Spending the Night

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Is there a teaching by the Church as far as spending the night at a girlfriend/boyfriend’s house is concerned? My girlfriend and I are both adults, but live 4 hours away from each other so when we see each other, sleeping over is involved. We have a lot of self-control and have been very good about not crossing any lines. We also sleep in separate rooms. I’m curious as to what the policy is on this. Thanks in advance.
 
mattysavs said:
Is there a teaching by the Church as far as spending the night at a girlfriend/boyfriend’s house is concerned? My girlfriend and I are both adults, but live 4 hours away from each other so when we see each other, sleeping over is involved. We have a lot of self-control and have been very good about not crossing any lines. We also sleep in separate rooms. I’m curious as to what the policy is on this. Thanks in advance.
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I don’t think there is a specific teaching on this. I think it’s one left to prudence. If you truly believe this is not an occasion of sin for either of you (it might not be for you, are you sure it’s not for her?), there is still the sin of scandal. People may find out you’re spending the night and then assume that you are sexually active, which may have a couple of different results. 1) they will think ‘hey mattysavs and his girlfriend are good Catholics and THEY are sleeping together, it must not be that bad I’ll do it too’ or 2) they will think ‘haha, I KNEW those Catholics didn’t really believe in that no sex before marriage thing’. Something to think about.
 
mattysavs said:
Is there a teaching by the Church as far as spending the night at a girlfriend/boyfriend’s house is concerned? My girlfriend and I are both adults, but live 4 hours away from each other so when we see each other, sleeping over is involved. We have a lot of self-control and have been very good about not crossing any lines. We also sleep in separate rooms. I’m curious as to what the policy is on this. Thanks in advance.
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Hey,

I’m in the same situation, so I can totally empathize. I’m across the country from my boyfriend right now and only get to see him during school breaks. When I visit, it’s for a minimum of a week. That would really be an expensive hotel bill! So, when I visit, he allows me to sleep in his room while he takes the couch. It causes some issues with some members of my family, who assume that I’m doing immoral things, but over the years, I’ve come to terms with that. I know that I am chaste when I see him, so who cares what others think? I know, my boyfriend knows, and God knows. That’s what’s important. I say, if you are confident in your self-control (as you have stated), go for it! 😃
 
Jea9 said:
I don’t think there is a specific teaching on this. I think it’s one left to prudence. If you truly believe this is not an occasion of sin for either of you (it might not be for you, are you sure it’s not for her?), there is still the sin of scandal. People may find out you’re spending the night and then assume that you are sexually active, which may have a couple of different results. 1) they will think ‘hey mattysavs and his girlfriend are good Catholics and THEY are sleeping together, it must not be that bad I’ll do it too’ or 2) they will think ‘haha, I KNEW those Catholics didn’t really believe in that no sex before marriage thing’. Something to think about.
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Sometimes though, I think the sin of “scandal” is misplaced. The focus sometimes should be the sin of being a busybody, and paying too much attention to matters that are none of one’s business.

People leading genuinely moral lives, which in this day and age is somewhat countercultural and requires significant willpower, should not have to face the additional burden of worrying about what busybodies think.

Let’s place the guilt where it really belongs, the nosey types that can’t mind their own business, not on two adults visiting and sleeping in separate bedrooms. For all the neighbors, know, the visitor can be the lady’s brother.
 
The visiting one can stay in a hotel…or with someone else…

…no matter how “controlled” one is…can be a near occasion of grave sin…the kind that is completely contrary to the love you have for each other…and

Among other problems…can cause** grave** scandal…
 
Bookcat said:
The visiting one can stay in a hotel…or with someone else…

…no matter how “controlled” one is…can be a near occasion of grave sin…the kind that is completely contrary to the love you have for each other…and

Among other problems…can cause** grave** scandal…
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So I should spend over $1000 every 3 months on a student’s budget so Mrs. NosyNeighbor won’t be offended? I don’t understand what grave scandal means…
 
plinko-I go on Matthew Warner’s blog fallible blogma pretty often. I don’t post normally, but whatever. Do you ever go there, because I remember seeing a commentor called plinko?
 
Marc_Anthony said:
plinko-I go on Matthew Warner’s blog fallible blogma pretty often. I don’t post normally, but whatever. Do you ever go there, because I remember seeing a commentor called plinko?
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No sorry…not me! I just like that game from the Price is Right… guess that person does too 🙂
 
plinko said:
So I should spend over $1000 every 3 months on a student’s budget so Mrs. NosyNeighbor won’t be offended? I don’t understand what grave scandal means…
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I had a number of long distance relationships…I understand…but love does not put the beloved into a near occasion of sin…etc

There are other ways…staying with friends, family etc

Scandal from the Catechism: 2284 Scandal is an attitude or behavior which leads another to do evil. The person who gives scandal becomes his neighbor’s tempter. He damages virtue and integrity; he may even draw his brother into spiritual death. Scandal is a grave offense if by deed or omission another is deliberately led into a grave offense.
 
