Spectrum Between Heaven and Hell

[Neil_Anthony]

We believe that everyone ultimately ends up in either heaven or hell. And we generally talk in extremes of eternal agony and eternal bliss.

But I wonder if there is really just the two extremes.

We’ve had other notions of heaven and hell:

A “limbo” where the souls of unbaptized babies go, which is in hell but lacks suffering

“Paradise” where the prophets and good people of the old testament waited for Christ to open the gates of heaven - presumably a not-so-bad place in hell.

Then we read that depending on how good of a life we lead, we may enjoy heaven more or less. Sounds like different ranges of heaven.

So, is it possible that some people who go to hell don’t really suffer all that much, and others who go to heaven don’t really experience that much bliss?

 

[Genesis315]

In regards to Heaven, even those “farthest” from God will experience supernatural bliss–more blissful than any bliss we could possibly experience in this life. This increases with merit until we reach the seraphim and those seraphic saints like St. Francis (the Blessed Virgin is the closest to God of course).

In regards to Hell, sin causes suffering. Generally, one must be obstinately clinging to grave sin to end up in Hell–so that is going to be a high degree of suffering itself.

Theoretically, some unbaptized person without supernatural faith who died in original sin but only committed a few venial sins would suffer less.

 

[anthony6]

We believe that everyone ultimately ends up in either heaven or hell. And we generally talk in extremes of eternal agony and eternal bliss.

starting with this, when you die you will be with God in heaven or you will reject God and go to hell. you can’t be in a place that is in God’s parcial presents, it is either you are with him or you are not. there is no in between. but there is stages of heaven and hell depending how you do on this earth.

think of heaven like a pro basketball game. depending on how well you did on this earth will depend on where your sits are. they could be all the way in the back or they could be right behind the players. you may not have the best seats but you are still at the game. it is either you are at the game or you are not, there is no in between like heaven and hell.

“Paradise” where the prophets and good people of the old testament waited for Christ to open the gates of heaven - presumably a not-so-bad place in hell.

Then we read that depending on how good of a life we lead, we may enjoy heaven more or less. Sounds like different ranges of heaven.

when you die you leave this world and go to a place with out time. there everything is in the absolute now. when adam and eve died they didn’t have to waite thousands of years till jesus came and died on the cross. when they died, here on earth moses was leading the slaves out of egypt and jesus dies on the cross and pope john paul II dies all at the same moment in theire point of view. it is hard to explain and it is hard to rap your mind around the idea of a place without time. i struggled with it and i’m still struggling with. it is uncomprehencible in this world. just try to understand the best you can.

 

[MichaelMurphy]

Neil Anthony, I assume you’re referring to Purgatory here. I’m reading ‘The Divine Comedy’ at the moment, and that’s a poetical story about a journey through the Hellish, Purgatorial, and Heavenly realms. To my understanding, the story is firmly rooted in Catholic ideology about the afterlife.

starting with this, when you die you will be with God in heaven or you will reject God and go to hell. you can’t be in a place that is in God’s parcial presents, it is either you are with him or you are not. there is no in between. but there is stages of heaven and hell depending how you do on this earth.

think of heaven like a pro basketball game. depending on how well you did on this earth will depend on where your sits are. they could be all the way in the back or they could be right behind the players. you may not have the best seats but you are still at the game. it is either you are at the game or you are not, there is no in between like heaven and hell.

“Depending on how you do on this Earth” - I don’t know what that means my friend. I appreciate your analogy of heaven being like a basketball game, but I also feel compelled to express my sincere disagreement with it. This version of Heaven seems very hierarchical in an earthly sense because status, money, is what gets you the front row seats. The poor sucker breaking his back working 50 hours a week in a warehouse, has had to hand over a weeks wages for tickets in the back row to bring his son to the game for his birthday. Surely, Heaven must be more wondrous and unbelievable than any human mind can even begin to fathom. Love knows no bounds.
God Bless you.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

In regards to Hell, sin causes suffering. Generally, one must be obstinately clinging to grave sin to end up in Hell–so that is going to be a high degree of suffering itself.

Theoretically, some unbaptized person without supernatural faith who died in original sin but only committed a few venial sins would suffer less.

Well, you can go to hell for stubbornly refusing to attend mass on the feast of immaculate conception. Thinking of that example, an appropriate amount of suffering, to my sense of justice, would be less than the typical idea of being immersed in flame for eternity. I’ve never been trapped in a burning building, the worse burn I’ve ever had was just a little spot on my hand less than an inch big. And that was quite painful. To imagine the pain of being burned, never-ending, over your whole body with never a sense of relief just seems out of proportion to the sin in the example of missing mass on Imaculate Conception. That’s why I think there must be levels of hell which aren’t nearly as bad as the eternal immersion in fire.

 

[anthony6]

“Depending on how you do on this Earth” - I don’t know what that means my friend. I appreciate your analogy of heaven being like a basketball game, but I also feel compelled to express my sincere disagreement with it. This version of Heaven seems very hierarchical in an earthly sense because status, money, is what gets you the front row seats. The poor sucker breaking his back working 50 hours a week in a warehouse, has had to hand over a weeks wages for tickets in the back row to bring his son to the game for his birthday. Surely, Heaven must be more wondrous and unbelievable than any human mind can even begin to fathom. Love knows no bounds.
God Bless you.

“depending on how well we do on this earth”- i was trying to say that how well did you serve God’s will to the best of your knowledge. i known there are other factors to go along with that but i am just trying to keep it simple so i don’t ramble on and confuses people. i totally know where you are coming from though and i am glad you brought this up.

with the analogy of the basketball game, again i was just trying to keep it simple so they can understand the next world a little bit more.

i agree with you 100% that Heaven must be more wondrous and unbelievable than any human mind can even begin to fathom. God’s love is infinate.

 

[buffalo]

There are. Heaven is not discrete. You will experience God as fully as the capacity of your soul allows. The more holy here on earth the more capacity.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

There are. Heaven is not discrete. You will experience God as fully as the capacity of your soul allows. The more holy here on earth the more capacity.

Yes that’s what I’ve read too. So it’s not enough to just barely scrape by!

Also you know how much a burn hurts when you put it under hot water, imagine taking a giant blistery burn over your whole body and jumping into hot lava, and this lasts for ever! I hope that wouldn’t happen to someone just for missing mass on Immaculate Conception on New Year’s Day.

 

[buffalo]

Yes that’s what I’ve read too. So it’s not enough to just barely scrape by!

Also you know how much a burn hurts when you put it under hot water, imagine taking a giant blistery burn over your whole body and jumping into hot lava, and this lasts for ever! I hope that wouldn’t happen to someone just for missing mass on Immaculate Conception on New Year’s Day.

Venial sins will be washed away during purgation. That purifies your capacity.

More teaching should be done on this. How you can increase your capacity for God, here on earth. What I usually hear is how to get to heaven ( do not die in mortal sin), so that is sort of a minimalist approach.