Spending money for consrruction big budgeted church

[josethekke]

I have a doubt that when there is lot of struggling peoples who do not have houses not enough money for children education and treatment in the parish ,is it a right thing to construct churches spending large amount of money collected by ‘forced’ donations of course church is required for prayer and worship and parish church is one which unifies all the parishioners

 

[Gloria1]

The true house of God is within our hearts. The true temple of God is within us yet people spend billions of dollars building mansions for God here on earth while poor people especially children continue to starve to death. It is a house of God and it must be kept clean. However, God doesn’t need any mansion here on earth. All God wants from us is to help the poor and the needy in the society.

 

[vera_dicere]

I have a doubt that when there is lot of struggling peoples who do not have houses not enough money for children education and treatment in the parish ,is it a right thing to construct churches spending large amount of money collected by ‘forced’ donations of course church is required for prayer and worship and parish church is one which unifies all the parishioners

What do you mean by “forced” donations? Last I checked there aren’t priests with machine guns standing over people when the collection plate is passed.

Anyho, people need a place to worship, as Christians we are required to come together in community to worship God. We need a place to do it. In this day and age, especially in the west, there’s a lot that goes into a building that sometimes is probably a bit redundant.

The Catholic church is the most charitable organisation on the planet, but we can’t change govts. and its govts. and their shonky infilstructure that causes kids to starve. If you’re going to argue “oh, we don’t need churches anyway, and all the starving orphans out there are dying while we’re building a flashy church”, then by that logic, what are you doing living in a house when a tent will do the same job? Why are you online talking about this when the money you spend on the internet connection could better be spent for the starving orphans, for that matter, why did you waste money on a computer?

We do the best we can. We give what we are prepared to do. We don’t need a flashy church. But people need a place to worship.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Oh why why why did that woman ‘waste’ that alabaster jar of ointment on Jesus’ feet? That jar could have been **sold **and the money given to the poor.

Do you really mean to tell me that your town is the only place on the planet where real estate, construction costs, zoning, and even the plainest --but at the same time most durable materials that will last for a hundred years or more–aren’t amazingly expensive? Sweet. Tell me where this is so I can move there.

OK, I don’t mean to snark but I really think that most people have no idea how much it costs to build a ‘plain little Church’-- that must be ‘up to code’ with wiring and plumbing, handicap accessible, with parking, lights, adequate power/generators, etc. Even if you have ‘worked’ with property in the last 5 years, you’re probably still guestimating costs at 15-25% under what they are today in July 2010.

Is the Church going to be located in a flood plain? (You would be SURPRISED how many places are, and how expensive and difficult it is to obtain flood insurance), Located in places that can have tornadoes, hurricanes or earthquakes? Well, you can get some materials that are more resistent (though nothing will assure 100% safety). . .but you’ll have to pay. Plus in a lot of places you need a backup power system (in case the major one fails through an act of weather). And insurance in case the little old ladies and gents slip on icy walks, or get whapped with pieces of roof tiles (don’t laugh, this happens every year in my old home town). . .

I swear, people act all huffy and stuffy as though the ‘bishop’ or ‘priest’ was going to be siphoning off money from this, or was planning a cathedral with gold leaf and marble arches while the poor parishoners were bled white and finally were TURNED away from the palace because they were so shabby and ill fed. . . (Cue sickly violin music).

You know, provided your Church doesn’t wipe out all its programs (and I’m sure it has them) in order to pay for a proven ‘palace’ (we’re talking on the order of say a 100 million dollar church in a town of 5000 people most of whom are unemployed due to something like Hurricaine Katrina), the odds are that this is a perfectly reasonable expenditure.

Doesn’t Scripture tell us that the laborer is worthy of his hire? And I don’t recall Scripture (or Tradition) saying, “Give God only the cheapest and the plainest and give the rest to the poor” --plus, to be quite frank, even if this were suddenly made into a TENT and the ‘leftover’ money amounted to 50 million dollars, I would be surprised if a TENTH of that actually went ‘to the poor.’ You’d find out pretty quickly that in order to take care of the troubles from the cheap gimcrack ‘make do’ you put in place, you’ll wind up spending more than the original so-called palace would have cost, and then some. Furthermore, some of that money earmarked to the poor would wind up squandered, and more would wind up ‘stolen’ or misappropriated.

