Sour faced Catholics

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Rae8 said:
How can people go to church and take communion week after week and leave church as sour faced and rude as when they entered? No light shines from them. If anything, one would think them atheist!
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I don’t know, but Pope Francis addressed this in one of his recent homilies: romereports.com/pg155795-pope-s-mass-sad-christians-don-t-do-the-church-any-favors-with-that-attitude-en#.Uv8DZIAgC4k.facebook

Also, this anime meme I made in humor a while back about this issue seems relevant 😃

 
suko said:
I don’t know, but Pope Francis addressed this in one of his recent homilies: romereports.com/pg155795-pope-s-mass-sad-christians-don-t-do-the-church-any-favors-with-that-attitude-en#.Uv8DZIAgC4k.facebook

Also, this anime meme I made in humor a while back about this issue seems relevant 😃

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q94/suikojay/EmiEdited3.jpg
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LOL. Not sure if they looked quite that sour.

I didn’t remember until Robwar mentioned it earlier about Pope Francis speaking about this.

I guess some of us see it that way and some don’t. But I’m in good company at least. 😛

(Another link to that is: catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1302082.htm )
 
Rae8 said:
How can people go to church and take communion week after week and leave church as sour faced and rude as when they entered? No light shines from them. If anything, one would think them atheist!

Coming from a protestant background, I am just not used to this and its a bit upsetting at times. I love the Catholic teachings and faith and have encountered far more sweet people. But have also seen and encountered far too many of these sour faced - downright rude - people who one would never even know to be a Christian from their actions and words.

I never encountered this in the Protestant church. Maybe its because Protestants read the bible more? I’m just trying to understand it. The protestants I knew, overall, just exuded joy and light. And yes, some Catholics do too. But sadly far too few.

( Or maybe its the Protestant music just puts them in a better mood. 😛 )
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I think this comment is very unfair.

You have no idea what people are going through in their lives - some families and individuals face very real problems on a daily basis.

If you don’t mind me saying, you sound very young.
 
Rae8 said:
If you don’t feel it then I understand its not going happen but a small smile returned back to someone who makes an effort to reach out can’t really be that hard. That is not being false or hypocritical, its being loving and charitable.
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At the same time, I’d try not to demand reactions of other people; this and other threads have reminded me of people in my past who’ve been intensely shy or have been diagnosed with mental problems and may come across as “rude” to other people when they don’t intend to be.

If I encountered a person who didn’t return a gesture of mine, I’d try to remember Luke 6:35 and its context, here thinking of “making an effort to reach out” as an instance of “lending.”

[BIBLEDRB]Luke 6:32-36[/BIBLEDRB]

By quoting this, I am also not implying, of course, that such people who don’t return our gestures are “the unthankful” or “the evil”–just that if we are to be merciful as our Father is merciful, we could do at least this much for those who aren’t unthankful or evil, even if we initially judge them to be.
There were two consecutive instances of some pretty rude behavior last week that prompted me to need to get this off my chest as they say. I knew I would be attacked for posting this.
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What are those instances? Without specifics, discussions are more likely to drift from what you may have intended.

Do you think that people have been attacking you in this thread? If so, then I’m mentioning the issue because it’s potentially a good example of how different people interpret different things differently (just as people will sometimes interpret certain facial expressions as “unfriendliness” when none was actually present or intended).
 
Rae8 said:
How can people go to church and take communion week after week and leave church as sour faced and rude as when they entered? No light shines from them. If anything, one would think them atheist!

Coming from a protestant background, I am just not used to this and its a bit upsetting at times. I love the Catholic teachings and faith and have encountered far more sweet people. But have also seen and encountered far too many of these sour faced - downright rude - people who one would never even know to be a Christian from their actions and words.

I never encountered this in the Protestant church. Maybe its because Protestants read the bible more? I’m just trying to understand it. The protestants I knew, overall, just exuded joy and light. And yes, some Catholics do too. But sadly far too few.

( Or maybe its the Protestant music just puts them in a better mood. 😛 )
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Probably the music, especially if they are from a high Episcopal church…

But seriously, one of the things ice noticed that really strikes me among my Protestant friends is the decision to leave a church, community or whatever the moment it no longer suits. We don’t really have that option. We may be going through a rough spot or whatever, but we can’t go from church to church really. They are pretty much all the same (mostly.)
 
