Speaking in tounges?

[ashlynette92]

The pastor at a youth group I’ve been going to for about three years has recently started (but only when I’m there others say he doesnt talk about it unless im there and he usually looks at me the entire rant) ranting about how it is real and how he knows Catholics (which I am) and Baptists (which almost everyone else is) don’t believe it but it is indeed real. and he’ll spend the entire time every wednesday talking about how the main pastor’s wife there really does speak in tounges. But the rumor going around about her is that she has dabbed in witchcraft and then became protestant. so kids there started saying they were scared of her and believed she was doing a spell instead of speaking in tounges.But I’ve never denied she can nor said anything against people being able to. from my understanding some people can speak it and some people were given the gift of being able to interpret it. But for some reason whenever I’m there he begins a rant about how it’s real and how when she does it she’s doing it for real.

i dont know much about it or why he’s choosing when I’m there to begin going on and on about it. so i guess im asking for some information on it and why do some religions seem to care about it more than others because going to a catholic church all my life, ive only head it brought up maybe twice.

He has said in the past that he is/his religion is a Follower Of Christ and the church is predominantly protestant. I talked to my preist (at my catholic church) about it and he said that Protestants will try to draw Catholics away from the Catholic faith. so is this something that Protestants or Followers of Christ believe that catholics dont care about and he’s tryig to get me to?

sorry if my question is jumbled…:curtsey:

 

[ltwin]

Hello. I have a question. What exactly is your relationship with this youth group or church? If you say you are Catholic, why are you not surrounding yourself with youth that believe what you believe? From the way you describe things, it certainly doesn’t seem like a welcoming environment for you.

Anyway, I would seek someone within your Catholic community or around here and ask about the Catholic Charismatic Renewal. They will be able to give you the teaching on speaking in tongues from a Catholic perspective. There are indeed Catholics who do speak in tongues. In private, it can be used to deepen one’s prayer life.

On why some Christians emphasize it more than others, all I can say is that there a Christians (Pentecostals and charismatics) who believe that there are periods in Christianity where the miraculous gifts of the Spirit were down played or not taught or not even understood, and Pentecostals and charismatics believe it is important to recover this dimension of Christianity.

I hope you find good information here.

 

[chronicles1632]

May the Holy Spirit fill you and guide you.
Read 1 Corinthians 14: 1-40

God Bless

 

[Fink]

It`d be safer to steer well clear of it.

When the Apostles spoke on that Pentecost, it was in tongues which could be understood, not in some “gibberish” which doesnt even have a language structure. My own conviction is that, at least sometimes, the utterances of these "tongues" speakers are the result of a scrambled mind. It happened to me once; and it most certainly wasnt “speaking in tongues”!

Pentecostal groups seem to wallow in emotions; and that`s not always healthy. Members get their kicks by “going on a high”.

Glossolalia can be a sign of demonic activity.

 

[FKhiva]

Hi there,
I think this person was trying to convey the message to you rather, knowing that you come from a different church group and doctrine. This is common with other churches too, where when they notice that they have visitors, they start selling the home-made menue.

However, on the question about speaking in tongues, I think many church leaders and congregants (particularly charismatics or evangelicals) do it to impress others around them by creating the impression that they have the Holy Spirit. More than often, however, what they speak does not make sense even to the person speaking in tongues, i.e. they can’t tell you what they were saying as they don’t understand it either - so to me most rather speak gibberish. This usually is accompanied by episodes of people collapsing and crying, which I m not aware of any such extreme behaviours during the apostlic time.
The idea of speaking in tongues should be between the speaker and God, and not the audience (i.e. should preferrably be done in private).

In general, charismatics and evangelicals in particular abuse this as a way to lure people to them and to then emotionally massage and manipulate them for own gain (commercial reasons). Following the death of the original true apostles of Christ, corruption became rife as their successors began to manipulate and distort many things to suit their goals. Christianity has since become commercialised and is increasingly moving in this direction in a big way nowadays.

Khiva

 

[Todd_Easton]

I cannot say whether or not the main pastor’s wife speaks in tongues but the youth group pastor is misinformed about what Catholics believe; Catholics do indeed believe there is an extraordinary gift of the Holy Spirit called tongues. See Catechism of the Catholic Church, paragraph 2003. It’s my understanding that about 10% of Catholics worldwide speak in tongues.

