Spiritual killing between Muslims.

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Sam_777

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This is reference to one of argument I’ve seen on this board regarding Muslims killing other Muslims, in addition to the physical killing between Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Darfur, Kashmir, …etc. There is also a spiritual killing here in Arabian Peninsula from Ishmael descendants (aka the fruits of Muhammed), where Muslims kill the spirit of other Muslims, examples of such acts are shown in these references (R1, R2, R3).

Moreover, just yesterday, one Saudi prince who is in charge of the Saudi football federation, came on TV in front of at least 50 million Arabic viewers, and humiliated his own people very harshly, just because they were criticizing the way Saudi Arabia team played which led to a defeat by its Muslim neighbour Oman.

Here is the 6 minutes Youtube video (sorry its only in Arabic), but its a tangible visual evidence on the fruit of Muhammed, that incident made a lot of noise here in Saudi Arabia, almost everyone I met today was speaking about it.
 
football ?? saudi prince ?? are you mad or what ?

Respect this forum please
 
All you’ve shown my friend is that Saudis (like yourself perhaps) do not care much for the dignity of fellow human beings. In this part of the world, we understand such behavior to be tribal and ignorant, and far away from the teachings of Islam.

That you can’t tell the difference shows exactly why such ignorance continues to flourish in your own country.

Instead of complaining about Islam to Catholics (who by and large don’t give two whits about what goes on in Saudia), why don’t you do something positive to change the world for the better?
 
In one stroke a Sunni suicide bomber killed nearly 1300 Shiites pilgrims at a bridge near a Shiite shrine in Iraq a couple of years back. A Muslim can do a few seconds what the horde Israel Army cannot do in 22 days. Amazing fact.
 
Nicolas said:
football ?? saudi prince ?? are you mad or what ?

Respect this forum please
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Firstly, this forum is managed by Catholics NOT Muslims.

Secondly, I’m referencing Muhammed’s fruits as mentioned in the Bible:
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?” (Matthew 7:15-16).

Thirdly, are you from Ishmael descendants!!!
It looks like you are a Muslim:
Nicolas said:
We believe that Ali and ibn Abbas are (humans) and DID actually make mistakes in society and religion.
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And you know Arabic as well:
Nicolas said:
I just read ,in Arabic, the Hadith you posted

فبلغ النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏فبعث في طلبهم فجيء بهم فقطع أيديهم وأرجلهم ‏ ‏وسمر ‏ ‏أعينهم ‏
‏**قال ‏ ‏قتادة ‏ ‏فحدثني ‏ ‏محمد بن سيرين ‏
‏أن ذلك كان قبل أن تنزل الحدود **
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As for the other members, Saudi Arabia/Arabian Peninsula is:
  1. The land of Ishmael descendants.
  2. The land where Muhammed born.
  3. The land where Islam started.
  4. The land where the Islamic attacks started.
  5. Saudis are the fruit of Muahhmed.
  6. Saudi Arabia is the only Islamic country in the world which made its constitution the Quran.
If you want to know the true Islam, you have to see its source and all its teachings (the orthodox Islam), not living in a secular country and creating new sects like Ahmadiyya, Quranics, etc., to polish the image of Islam.

And who is me to change the behaviour of the Saudis if its literately mentioned in the Bible!

(Genesis 16:12):
“He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone’s hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers.”

(Matthew 7:15-16):
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?”
By their fruit you will recognize them.**
**By their fruit you will recognize them.
*By their fruit you will recognize them.
 
Reuben_J said:
In one stroke a Sunni suicide bomber killed nearly 1300 Shiites pilgrims at a bridge near a Shiite shrine in Iraq a couple of years back. A Muslim can do a few seconds what the horde Israel Army cannot do in 22 days. Amazing fact.
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Prophesied by Muhammad, that. That Muslims will be killing Muslims more than non-Muslims will be. Did you know that?
 
Sam_777 said:
This is reference to one of argument I’ve seen on this board regarding Muslims killing other Muslims, in addition to the physical killing between Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Darfur, Kashmir, …etc. There is also a spiritual killing here in Arabian Peninsula from Ishmael descendants (aka the fruits of Muhammed), where Muslims kill the spirit of other Muslims, examples of such acts are shown in these references (R1, R2, R3).

Moreover, just yesterday, one Saudi prince who is in charge of the Saudi football federation, came on TV in front of at least 50 million Arabic viewers, and humiliated his own people very harshly, just because they were criticizing the way Saudi Arabia team played which led to a defeat by its Muslim neighbour Oman.

Here is the 6 minutes Youtube video (sorry its only in Arabic), but its a tangible visual evidence on the fruit of Muhammed, that incident made a lot of noise here in Saudi Arabia, almost everyone I met today was speaking about it.
Click to expand...
Saudi has dominated that region for so long. To lose to Oman is embarrassing. This has nothing to do with religion, though. This is outburst is the Arab character not Islam.
 