As a former Pentecostal the motivational experience is a big part of why Pentecostals at least are so pumped up…they usually arrive 30 minutes or so before the service begins…they are warmly greeted by ushers…they meet with friends with whom they attend Wednesday evening bible study…the Pastor goes around greeting people and welcoming newcomers…there is an expectant excitement already…people may even start singing and clapping early to further the mood… the singing and praising God continues until the gospel message…the message is positive and the preaching is charismatic…after the service people still gather about…all in a joyous mood…and many of them are very good chistians full of the Holy Spirit…having said that…the Catholic mass is totally different…we are there for the greatest gift God gave to mankind…we get to participate in the Holy Sacrifice of our Blessed Savior Jesus Christ…his body and blood…no Protestant church…( maybe some Anglicans and Lutherans to some degree) receives this grace…it is beyond anything Protestants receive…my only pet peeve could possibly bee that many Catholics seem to arrive at mass 5 minutes before it starts …and leave before even the closing hymn is finished…and the dress…especially of some of the younger females…mini skirts…tight jeans with bare midriff showing…low cut blouses…like they just breezed in from a days shopping at Walmart
 
Rae8 said:
You hit the nail on the head as I said before. Found the Pope’s quote:

VATICAN CITY (CNS) – Using a phrase that translates literally as “the face of a pickled pepper,” Pope Francis said that when Christians have more of a sourpuss than a face that communicates the joy of being loved by God, they harm the witness of the church.

“The Christian is a man or woman of joy,” the pope said May 10, giving a homily during his morning Mass in the chapel of the Domus Sanctae Marthae.

While happiness is a good thing, the pope said, it’s not the same as the profound joy that comes from “the certainty that Jesus is with us and with the Father.”

If one tries to be happy all the time, he said, that happiness ends up “transforming itself into lightness, superficiality and leads to a state of lacking Christian wisdom; it can make us fools, dupes, no?”

“Joy is something else. Joy is a gift from the Lord. It fills us from the inside,” the pope said at the Mass attended by staff from Vatican Radio and concelebrated by Venezuelan Archbishop Baltazar Enrique Porras Cardozo of Merida and Abbot Notker Wolf, the Benedictine abbot primate.

The joy the Lord gives cannot be “bottled up so we can keep it with us,” he said. “If we want this joy just for ourselves, in the end it will make us sick and our hearts will shrivel up and our faces will not transmit that great joy, but nostalgia, that melancholy that isn’t healthy.”

Joy naturally leads to generosity, he said.

Pope Francis said joy is a “pilgrim virtue,” one that moves Christians to journey out into the world preaching the Gospel and proclaiming Christ.

Joy, he said, “is one of the virtues of the great,” of those who don’t allow themselves to get caught up in silly little annoyances or in “little things inside the community of the church; they always look to the horizon.”

“The Christian sings with joy and walks carrying this joy,” the pope said.

From: catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1302082.htm

May God Bless our Pope and keep him safe.
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Yes and Amen. People misunderstand joy and joy is not silly or slap happy but a quite peace and strength. You did mention coming from a charismatic background and I have some of that too and it was a big adjustment coming into the Catholic church. Some parishes are more friendly than others and that is true of Masses withing a parish. While alot of Catholics critisize Protestants as being “me and Jesus” too often Catholics come to worship and have the attitude of “me and Jesus” and no one else. It sometimes is difficult for some to grasp the concept of the fact that we come and worship as a community and that means together. I also think is goes back to a false sense of what reverence and piety is. There is a difference between being still and quite in Church and being rude and cold. There is also a difference between someone going through a major loss and trauma and someone just being a grump. What I’ve seen on a number of the CAF threads when friendliness in Catholic Churches come up is excuses of shyness, anxiety, fear of germs etc and so, as if these feeling are normal and God wants people to be stuck on these sorts of excuses and interpersonal issues.
 