 

[Big_Dummy]

Get six of their members together who claims to have the gift of interpretation. Play on tape for them from someone allegdly speaking in tongues. Have each write down the interpretation. Odds are no two will have the same interpretation, unless a major event is going on in their church like Missions Week. And, even then, even if the subject is the same – support missions – you will find that none of them will use the same words, sentences. Read Acts 2, they spoke in known human languages. I am betting her tongues is just gibberish.

 

[White_Peony]

Speaking in tongues is a fruit of the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 12:10b “…to another different kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues.”

Read 1 Corinthians 14:6-25 to see what the Bible says about speaking in tongues.

 

[puzzleannie]

I am sorry I found the OP’s story very hard to follow
it sounds like gossip about the wife of a pastor of a church in another denomination

this is a Catholic forum
we do have a forum for non-Catholic religions, if you want to discuss the views of that denomination

this is the sacred scripture forum
do you have a question about a bible passage or book that relates to this issue?

we also have a spirituality forum and there you will find discussions of the Catholic Charismatic renewal, including the spiritual expressions that come under that heading such as speaking in tongues, but it seems to have very little to do with the people in your story, who are not Catholic.

 

[Big_Dummy]

frankly speaking in tongues is not a fruit of the Spirit, see Gal 5, speakign in tongues is a gift.

1 Corinthians 12:30
Have all the gifts of healing? **do all speak with tongues? **do all interpret?

1 Corinthians 14:5
I would that ye all spake with tongues but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

1 Corinthians 14:28
But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

 

[garysibio]

Get six of their members together who claims to have the gift of interpretation. Play on tape for them from someone allegdly speaking in tongues. Have each write down the interpretation. Odds are no two will have the same interpretation, unless a major event is going on in their church like Missions Week. And, even then, even if the subject is the same – support missions – you will find that none of them will use the same words, sentences. Read Acts 2, they spoke in known human languages. I am betting her tongues is just gibberish.

I took an anthropology of religion class in college. As part of it I had to research a religious movement and I chose the Catholic Charismatic movement. In researching this I found over 100 documented cases where a person prayed in tongues and it was identified by someone who had a natural understanding of the language. In one case the speaker prayed vocally in an archaic form of German which was no longer in use. (The person identifying it was a college professor who spoke it.) What made this particular case particularly interesting was that the speaker was mute and, when he was not praying, could not speak a word in any language.

There are two forms of tongues. In one case the person is praying to God. In these cases no interpretation is necessary, The other type is where a word is given to the congregation in tongues. This is when someone must interpret.

 

[Fink]

I took an anthropology of religion class in college. As part of it I had to research a religious movement and I chose the Catholic Charismatic movement…

There are two forms of tongues…

Dont discount possible diabolical activity, at least where the speech has structure. Where it doesnt have structure, i suspect the “speech” is more likely the result of a confused mind (as said earlier).

i know of someone who publicly promotes a certain “apparition” which has been condemned by the local bishop. This person went to the location, and received the ability to speak in a language he didnt know (Italian). im highly suspicious of the source of this “gift”.

 

[ltwin]

I speak in tongues. There is no “confused mind” going on. In fact, I pray and sing in tongues often while driving .

 

[ClayPots47]

Get six of their members together who claims to have the gift of interpretation. Play on tape for them from someone allegdly speaking in tongues. Have each write down the interpretation. Odds are no two will have the same interpretation, unless a major event is going on in their church like Missions Week. And, even then, even if the subject is the same – support missions – you will find that none of them will use the same words, sentences. Read Acts 2, they spoke in known human languages. I am betting her tongues is just gibberish.

I can’t speak for Protestant Pentecostals and Charismatics, but I would think they generally do what the Catholic Charismatics do, which is to follow the guidelines of scripture. A person can’t claim to have the gift of interpretation, until the Spirit tells him. And it is one person who is given the gift, They are aware in advance of the prophecy tongue being given, and that they are the one to give the interpretation. And the one having the prophecy tongue is not to give it without discerning that there is an interpreter. Anyone eagerly even agreeing to do what you suggest, has already revealed that their source is the human spirit. The interpretation is of the prophecy given in tongues to the group, a taped message is not prophecy for that gathering, therefore no one can interpret. The interpreter would come from the same gathering as the messenger. So none of the 6 could interpret, simply because they were not at the gathering where the person gave a prophecy tongue, therefor the message doesn’t apply to them. They would have had to have actually been at the gathering where the person prophesied in tongues to interpret it. You can’t dial-up the Holy Spirit on a whim, to interpret a taped message. The charisms are meant for those gathered, your test is not a gathering. As scripture states, one has the gift of prophecy in tongues, another has the gift of interpretation, there are no 6. It just does not occur that way.