Now I’m not saying "don’t give to the poor.’ Of course one should give–give until it hurts–but ‘be ye wise as serpents’ about it. It’s not ‘stewardship’ to throw money ‘to the poor’ if it winds up not doing the good it should, right?

I apologize if I ‘ranted’ a bit but heavens to betsy, I get so tired of the breathless self-righteous ‘tone’ (though I’m not accusing any individual of actually being such. We all know that ‘tone’ on a message board’ may not accurately reflect what a person actually meant to say) of "Oh mercy me, we have poor poor people and the Catholic Church wants to make a great big new church that will cost so much money, woe is me, what about the poor?’ As though the Church never **thinks about the poor or is trying to ‘steal’ from the poor. **

Sigh.

 

[josethekke]

What do you mean by “forced” donations? Last I checked there aren’t priests with machine guns standing over people when the collection plate is passed.

Anyho, people need a place to worship, as Christians we are required to come together in community to worship God. We need a place to do it. In this day and age, especially in the west, there’s a lot that goes into a building that sometimes is probably a bit redundant.

What i mean 'forced donation ’ is in our area during construction of church or parish hall parish committee will publish amount of contribution, usually big amount each parishioner to pay .some people are not able to pay and the committee will be pressurizing the parishioners to pay This type of collection I mean forced donation I am not against construction of church but I tried to highlight about spending money extravagantly.Here in our area i did’t see spending or collecting money for charity purpose in the parishes of course some amount money is given to the needy once in a while I always appreciate the services of missionaries of charity and like organization …Magnificent Jerusalem temple is an example when needy persons in the parish available without helping them, spending money extravagantly will please god ,really i don’t know

 

[ALLGIRLS]

Ok, not trying to be uncharitable, but I could barely make any sense of your post. PLEASE try to make better use of grammer and punctuation. Just because it’s an internet forum doesn’t mean you should just type without thinking about pauses between sentences, phrases, or thoughts.

What I think you’re trying to say is that your parish is building a new church or parish hall and making people feel guilty if they don’t give a specific amount. Meanwhile, it’s doing next to nothing for the needy of the community. Is that about right? I think this boils down to a “parish management” question. It’s certainly not a “universal Church” problem.
I belong to a parish that has had one “capital campaign” after another for the last 20 years or so, due to it being in an area of tremendous growth. Yes, it does get tedious always being asked for donations, and I’m glad it’s finally over. I also disagree with “publishing” individual’s donations. Our parish gives a chart with “suggested amounts”, based on income, and then asks us to “prayerfully consider” what we can give. No one is “strong armed”, and whatever amount (if any) decided is kept confidential. If I were you, I’d bring up the lack of confidentiality to the parish council and pastor. If nothing is done, request that at least your donation be kept confidential, as it’s nobody else’s business except you and God.

As far as charitable donations: It is very sad if your parish isn’t collecting for anything at least a few times a year (our parish is always collecting for something, despite also being in the midst of capital campaigns). One remedy is just giving to different groups on your own if you feel compelled to do so. Or you could switch to a parish that is more into collecting for charity. Your choice. But this isn’t a problem in doctrine or discipline in the Church as a whole, so I’m not sure where the rant is coming from?

In Christ,

Ellen

 

[FAB]

vera dicere;6825772:

What do you mean by “forced” donations? Last I checked there aren’t priests with machine guns standing over people when the collection plate is passed.

Anyho, people need a place to worship, as Christians we are required to come together in community to worship God. We need a place to do it. In this day and age, especially in the west, there’s a lot that goes into a building that sometimes is probably a bit redundant.