robwar said:
Yes and Amen. People misunderstand joy and joy is not silly or slap happy but a quite peace and strength. You did mention coming from a charismatic background and I have some of that too and it was a big adjustment coming into the Catholic church. Some parishes are more friendly than others and that is true of Masses withing a parish. While alot of Catholics critisize Protestants as being “me and Jesus” too often Catholics come to worship and have the attitude of “me and Jesus” and no one else. It sometimes is difficult for some to grasp the concept of the fact that we come and worship as a community and that means together. I also think is goes back to a false sense of what reverence and piety is. There is a difference between being still and quite in Church and being rude and cold. There is also a difference between someone going through a major loss and trauma and someone just being a grump. What I’ve seen on a number of the CAF threads when friendliness in Catholic Churches come up is excuses of shyness, anxiety, fear of germs etc and so, as if these feeling are normal and God wants people to be stuck on these sorts of excuses and interpersonal issues.
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It is an unfair comparison period. What Catholics do
believe, respond to, participate in at a Mass has NO
comparison to what Protestants do at Sunday Services.
So expecting behavior to be exactly the same is off
the charts in unreasonableness.
Should Catholics be rude? No. But at the same time
we are not afforded the luxury of church or denomination
shopping like Protestants are. We are stuck with our
fellow parishioners. I’ve attended Nass with families
with children in warring gangs, Nortanos Surenos Asian
gangs Crips and Bloods. No expectancy of people
smiling and making small talk. Yet they all attended and
did their best.
I’ve attended Mass where I was the only white English speaking
Americano among hundreds of illegal aliens who felt I was an
outsider.
And now I attend in a tiny parish with second generation
Italians whose parents had decades old grudges.
And some of them dislike me and I them. We treat
each other the same way in and out of Mass. I recently
started giving the Sign if Peace to family whose
son attacked mine. And I admit I give them the sign of
peace only because God is watching and I know a. He sees
it, and B. they cant do it and it bothers them, makes them
uncomfortable and hello that just tickles me pink lol!
We have some sixty year olds
who haven’t spoken to each other since high school.
But we are all there doing the best we can.
People might consider this hypocrisy and some
might consider it real life in Christ.
Better to be real than a raving phony.
Protestants? Their reason for going, where they go,
why they go, when they go and what they do ehen they get there?
Sorry it has NO
relation to Catholicism. None. I don’t understand why y’all are
trying to compare.
 
marywarfield said:
It is an unfair comparison period. What Catholics do
believe, respond to, participate in at a Mass has NO
comparison to what Protestants do at Sunday Services.
So expecting behavior to be exactly the same is off
the charts in unreasonableness.
Should Catholics be rude? No. But at the same time
we are not afforded the luxury of church or denomination
shopping like Protestants are. We are stuck with our
fellow parishioners. I’ve attended Nass with families
with children in warring gangs, Nortanos Surenos Asian
gangs Crips and Bloods. No expectancy of people
smiling and making small talk. Yet they all attended and
did their best.
I’ve attended Mass where I was the only white English speaking
Americano among hundreds of illegal aliens who felt I was an
outsider.
And now I attend in a tiny parish with second generation
Italians whose parents had decades old grudges.
And some of them dislike me and I them. We treat
each other the same way in and out of Mass. I recently
started giving the Sign if Peace to family whose
son attacked mine. And I admit I give them the sign of
peace only because God is watching and I know a. He sees
it, and B. they cant do it and it bothers them, makes them
uncomfortable and hello that just tickles me pink lol!
We have some sixty year olds
who haven’t spoken to each other since high school.
But we are all there doing the best we can.
People might consider this hypocrisy and some
might consider it real life in Christ.
Better to be real than a raving phony.
Protestants? Their reason for going, where they go,
why they go, when they go and what they do ehen they get there?
Sorry it has NO
relation to Catholicism. None. I don’t understand why y’all are
trying to compare.
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Sorry but you have misaliened Protestants as phony in being friendly. Sadly, Op is being misunderstood here. What he is pointing out as a new convert and some new converts struggle with this based on what kind of backgroung they had is that Catholic Churches can come off as cold and unfriendly. Now there are a number of reasons for this and some of the other posters have listed them. But in the age of the new evangelization and out reach to others, cold and unfriendly isn’t going to cut it. Our Holy Father did mention that it is time to stop sour faces and grumpy looks. Friendliness doesn’t mean slap happy, it doesn’t mean yakking it up in the sanctuary but a smile, nod of the head can go a long way. There are more ex-Catholics out there than ex-Protestants. Why is that? I honestly think in all the convert testimonies I’ve read and heard does anyone say that they become Catholic because Catholics are so nice. It is usually, one studies themselves into the Church. Yet Catholic do leave for other places because they didn’t feel welcomed or loved or wanted in the Catholic church, or the priest treated them badly etc and so on. This is important. As St Theresa of Avila said, save me from sour face saints.
 