1 Corinthians 12 NAB

To one is given through the Spirit the expression of wisdom; to another the expression of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit; to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit; to another mighty deeds; to another prophecy; to another discernment of spirits;** to another varieties of tongues; to another interpretation of tongues**.1But one and the same Spirit produces all of these, distributing them individually to each person as he wishes.f

 

[ClayPots47]

garysibio;8238303:

I took an anthropology of religion class in college. As part of it I had to research a religious movement and I chose the Catholic Charismatic movement…

There are two forms of tongues…

Dont discount possible diabolical activity, at least where the speech has structure. Where it doesnt have structure, i suspect the “speech” is more likely the result of a confused mind (as said earlier).

i know of someone who publicly promotes a certain “apparition” which has been condemned by the local bishop. This person went to the location, and received the ability to speak in a language he didnt know (Italian). im highly suspicious of the source of this “gift”.

Gary is talking about the two forms, they are Prayer Tongues and Apostolic or Ministry Tongues. The latter are either understood by the listener, or they need an interpreter.

What you are talking about isn’t a form,. but rather a source. This is the realm of Mystical Theology which teaches that there are different spirits behind an activity. This is the Discernment of Spirits, which every Charismatic who participates in a Life in the Spirit Seminar, is introduced to. The spirits are: 1) Holy Spirit 2) Human Spirit & 3) Evil Spirit. Diabolical activity would fall under #3, while a confused mind would most likely be #2. One has to carefully pray to discern the source, however if a priest is available, the priest can “test the spirits”. The priest only has to require the person exhibiting a charism or mystical experience to cease at once, in the name of Jesus Christ,. If from the Holy Spirit, the person would comply at once. and cease the activity out of obedience. Refusal would indicate a false spirit, typically the Human Spirit, but possibly the Evil Spirit. A priest cam further discern the possible source.

I can understand your suspicion of the person receiving the charism at a condemned apparition site. If this person believes the gift is genuine, then the person would not object to testing the source by going to a priest. A person unwilling to subject themselves to a priest, can be discerned as having a gift coming from a false spirit, as a possessor of a genuine gift would willingly go to a priest. The Church, through it’s priests, is the final arbiter of the source of any charism or mystical gift.

 

[CEM5]

The pastor at a youth group I’ve been going to for about three years has recently started (but only when I’m there others say he doesnt talk about it unless im there and he usually looks at me the entire rant) ranting about how it is real and how he knows Catholics (which I am) and Baptists (which almost everyone else is) don’t believe it but it is indeed real. and he’ll spend the entire time every wednesday talking about how the main pastor’s wife there really does speak in tounges. But the rumor going around about her is that she has dabbed in witchcraft and then became protestant. so kids there started saying they were scared of her and believed she was doing a spell instead of speaking in tounges.But I’ve never denied she can nor said anything against people being able to. from my understanding some people can speak it and some people were given the gift of being able to interpret it. But for some reason whenever I’m there he begins a rant about how it’s real and how when she does it she’s doing it for real.

i dont know much about it or why he’s choosing when I’m there to begin going on and on about it. so i guess im asking for some information on it and why do some religions seem to care about it more than others because going to a catholic church all my life, ive only head it brought up maybe twice.

He has said in the past that he is/his religion is a Follower Of Christ and the church is predominantly protestant. I talked to my preist (at my catholic church) about it and he said that Protestants will try to draw Catholics away from the Catholic faith. so is this something that Protestants or Followers of Christ believe that catholics dont care about and he’s tryig to get me to?

sorry if my question is jumbled…:curtsey:

Dear ashelynette,

I would quote the Scripture verses pertaining to “tongues” because they are breaking the “rules” regarding this. Tell him that.

1 Cor 12
1 Now concerning spiritual gifts, brothers and sisters, I do not want you to be uninformed…

10 to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another the discernment of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. 11 All these are activated by one and the same Spirit, who allots to each one individually just as the Spirit chooses. 12 For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ…

18 But as it is, God arranged the members in the body, each one of them, as he chose. 19 If all were a single member, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many members, yet one body. 21 The eye cannot say to the hand, “I have no need of you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I have no need of you.” 22 On the contrary, the members of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and those members of the body that we think less honorable we clothe with greater honor, and our less respectable members are treated with greater respect; 24 whereas our more respectable members do not need this. But God has so arranged the body, giving the greater honor to the inferior member, 25 that there may be no dissension within the body, but the members may have the same care for one another. 26 If one member suffers, all suffer together with it; if one member is honored, all rejoice together with it. 27 Now you are the body of Christ and individually members of it. 28 And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers; then deeds of power, then gifts of healing, forms of assistance, forms of leadership, various kinds of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30 Do all possess gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? 31 But strive for the greater gifts. And I will show you a still more excellent way.

