exist. But since we believe that souls do persist in hell, then we must say that God exists there too.

How I understand hell now is this: When we die and approach God, many are going to have different reactions toward facing the Divine. Some will rejoice (the saints), others will be powerfully penitent and sorrowful though their love of God and God’s love for them will sustain them (purgatory). Finally, there will be a third group so angry at God or so full of despair that they will feel a certain pain in the presence of God. These men and women are in hell, and they will remain there, persistent in their hatred or despair, never wanting to be happy with him, being unable to understand how one could be happy.

In short, God is present everywhere. Hell is full of the presence of God, but to such a degree that those in hell are in torment.
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This sounds a lot like what I understand the Orthodox position to be - heaven, hell and purgatory are physically the same place, but our dispositions towards that place make it one or the other - there is a quote from St Augustine where he says that the same action of stirring a cesspit and a perfume produce opposite results based on the substance, which seems to support this.

Is it heretical from a Catholic point of view though? Doesn’t the CCC explicitly state that Hell is the absence of God?
 
DL82 said:
This sounds a lot like what I understand the Orthodox position to be - heaven, hell and purgatory are physically the same place, but our dispositions towards that place make it one or the other - there is a quote from St Augustine where he says that the same action of stirring a cesspit and a perfume produce opposite results based on the substance, which seems to support this.

Is it heretical from a Catholic point of view though? Doesn’t the CCC explicitly state that Hell is the absence of God?
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The Catechism states that hell is “separation from God,” which is in keeping with my understanding of hell. One can be “separate from God” without God being absent. Indeed, I cannot insist more that wherever God is not (at least in some manner of speaking), nothing is. At the very least, God must continue to know and love those in hell lest they cease to exist altogether.
 
marty1818 said:
Because they realize how miserable they are now without communion with God and they cannot change it ever.
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And yet when they were alive “without communion” they were perfectly happy.

What’s to not say they won’t be perfectly happy there?
 
DL82 said:
This sounds a lot like what I understand the Orthodox position to be - heaven, hell and purgatory are physically the same place, but our dispositions towards that place make it one or the other - there is a quote from St Augustine where he says that the same action of stirring a cesspit and a perfume produce opposite results based on the substance, which seems to support this.

Is it heretical from a Catholic point of view though? Doesn’t the CCC explicitly state that Hell is the absence of God?
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Do you mean specifically Greek Orthodox doctrine?

That is actually the only description that makes any sense at all.

I once heard the two “persepctives” described as such.

People are sitting at a dinner table. There is a smorgasborg of wonderful food at the table. Each person however, only has one chopstick each, and their other hand(not holding the chopstick) is tied behind their backs.

The people in heaven, work together with the person sitting opposite them. They use their choptsticks together, and take turns in feeding each other.

The people in Hell, constantly spear the food with their one chopstick, but never end up with any of the wonderful food.

Same place, different PEOPLE.

Adding my own little flavour into that story, perhaps purgatory, is being forced to sit across some-one you really dislike, but realize that you have to care about each other, to get anywhere…hehe 🙂

Is that concept really the Orthodox Christian theology?
 
Dameedna said:
And yet when they were alive “without communion” they were perfectly happy.
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There’s a big difference that we’re missing here. Before, they were ignorant of God, His power, His grace, His love. However, now when they leave their earthly bodies and face judgment they will see those things and be horrified at their sins and lack of communion with Him. They will be shown fully the qualities of light and qualities of darkness and be ashamed at their lack of light.

I’ve known people who were happy in this life without God, but I’ve never met one who was filled with JOY. There’s a difference.
What’s to not say they won’t be perfectly happy there?
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Because Scripture, Tradition and reason say otherwise.

If you reason that hell is what we think it is - a place of judgment and punishment - then there can be no happiness there. Faulty logic.

Peace…

MW
 
Mystic_Warrior said:
There’s a big difference that we’re missing here. Before, they were ignorant of God, His power, His grace, His love. However, now when they leave their earthly bodies and face judgment they will see those things and be horrified at their sins and lack of communion with Him. They will be shown fully the qualities of light and qualities of darkness and be ashamed at their lack of light.

I’ve known people who were happy in this life without God, but I’ve never met one who was filled with JOY. There’s a difference.
Click to expand...
Okay, so they were ignorant.
Because Scripture, Tradition and reason say otherwise.
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If you reason that hell is what we think it is - a place of judgment and punishment - then there can be no happiness there. Faulty logic.
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Peace…
Click to expand...
MW
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So ignorant people will be punished, for their ignorance?

I’m glad my school teachers didn’t think that way. 🙂
 
Mystic_Warrior said:
I’ve known people who were happy in this life without God, but I’ve never met one who was filled with JOY. There’s a difference.
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I missed this before, my appologies.

How do you know, that the person you met was not actually filled with Joy?

Are you so sure you recognize Joy?

Or Peace?

Many claim to, and yet, they all do the wrong thing 🙂
 
Dameedna said:
Okay, so they were ignorant.

So ignorant people will be punished, for their ignorance?

I’m glad my school teachers didn’t think that way. 🙂
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I’m not talking about invincible ignorance where they know nothing of God. Simply ignorance as opposed to wisdom in the form of foolishness. Foolishness would have been a better word to use, but I use them interchangeably to mean the same thing.

Peace…

MW
 
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