Sam_777 said:
As for the other members, Saudi Arabia/Arabian Peninsula is:
  1. The land of Ishmael descendants.
  2. The land where Muhammed born.
  3. The land where Islam started.
  4. The land where the Islamic attacks started.
  5. Saudis are the fruit of Muahhmed.
  6. Saudi Arabia is the only Islamic country in the world which made its constitution the Quran.
If you want to know the true Islam, you have to see its source and all its teachings (the orthodox Islam), not living in a secular country and creating new sects like Ahmadiyya, Quranics, etc., to polish the image of Islam.

And who is me to change the behaviour of the Saudis if its literately mentioned in the Bible!

(Genesis 16:12):
“He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone’s hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers.”

(Matthew 7:15-16):
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?”
By their fruit you will recognize them.***
By their fruit you will recognize them.
By their fruit you will recognize them.
Click to expand...
Hmmm…interesting…I wonder if we could do the same of Palestine
  1. The land of Judah’s descendents
  2. The land where Zionism was born
  3. The land where constant insurgency under the Romans
  4. The land where the suicide attacks began (see Samson)
  5. Isreal is the fruit of Zionism
  6. Israel is the a theocracy that continues to hold Palestinians in concentration camps and use their children for target practice!!!
 
Sam_777 said:
As for the other members, Saudi Arabia/Arabian Peninsula is:
  1. The land of Ishmael descendants.
  2. The land where Muhammed born.
  3. The land where Islam started.
  4. The land where the Islamic attacks started.
  5. Saudis are the fruit of Muahhmed.
  6. Saudi Arabia is the only Islamic country in the world which made its constitution the Quran.
If you want to know the true Islam, you have to see its source and all its teachings (the orthodox Islam), not living in a secular country and creating new sects like Ahmadiyya, Quranics, etc., to polish the image of Islam.

And who is me to change the behaviour of the Saudis if its literately mentioned in the Bible!

(Genesis 16:12):
“He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone’s hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers.”

(Matthew 7:15-16):
“Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles?”
By their fruit you will recognize them.***
By their fruit you will recognize them.
By their fruit you will recognize them.
Click to expand...
If you hate so bad…leave!
 
I do not like that sort of answer. “If you hate it so much, leave!”

No, no…why should any Christian leave their homeland? I would not say Sam should be obligated to stay, either, but certainly there is something to be said for remaining in your own country despite tough conditions. Otherwise we see a mass exodus of religious minorities (Christians, Zoroastrians, whatever) from their homelands. And then what? The middle east is 100% Muslim. This is like a bad dream…

I would no more tell Sam to leave Saudi Arabia than I would tell Sister Amy to leave the United States. If either were to decide to leave, it would be (I hope) of their own volition, so it’s fine. Otherwise, what reason is there?

I stay in my home country not because I necessarily have to (I can speak other languages and I have a valid passport), but because this is where I am from. This is where I live. My context is here. Sam will never be able to be from any place other than S.A., and that is probably what has shaped his outlook more than any sort of baseless hatred of Islam. He has, I presume, seen its “rough edges”, and found it distasteful overall. Good for him. No one should be a prisoner to a religion they feel strips them of their humanity. God gave us free will and brains so that we may use both.

The Christians of the Middle East, be they in Saudi or elsewhere, appear to be increasingly living and dying as lone voices in the desert. Surely it is much harder than I, a Western Christian of a Latin American background, can understand. Is it to their benefit to leave because it is hard to be Christian and Arab? Christian and Middle Eastern (Assyrian/Syriac/Chaldean/Maronite, for those who don’t identify as ethnic Arabs)? Perhaps it is. After all, there are established communities of Maronites (to use one example) in not only the USA, but also Australia, Brazil, Argentina, and many other places in the world. They could go to those places. But sometimes, even though they may hate living with discrimination and threats, they’ll stay because it is their home. To keep the cross planted in Lebanon, to borrow a phrase I have heard from some.

Maybe Sam will plant the first cross in Saudi. Or after him, someone else. Anyway, it is a distressing thought to think that anyone should leave because they find great injustice in their land. Sam seems to be doing what he feels is best to show a side of like in Saudi that is not often seen. I think it is commendable, personally.
 
Why didn’t the Christians of Palestine stay and fight alongside the Muslims for their Homeland???
 
dzheremi said:
I do not like that sort of answer. “If you hate it so much, leave!”

No, no…why should any Christian leave their homeland? I would not say Sam should be obligated to stay, either, but certainly there is something to be said for remaining in your own country despite tough conditions. Otherwise we see a mass exodus of religious minorities (Christians, Zoroastrians, whatever) from their homelands. And then what? The middle east is 100% Muslim. This is like a bad dream…

I would no more tell Sam to leave Saudi Arabia than I would tell Sister Amy to leave the United States. If either were to decide to leave, it would be (I hope) of their own volition, so it’s fine. Otherwise, what reason is there?