What i mean 'forced donation ’ is in our area during construction of church or parish hall parish committee will publish amount of contribution, usually big amount each parishioner to pay .some people are not able to pay and the committee will be pressurizing the parishioners to pay This type of collection I mean forced donation I am not against construction of church but I tried to highlight about spending money extravagantly.Here in our area i did’t see spending or collecting money for charity purpose in the parishes of course some amount money is given to the needy once in a while I always appreciate the services of missionaries of charity and like organization …Magnificent Jerusalem temple is an example when needy persons in the parish available without helping them, spending money extravagantly will please god ,really i don’t know

Some always want to make building a new church or giving to the poor an either or proposition, which it is not. Great buildings and art work are the human spirit giving gloryh to God, expressing it in our architecture.
As as Charity, you should start counting the number of second collections that go the charitable causes including missions, Catholic charities, Diocesan service funds, Peter Pence and many many more. If you don’t see it perhaps you arn’t giving.

Peace, FAB

 

[Abu]

Gloria1
All God wants from us is to help the poor and the needy in the society.

If you look at the 10 Commandments you will see that there is much more that God wants from us.
If you look at the effect of regular worship on faith and morals at
catholiceducation.org/articles/printarticle.html?id=6543
you will see The Power of the Third Commandment:
Now the social sciences have discovered that the more frequently Americans worship, practice religion, the better they do on every observable outcome measured to date – this includes adultery, homosexual conduct, cohabitation and many more areas benefiting the individual and society.

Jesus of Nazareth gave us His Church and He gave us the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass as a commemoration of His Passion, Crucifixion and Resurrection with priests and His Body and Blood in Holy Communion. That is why it is imperative to build fitting churches for this worship and listening to the Word of God.

Part of our apostolate is helping the poor and needy and the Catholic Church initiated, and promotes, the greatest works of charity which is part of Her building of Western civilization.

 

[Bobby_Jim]

Maybe slightly off topic… but a new church was built in our dicoese, about 40 miles away from here… they probably spent 3 times what they had budget for, and what they ended up with was an architectural hodgepodge - a little bit gothic, a little bit Moorish, a little bit spanish mission, and the inside is worse - fancy expensive marble, lots of “traditional” art and stuff, but none of it quite goes together or fits the space, and poor lighting and acoustics all around. An example of building by committee, with no oversight from anyone who knows about building anything, let alone a church. So when I hear about big budgeted church construction - beware of stuff like this. Better to spend some money on a good building consultant, and try to stave off massive budget overruns for poor results that will have to be redone in a few years.

 

[josethekke]

If you look at the 10 Commandments you will see that there is much more that God wants from us.
If you look at the effect of regular worship on faith and morals at
catholiceducation.org/articles/printarticle.html?id=6543
you will see The Power of the Third Commandment:
Now the social sciences have discovered that the more frequently Americans worship, practice religion, the better they do on every observable outcome measured to date – this includes adultery, homosexual conduct, cohabitation and many more areas benefiting the individual and society.

Jesus of Nazareth gave us His Church and He gave us the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass as a commemoration of His Passion, Crucifixion and Resurrection with priests and His Body and Blood in Holy Communion. That is why it is imperative to build fitting churches for this worship and listening to the Word of God.

Part of our apostolate is helping the poor and needy and the Catholic Church initiated, and promotes, the greatest works of charity which is part of Her building of Western civilization.

Of course a suitable church is needed for prying ,worshiping and glorifying our Lord .At the same time helping the needy also essential .It is good to read and meditate Mathew 25,words31-46

 

[FAB]

Of course a suitable church is needed for prying ,worshiping and glorifying our Lord .At the same time helping the needy also essential .It is good to read and meditate Mathew 25,words31-46

When you say helping those who are needy, have you ever considered the number of people that a church construction project employ? There is the Architect and Engineers, the contractor and his crews, plumbing , HVAC, Electrical, there are masonry workers, Carpenters (like our savior) Artistans. Then there are the people who work for the suppliers of the materials, the shippers, the truck drivers, heavy equipment oporators, book keepers, bankers, restaurants, and thier suppliers, 100’s of people that a single construction project employ and help give them a standard of life.
Jesus also taught the dignity of man, he himself worked for a great deal of life, there is greater dignaty in work, than accepting a hand out.
Then also don’t forget, these 100’s of people also have the opportunity to help those in need.
Peace,
FAB