1 Cor 13
1 If I speak in the tongues of mortals and of angels, but do not have love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal…

8 Love never ends. But as for prophecies, they will come to an end; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will come to an end…

12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then we will see face to face. Now I know only in part; then I will know fully, even as I have been fully known. 13 And now faith, hope, and love abide, these three; ***and the greatest of these is love. ***

The gift of tongues is not a great gift, and the ones we should strive for above ALL else are the abiding, everlasting gifts of Faith, Hope and Love.

to be continued…

 

[CEM5]

continued

This is what Paul said of tongues:

1 Cor 14
1 Pursue love and strive for the spiritual gifts, and especially that you may prophesy. 2 For those who speak in a tongue do not speak to other people but to God; for nobody understands them, since they are speaking mysteries in the Spirit. 3 On the other hand, those who prophesy speak to other people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. 4 Those who speak in a tongue build up themselves, but those who prophesy build up the church. 5 Now I would like all of you to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. One who prophesies is greater than one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. 6 ***Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you ***unless I speak to you in some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching? 7 It is the same way with lifeless instruments that produce sound, such as the flute or the harp. If they do not give distinct notes, how will anyone know what is being played? 8 And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? 9 So with yourselves; if in a tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is being said? For you will be speaking into the air. 10 There are doubtless many different kinds of sounds in the world, and nothing is without sound. 11 If then I do not know the meaning of a sound, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. 12 So with yourselves; since you are eager for spiritual gifts, strive to excel in them for building up the church. 13 Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray for the power to interpret. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unproductive. 15 What should I do then? I will pray with the spirit, but I will pray with the mind also; I will sing praise with the spirit, but I will sing praise with the mind also. 16 Otherwise, if you say a blessing with the spirit, how can anyone in the position of an outsider say the “Amen” to your thanksgiving, since the outsider does not know what you are saying? 17 For you may give thanks well enough, but the other person is not built up. 18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you; 19 nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind, in order to instruct others also, than ten thousand words in a tongue. 20 Brothers and sisters, do not be children in your thinking; rather, be infants in evil, but in thinking be adults. 21 In the law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners I will speak to this people; yet even then they will not listen to me,” says the Lord. 22 ***Tongues, then, are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers, ***while prophecy is not for unbelievers but for believers. 23 If, therefore, the whole church comes together and all speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are out of your mind? 24 But if all prophesy, an unbeliever or outsider who enters is reproved by all and called to account by all. 25 After the secrets of the unbeliever’s heart are disclosed, that person will bow down before God and worship him, declaring, “God is really among you.” 26 What should be done then, my friends? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. 27 If anyone speaks in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn; and let one interpret. 28 But if there is no one to interpret, let them be silent in church and speak to themselves and to God.

So you can see that St Paul teaches that if a person has the gift of tongues, they are not to speak UNLESS there is someone there to interpret. AND only one person is to speak at a time (not everyone at once) and have their “tongue” interpreted. If no one can interpret, then they are to remain silent. Tongues is not the best gift to have, and does not build up the Church.

Blessings,
CEM

 

[Catholic90]

When dh was first getting sick, he and I met privately with one of our parish’s deacons to pray. As the deacon was praying over dh and myself, he suddenly started speaking in tongues. It happened very spontaneously. I had never heard it before. Afterwords he explained what had happened. He was not speaking to us, but was praying to God.

 

[CEM5]

When dh was first getting sick, he and I met privately with one of our parish’s deacons to pray. As the deacon was praying over dh and myself, he suddenly started speaking in tongues. It happened very spontaneously. I had never heard it before. Afterwords he explained what had happened. He was not speaking to us, but was praying to God.

Then according to Scripture, this deacon should have remained silent because there was no one to interpret what came out of his mouth. He should have refrained and spoken English.

Did you mention this Scriptural fact to him?

blessings,
CEM

 

[ltwin]

Then according to Scripture, this deacon should have remained silent because there was no one to interpret what came out of his mouth. He should have refrained and spoken English.

Did you mention this Scriptural fact to him?

blessings,
CEM

He was praying in tongues (with his spirit as Paul called it) in a private meeting. That’s hardly a worship gathering and it is hardly making a disturbance or causing confusion, which is what Paul was addressing in his letter to the Corinthians.