robwar said:
Sorry but you have misaliened Protestants as phony in being friendly. Sadly, Op is being misunderstood here. What he is pointing out as a new convert and some new converts struggle with this based on what kind of backgroung they had is that Catholic Churches can come off as cold and unfriendly. Now there are a number of reasons for this and some of the other posters have listed them. But in the age of the new evangelization and out reach to others, cold and unfriendly isn’t going to cut it. Our Holy Father did mention that it is time to stop sour faces and grumpy looks. Friendliness doesn’t mean slap happy, it doesn’t mean yakking it up in the sanctuary but a smile, nod of the head can go a long way. There are more ex-Catholics out there than ex-Protestants. Why is that? I honestly think in all the convert testimonies I’ve read and heard does anyone say that they become Catholic because Catholics are so nice. It is usually, one studies themselves into the Church. Yet Catholic do leave for other places because they didn’t feel welcomed or loved or wanted in the Catholic church, or the priest treated them badly etc and so on. This is important. As St Theresa of Avila said, save me from sour face saints.
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I don’t see where I called Protestants phony. Since my
point is that there is no basis for comparison
in the first place it is unlikely that I would
characterize Protestants as phony. And if your
touchiness is an example- yes save us from sour faced
responses.
 
marywarfield said:
I don’t see where I called Protestants phony. Since my
point is that there is no basis for comparison
in the first place it is unlikely that I would
characterize Protestants as phony. And if your
touchiness is an example- yes save us from sour faced
responses.
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Oh dear! 😃 have a good day!
 
Rae8 said:
Many of “some people” I am referring to have been rude - its not just a facial expression.

Wasn’t sure where it should go, forum master please feel free to move if need be.

Well, Protestants are not like that and they read the bible more. Since I am trying to understand why this difference exists I think its a legitimate question in trying to understand. I imagine a lot of members here may take offense at this - not having experienced a protestant background, many would not know there is such a difference.
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I am a convert as well and I think I know what you are talking about. Now, about the person who is rude… no excuse.

But about the lack of open laughter and friendliness. I have some ideas.
In the Protestant church I grew up in and I believe for many churches, especially in the west, the original Church building was the gathering place, city hall, all purpose building. The people went to the building to gather to together for many reasons. In pioneer days churches in my part of western Colorado were sometimes used for ditch meetings and square dancing.

The Catholic Church building has an entirely different approach. It is seen as a sanctuary, a quiet somber place for worship. Many Catholics see conversation and glad handing as a desecration of a holy place.

So right away these are two cultures, neither one right or wrong, sending out different messages and different purposes.

Of course, no parish and no church is like any other. If you were to go to a brand new Catholic Church filled with “new comers” to the area, the atmosphere would be entirely different than if you went to a small 100 year old Church filled with large families whose histories go back several generations. That kind of Church is hard to deal with because it can be like walking into someone else’s family reunion.

Also, you really don’t know the heart ache within a Church. Especially a church with older people who have seen so many loved ones die and so many parishioners who deal with pain and loss.

And it is possible you ran into the Sourpuss Brothers who drive everyone else in the Church crazy,
 
I understand what you are saying Rae. I’m a convert and have experienced the same. I think my initial thoughts were “my goodness, you just received Jesus the real body and blood why aren’t you folks happy?!” Then I started thinking about this more because it did bother me. I now realize that maybe Catholics believe so much and live the faith so much that even in times of hardships, unhappy moments, they still want to the real Jesus. Even when I was Protestant if I felt unhappy, I didn’t go to church because I thought it wouldn’t help. Catholics think and know that going to mass will help 🙂 so they try even when they aren’t feeling well and feel like they are just going through the motions… We’ve all been there and if any of you haven’t, you will.

I just smile when I feel like it and just hope that maybe someone who can’t smile that day will remember seeing mine. Because there may be a day that I need to see theirs.
 