Bookcat said:
I had a number of long distance relationships…I understand…but love does not put the beloved into a near occasion of sin…etc

Scandal from the Catechism: 2284 Scandal is an attitude or behavior which leads another to do evil. The person who gives scandal becomes his neighbor’s tempter. He damages virtue and integrity; he may even draw his brother into spiritual death. Scandal is a grave offense if by deed or omission another is deliberately led into a grave offense.
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By staying over at my boyfriend’s, I am saving money (that I have taken out in loans at 8.5% interest:eek:). I am not deliberately leading anyone into a grave offense. Most of the people around me (friends, family, etc.) know the whole “Plinko gets the bed and Boyfriend gets the futon” shtick, so either they 1. don’t believe us or 2. do believe us. I can’t help if people think I’m lying. Furthermore, what’s to stop scandal if one gets a hotel room? People could be inclined to believe we are using the hotel room as a cover-up for misdeeds. The point is, we can’t stop people from imagining the worst out of us; the most we can do is inform them of the situation and hope they’re not too judgmental. God knows I’m chaste; that’s what’s important.
 
In different rooms, you’re fine. It’s the people who want to sleep in the same room – or the same bed! – who raise my suspicions. If you’re sleeping in the same bed with your beloved, tempting yourself in the most serious way possible, and you’re not committing serious sins of unchastity, then I think there’s something wrong with you!

That, I think, would be scandalous – even if somehow you really were chaste.

But if you’re in separate rooms, and your separation is public knowledge available to anyone who asks, then anyone whose “virtue or integrity” is damaged has only their own uncharitability to blame. The sin of scandal is only committed when your actions would reasonably lead a virtuous person into doubt and sin. The busybodies you describe are not virtuous people; they are uncharitable people who doubt your honesty.

So it appears to me.
 
plinko said:
By staying over at my boyfriend’s, I am saving money (that I have taken out in loans at 8.5% interest:eek:). I am not deliberately leading anyone into a grave offense. Most of the people around me (friends, family, etc.) know the whole “Plinko gets the bed and Boyfriend gets the futon” shtick, so either they 1. don’t believe us or 2. do believe us. I can’t help if people think I’m lying. Furthermore, what’s to stop scandal if one gets a hotel room? People could be inclined to believe we are using the hotel room as a cover-up for misdeeds. The point is, we can’t stop people from imagining the worst out of us; the most we can do is inform them of the situation and hope they’re not too judgmental. God knows I’m chaste; that’s what’s important.
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Yes it can still be cause of scandal…etc

One can stay with friends and family …
 
By the way deliberate need not I think here mean “intentionally” …as in trying to lead someone astray…

and also besides the near occasion…there is how it appears to the neighbors…

“look that Catholic/Christian is spending the night with his girlfriend…”

for it is quite likely in this day and age that if someone spends the night…it is a foregone conclusion that they “slept together”

(which is different from…look they are dating…they must be sleeping together …or look they are alone in the house…must be up to bad things…)

staying the night…is well…a very *charged *event.

(this is a colloqual meaning of scandal but a legit one…)
 
plinko said:
Furthermore, what’s to stop scandal if one gets a hotel room? People could be inclined to believe we are using the hotel room as a cover-up for misdeeds. The point is, we can’t stop people from imagining the worst out of us; the most we can do is inform them of the situation and hope they’re not too judgmental. God knows I’m chaste; that’s what’s important.
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You would be the only one staying there…and the hotel is well where travelers stay…
 
or course the best would be for one to stay with family or friends…

Less money! 🙂
 
Bookcat said:
or course the best would be for one to stay with family or friends…

Less money! 🙂
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Of course that would be best, and if it were possible, I would. My boyfriend and his roommate are the only two people I know in that city however. Again, I stay for at least a week and it’s a major US city (think NYC, Chicago, LA…huge!) Finding a decent cheap hotel where a girl is not scared to be alone late at night is a challenge. So my options are: stay with the bf for free, or pay tons of government-lended money so I don’t look like I’m having sex. It seems pretty logical when you look at it that way.

What I was saying about the hotel is this: nothing is stopping him from staying at my hypothetical hotel if we wished to be tempted. Getting a hotel is not a barrier to prevent sin; it’s merely a way to flaunt our chastity. I’m not spending hundreds/thousands of dollars so that people will admire my virginity.
 
Plinko, I really think you should hang a large lighted sign outside, advertising the fact that you two are, indeed, sleeping in separate beds, and in different rooms. Then, put a mini-cam in each room, focused upon the beds, and connect the mini-cams to a pair of monitor screens outside, so everyone can see for themselves that you two are, indeed, doing as you claim. Also, you should record those proceedings and make them available on-line for anyone who thinks that perhaps they blinked and missed a few minutes of intense passion.

Some sage once remarked that “Nosy people don’t live long around here.” I certainly hope that’s the case for any of your inquisitive neighbors who may make it their business to horn in on yours.

Regards,
Ponyguy
 
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