I stay in my home country not because I necessarily have to (I can speak other languages and I have a valid passport), but because this is where I am from. This is where I live. My context is here. Sam will never be able to be from any place other than S.A., and that is probably what has shaped his outlook more than any sort of baseless hatred of Islam. He has, I presume, seen its “rough edges”, and found it distasteful overall. Good for him. No one should be a prisoner to a religion they feel strips them of their humanity. God gave us free will and brains so that we may use both.

The Christians of the Middle East, be they in Saudi or elsewhere, appear to be increasingly living and dying as lone voices in the desert. Surely it is much harder than I, a Western Christian of a Latin American background, can understand. Is it to their benefit to leave because it is hard to be Christian and Arab? Christian and Middle Eastern (Assyrian/Syriac/Chaldean/Maronite, for those who don’t identify as ethnic Arabs)? Perhaps it is. After all, there are established communities of Maronites (to use one example) in not only the USA, but also Australia, Brazil, Argentina, and many other places in the world. They could go to those places. But sometimes, even though they may hate living with discrimination and threats, they’ll stay because it is their home. To keep the cross planted in Lebanon, to borrow a phrase I have heard from some.

Maybe Sam will plant the first cross in Saudi. Or after him, someone else. Anyway, it is a distressing thought to think that anyone should leave because they find great injustice in their land. Sam seems to be doing what he feels is best to show a side of like in Saudi that is not often seen. I think it is commendable, personally.
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It is probably more likely that a Khalifah in Spain be planted before Sam plant a church in SA.
 
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Salaam/peace
eichenb2 said:
Why didn’t the Christians of Palestine stay and fight alongside the Muslims for their Homeland???
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I guess, they want Jesus (p) to come back in the holy land during their lifetime. If Muslims are there , Jesus (p) won’t come .
 
Muslim Woman, that is an idiotic assumption.

Eichenb2: You have completely missed my point. And who the hell are you to defame the Palestinian Christians as you have by insinuating that they do not care for their homeland as their Muslim compatriots do because they will not kill over it? For your information, they have fought against Israel using non-violent resistance methods such as tax resisting, and suffered just as the Muslims have. Last time I checked, Israeli bullets do not distinguish between religions.

“The military authorities do not represent us, and we did not invite them to come to our land. Must we pay for the bullets that kill our children or for the expenses of the occupying army?”

– Statement from Ghassan Andoni, founder of the International Solidarity Movement, during the first Intifada of 1989. This rational was advanced to get the citizens of Beit Sahour to join together in city wide tax-resistance, for which they paid heavily. Andoni himself was imprisoned for it.

Every single Christian that I have met from the Middle East supports a free Palestine (I do too). Is it just not enough that they go to jail for it, because it’s for “not radical” things like tax resistence instead of things that make a real difference like killing people? I must have missed the announcement that Palestine has suicide bombed her way into internationally recognized sovereignty… 🤷
 
dzheremi said:
Muslim Woman, that is an idiotic assumption.

Eichenb2: You have completely missed my point. And who the hell are you to defame the Palestinian Christians as you have by insinuating that they do not care for their homeland as their Muslim compatriots do because they will not kill over it? For your information, they have fought against Israel using non-violent resistance methods such as tax resisting, and suffered just as the Muslims have. Last time I checked, Israeli bullets do not distinguish between religions.

“The military authorities do not represent us, and we did not invite them to come to our land. Must we pay for the bullets that kill our children or for the expenses of the occupying army?”

– Statement from Ghassan Andoni, founder of the International Solidarity Movement, during the first Intifada of 1989. This rational was advanced to get the citizens of Beit Sahour to join together in city wide tax-resistance, for which they paid heavily. Andoni himself was imprisoned for it.

Every single Christian that I have met from the Middle East supports a free Palestine (I do too). Is it just not enough that they go to jail for it, because it’s for “not radical” things like tax resistence instead of things that make a real difference like killing people? I must have missed the announcement that Palestine has suicide bombed her way into internationally recognized sovereignty… 🤷
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All that is great, but they keep leaving!!! I guess they turn the other cheek and run.
 
“Turn the other cheek and run”, huh? This is a very glib and rude response. The situation is much more complicated than “Palestinian Christians are cowardly” or whatever it is you are trying to convey by answering in such a manner. Please try to think beyond one-liners.
 
dzheremi said:
“Turn the other cheek and run”, huh? This is a very glib and rude response. The situation is much more complicated than “Palestinian Christians are cowardly” or whatever it is you are trying to convey by answering in such a manner. Please try to think beyond one-liners.
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What do you mean one-liners? :confused:
 
“Turn the other cheek and run”. It oversimplifies a complex situation while simulteanously mocking Christians for holding to the teachings of their religion in very difficult circumstances.
 
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