Speaking in Tongues

[Robbinson]

Its an interesting topic

The miracle of tongues at Pentecost was speaking in language, foreign to their own, that was understood by others (that was the miracle - the opposite of confusion of speech at babel).

The idea of unintelligible tongues not understood by the speaker or the listener doesn’t have strong support in scripture, or Tradition, although as pointed out, it became fashionable with AOG and other Pentecostals in the last 100 years or so.

In scripture, when Paul talked about tongues, he urged they only be used when there was an interpreter (and I’m not aware of any verified “interpreters” today).

I think ultimately for those who feel they have this gift, it is best used as a private prayer language rather than a shared experience in a church setting.

Could it be a real gift - absolutely - God can do anything. Is it often a manifestation of a seeking of a powerful Holy Spirit experience through an unconsciousness (albeit sincere) forcing of learned non-linguistic sounds and phrases - I suspect so (and it often appears so).

Blessings,

Brian

 

[Casilda]

When I was in college I was “interested” in a young lady who was a member of an evangelical type church. One evening she invited me to attend a Bible study with her. Hoping to get in her good graces, I agreed. Towards the end of the meeting the leader asked her to speak in tongues. Although I heard about it before, I had never been exposed to anything like that. I found it to be fascinating. I also found it to be gibberish, and my “interest” in this young lady quickly evaporated.

Too bad. In college a Pentecostal young man was interested in me. I also went to his prayer meeting and though the speaking in tongues made my eyes bug out and made me want to get up and leave, I closed my eyes and prayed to Our Father, and asked Him a question regarding what was happening. When I opened my eyes I saw children of God and a peaceful feeling came over me.

Me and the young man have been married over 30 years, and he is now a staunch Catholic.

 

[WillyAL]

Me and the young man have been married over 30 years, and he is now a staunch Catholic.

Congratulations on 30 years of marriage. I’m glad your speaking in tongues experience worked out for you.

As it happens, mine worked out for me too. I later met another young (Catholic) lady and we have been married for several years.

I, however, am still a non-believer.

 

[grannymh]

Within the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, there are two separate gifts of the Holy Spirit which employ the use of Tongues. There is the common gift of personal praying to God in Tongues and there is the ministry gift of bringing God’s message in Tongues to the people in assembly.

From what I read, there is a lot of good information in this thread. If, by any chance, there is still some question, I will do my best to answer.

 

[crumblymunky]

Speaking in tongues was something God used to help spread the faith in the early Church. It was began again by protestants in the 1890’s. This Protestantized version migrated into the Catholic Church.

This is reason enough to avoid this Protestant practice.

 

[Falco]

An ex of mine, an atheist, had glossolalia episodes at very emotional moments - the birth of his children, and after really good sex. Nothing of God in his experiences.

The AoG church I attended in Wellington, Nz (for 4 very nervous months) was full of Speakers in Tongues, and it was their answer for every problem. There was one family who babbled, and were ‘slain in the Spirit’ falling over like ninepins, each and every Sunday. When I got to know them, I found they allowed themselves no other release in their lives - no music, no movies, no dancing, no theatre, nothing but church, bible readings and good works. So every Sunday, as they attended church, had a good hymn singing session (their only music of the week), they just exploded into hysterical falling about and thrashing. It was so unnerving that I left. I certainly didn’t feel the Holy Spirit anywhere in that church - I used to get cold shivers and feel totally uneasy.

I have no doubt that Speaking in Tongues for the right reasons happens, it is just that it is SO easy to falsify, as nobody can refute it.

 

[CuriousMike]

An ex of mine, an atheist, had glossolalia episodes at very emotional moments - the birth of his children, and after really good sex. Nothing of God in his experiences.

The AoG church I attended in Wellington, Nz (for 4 very nervous months) was full of Speakers in Tongues, and it was their answer for every problem. There was one family who babbled, and were ‘slain in the Spirit’ falling over like ninepins, each and every Sunday. When I got to know them, I found they allowed themselves no other release in their lives - no music, no movies, no dancing, no theatre, nothing but church, bible readings and good works. So every Sunday, as they attended church, had a good hymn singing session (their only music of the week), they just exploded into hysterical falling about and thrashing. It was so unnerving that I left. I certainly didn’t feel the Holy Spirit anywhere in that church - I used to get cold shivers and feel totally uneasy.

I have no doubt that Speaking in Tongues for the right reasons happens, it is just that it is SO easy to falsify, as nobody can refute it.

This is exactly what always concerned me about the “Worship” services.

Every so often you’d get people crying out loud in the hymns, raising their hands, falling onto the ground. It was… Disturbing. And I felt some of it was almost a “show off” of faith, “Hey, I raised my hand and jittered around like mad at worship. Therefore, I am more faithful than you.”

I never heard the tongues, but they did mention it quite a lot. It was quite strange, really.

 

[Falco]

This is exactly what always concerned me about the “Worship” services.

Every so often you’d get people crying out loud in the hymns, raising their hands, falling onto the ground. It was… Disturbing. And I felt some of it was almost a “show off” of faith, “Hey, I raised my hand and jittered around like mad at worship. Therefore, I am more faithful than you.”

I never heard the tongues, but they did mention it quite a lot. It was quite strange, really.

Their praying over someone with Tongues was like childish babble - laladadadalamana - just a row of consonants with the same vowel - I don’t know of any language, even of the most primitive on earth, that only has one vowel. So why should we think that the Holy Spirit’s language does? One vowel would be very limiting to the number of words created, unless it was a binary language.

Did you ever read about the Toronto Spirit? The people in that congregation rolled on the floor and growled like animals. Demonic possession masquerading as Christian worship.