I too am a Catholic convert so I have experience of a couple of Protestant churches. I have never considered that some Catholics are ‘sour-faced’ even though I’ve been to several parishes :confused:. In my own parish, there is one old lady I know who always looks solemn and miserable (possibly sour-faced I suppose) but in all the time I’ve known her she always looks like that. But when I have talked to her she is perfectly polite though I get the impression that she does feel sad. So appearances can be deceptive.

I went to a non-denominational church at my university and you could say that everyone there was happy. People hugged me when I arrived. But I didn’t feel comfortable with strangers hugging me and I felt their demeanour was just exaggerated - like they felt they had to act that way.

A Baptist church I went to was also friendly and I did like it there, though I didn’t like the pressure I was put under to attend the ‘Alpha Course’. I felt that the services were focussed more on the live music band that played, and what the Baptist church did, than on Jesus. Holy Communion was only celebrated one Sunday per month.

I was brought up Church of England (Anglican) although my family were not religious and I was pretty much in awe of churches when I was a child and I do remember the times the school took us to services I found the services very boring! But while I was still in RCIA I went to a Church of England christening service and I was disappointed by what I found. Although I am a woman myself, having a woman lead the service felt wrong, and the whole service did not feel especially reverent - it felt a bit like a house party! (There were many regular worshippers there as well as the family of the baby to be christened).

When I moved to my current town I went to my local Catholic church (which is where I began RCIA). I believe that I was truly led by God to move to this particular area and therefore go to that church because it suits me really well. All the things I had been looking for in Protestant churches over the years I found in my local church. And of course, best of all, the Real Presence of Jesus too! And we can receive Him daily if we wish it. Probably all our congregation could be described as joyless after receiving Communion because everyone, myself included, go back to our pews looking solemn and thoughtful. I did notice it before I was confirmed and wondered a bit at it. But now I can receive Him myself, I can see why. I am not full of joy but I meditate at the huge privilege we have to receive Him in our bodies. It is such a privilege that I find it hard to comprehend. God Himself comes within us! Us, sinners that we all are. So I ponder on that while I say a prayer of thanks to Him.
 
Rae8 said:
Well, if you FEEL that way - full of love and joy, you are truly blessed are you not?

If you don’t feel that way - knowing what we know, having the love of Christ in us, how - why can we not be joyful? I just don’t understand it. Something seems to be missing there.
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Sometimes God puts people to the test. He did that with many saints where He obscures Himself from them, leaving them in a state of total depression, yet the test is to remain faithful through it all based on reasoning and faith, not emotion.

The stronger Christian, IMO, is the one who remains faithful even when they don’t “feel” like it. If you’re happy, you are blessed, but may also be an indication of merely being a spiritual babe (infant), because anyone cam smile and be happy when things are going good.

The more one trusts God, the more suffering they will subject themselves to. You cant expet someone to remain with a constant smile in their face through that and nowhere does it say one has to either. So maybe the sour faced Catholics you see are exceeding in the area of heroic virtue and taking up the Cross, as Christ calls us all to do.
 
Some of the people in this thread sound like they need to spend a lot more time in prayer and examination of conscience as they come off very judgmental.

I’m so sick of hearing Catholics say “WE HAVE THE EUCHARIST”. Yeah, well the Protestants could have the Eucharist if they wanted to and I’m sure some of their churches do believe it to be Jesus and not just symbolic. There are way too many Protestant churches to be able to know what they ALL do or believe.

But one thing I do know, and that is that **many **of their churches - the charismatic ones - have the outpouring of the Holy Ghost - like in the day of Pentecost . You don’t hear them running around saying “WE’RE BETTER THAN YOU BECAUSE WE HAVE THE HOLY GHOST”!

In all my years of attending the Catholic church, I have not witnessed a Pentecost-like experience. I have however witnessed that in the Charismatic PROTESTANT churches.

So quit judging! Jesus said if they are not against us, they are with us. Catholics have no right putting down Protestants and as CHRISTIANS, they absolutely have no right to call Protestants “phony” or jump to other conclusions about their intentions or cast doubt on the love or friendliness they show - referring to their fellowship as “gossip” etc.

Pope Francis and St. Theresa even criticized the sour dispositions of some Catholics. It has nothing to do with the Eucharist.** Don’t use the Eucharist as an excuse to go moping around with a holier than thou attitude and “proud look”.**
 
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