 

[grannymh]

Speaking in tongues was something God used to help spread the faith in the early Church. It was began again by protestants in the 1890’s. This Protestantized version migrated into the Catholic Church.

This is reason enough to avoid this Protestant practice.

I see that there are a lot of posts, that need answering. When it comes to the Catholic Charismatic Renewal, it does help to clear the air.

Comments about post 25.

Yes, speaking in native tongues is a wonderful way to spread the Gospel Message. The first and best example
is Acts 2: 5-11. This is known as the Miracle of Hearing because each individual was hearing the Good News in her or his native tongue. There have been reports of the Miracle of Hearing occurring in modern times.

It is correct that somewhere in the 1890’s and early 20th century, there were “Protestant” people who were “speaking” in Tongues as part of worship. I am not sure about the kinds of manifestations which were taking place.

One could possibly say that the Pentecostal Movement migrated into the Catholic Church in 1967. This would be due to the fact that some Catholics were curious enough to find out what was going on in regard to the Holy Spirit. Those curious individuals, who wanted evidence of what was happening, correctly researched Holy Scripture. Those curious Catholics went straight to St. Paul’s first letter to his beloved Corinthians in addition to Acts.

Both of us can imagine what the Bishops were saying about this “migration”

There was genuine concern to say the least. Those concerns were resolved when it was made clear that Catholic theology, including the Catholic Sacraments, etc., were present in the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. In time, the Catholic Charismatic Renewal structure came under the Diocesan Bishop.

As for “Protestant practices” we need to remember that St. Paul was not a Protestant.
Everyone, regardless of their eye color, are free to follow St. Paul’s teachings.

As for the Toronto Spirit, it is my understanding that some kind of an original organization left the Catholic Charismatic Renewal years ago. Does anyone have the current organization name and its Catholic diocese? I am one of those curious Catholics who likes to double check information.

 

[Medawlinno]

For a discussion on the actual phenomenon on glossolalia, see this thread:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=853157&highlight=xenoglossia

Careful not to confuse glossolalia with xenoglossia, though - they are two different things. What is described as taking place at Pentecost, was suposedly xenoglossia; people understanding what was being said by one or more speakers in their own, current (well, current for their time, anyway), living language(s).

Glossolalia on the other hand, is the so-called “speaking in tongues” i.e. the “jibberish” sounding ‘language’ some people are able to exhibit (it’s not jibberish, but actually, in many cases, a definable form of subconcious word play).

 

[grannymh]

For a discussion on the actual phenomenon on glossolalia, see this thread:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=853157&highlight=xenoglossia

Careful not to confuse glossolalia with xenoglossia, though - they are two different things. What is described as taking place at Pentecost, was suposedly xenoglossia; people understanding what was being said by one or more speakers in their own, current (well, current for their time, anyway), living language(s).

Glossolalia on the other hand, is the so-called “speaking in tongues” i.e. the “jibberish” sounding ‘language’ some people are able to exhibit (it’s not jibberish, but actually, in many cases, a definable form of subconcious word play).

And please, do not confuse any of the above with Acts 2: 1:-4.

 

[Iconodule]

My wife was raised in a self-described “independent, spirit-filled” church, where speaking in tongue was practiced and emphasized. She’s been a devout Catholic for 5 years now, but abandoned the practice long before joining the Church. She used to refer to speaking in tongues as a "prayer language”, where she was able to “get beyond her mind” while in prayer.

Personally, I’ve never really understood the appeal of purposefully seeking what St Paul refers to as a minor spiritual gift. However, there was one thing about it that is a bit appealing: one doesn’t have to figure out what to say in prayer.

That is a fundamental aspect of Protestantism’s approach to prayer. It has to be spontaneous. Besides the “Lord’s Prayer” (Our Father…Hollowed be Thy Name…), there are few pre-written prayers that Protestants say as part of a prayer rule.

Protestant prayer for the most part is an on-the-spot experience. The problem with this is that it keeps your mind busy trying to figure out the right words. This kind of prayer has its place… but when that’s all you do, the prayer life can become a bit stunted and laborious because the nous is fully allowed to speak without the distracting movements of the mind.

In the Eastern Church, we are taught two ways to allow prayer to advance “beyond thought.”

First, there is the “Jesus Prayer” (The Prayer of the Heart) “Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner.” This is the unceasing inner prayer that we are called to repeat as often as possible (ideally it never ceases).

Second, the Church has thousands of prayers written by Saints that we can read as our own. Even though we might be reading a prayer we’re not familiar with, the simple fact that we don’t have to figure out what to say is enough to liberate our prayer beyond the confines of our rational minds.

Looking back at our Protestant days, I can see that most people who speak in tongues are trying to reach that place of prayer beyond thought

 

[CuriousMike]

Why doesn’t the church just hire a pastor?

Couple of reasons:

• Reasonably remote location, small town.
• Three families groups are the base of the congregation. Very vocal, and often divided amongst each other.
• Congregation varies with the seasons, and tourism.
• Some of the congregation drift between the local Anglican Church and that Church. Favoritism? I dunno.
• All of these factors seem to scare them away. It seems the last one only lasted a couple of months before defecting.

Because its such a small town, but with so many Protestant “denominations,” I think both the Anglican Church and AoG seem to be the catching basin for everyone else.
The more Evangelical/Pentecostal/Baptist/Calvin types are at the AoG, and more Anglican (traditional-Australian religious), along with the more liberal Baptists (etc) end up at the Anglican Church.
This probably means the two Churches have some very differently opinionated people attending, so a pastor would have their hands full trying to put something together for every Sunday - perhaps with the concern of scaring His/Her congregation away, and the “small town gossip” scaring others away too.

Of course, having said that, there have been a couple of occasions where the Catholic Priests have seriously annoyed people with how their homilies or actions were interpreted by others.