Spiritual manipulation or abuse?

[bobolink]

Do you think it would be a form of spiritual abuse (or manipulation?) if I asked you to take on a responsibility or duty, based on my own ‘discernment’ in prayer? Say I want you to do something. I tell you that I have prayed about it, and your name ‘came up’. Therefore, I make you feel that by turning down this request, you would be defying the will of God, and therefore would commit a sin by refusing to accept the request. This, to me, is spiritual abuse or manipulation.

It would be better, and more Godly, to simply ask a person if they wanted to accept the role. You would not pressure them, no matter how well meaning you are. You would simply ask, and allow the other person to make a decision. However, in their desire to have you accept the duty, the person might try to pressure you into accepting by using a reason, such as the above, about ‘prayerful discernment’ or otherwise, perhaps by making the person think that bad consequences will necessarily follow your refusal to accept the duty asked of you.

In the end, what you have been asked to do, and spiritually manipulated into accepting, may not actually be the will of God for your life, and therefore, will, sooner or later, end, badly or otherwise. In the meantime, there is your begrudging service (because you didn’t want to do it in the first place) - hardly a way to holiness. Thus the will of God is manifested, and the spiritual manipulation revealed for the futile and human effort that it was, for your original, preferred choice (to decline the request), comes to pass in the end.

And also, how do you discern whether it might have been God’s will anyway, and perhaps you should take up the cross, or decide that it is an unhealthy situation and one you should get out of?

 

[Trishie]

You would be right to be wary of someone else’s imposition of their perception of discernment regarding what they believe you must do or is your responsibility.
You are not, I suspect, speaking of obedience to a superior in a Religious Order.

The person is imposing what may be a personal wish that they feel is justified, something which happened in the framework of their own mind which can be influenced by any pre-conceived or barely conscious preferences.

God’s will for your life and choices is between God and you.
I would ask God to protect you or anyone from another’s pressures, and help you to deal with it wisely and courteously, but firmly.

Love is the bottom line for every choice, but your faith is for God not for another person, and simply to follow another’s direction can, as you fear, distract you from what is right for your life and nature. If it is your personal dilemma, clearly you appear uncomfortable and I guess it’s for you to examine why, but really you must be personally authentic either way. God is honesty and truth, and God has given you the gift of free will which shouldn’t lightly be handed over to another person even if they wish you to or try to pressure you to do.

 

[bobolink]

You would be right to be wary of someone else’s imposition of their perception of discernment regarding what they believe you must do or is your responsibility.
You are not, I suspect, speaking of obedience to a superior in a Religious Order.

The person is imposing what may be a personal wish that they feel is justified, something which happened in the framework of their own mind which can be influenced by any pre-conceived or barely conscious preferences.

God’s will for your life and choices is between God and you.
I would ask God to protect you or anyone from another’s pressures, and help you to deal with it wisely and courteously, but firmly.

Hi Trishie, thanks for your reply.

I am just a humble layman. I was asked to take on a role by a priest. I felt at the time conflicted. On the one hand, I did not feel called to the role. On the other, I felt obliged by this priest’s discernment. I was in a certain turmoil because I didn’t want to do what I was asked to do (take on a particular role) and yet I felt I would be sinning by refusing. The pressure from the priest and a friend of mine (at the time) made me feel that I was duty bound to accept. I have quite a heightened sense of responsibility, and so it was easy for me to succumb to the pressure. Basically, I felt (in my own head) that people would suffer if I didn’t accept and I would also be defying the will of God. I was sensitive to the subtle pressures exerted on me.

The result is that I am doing something grudgingly with people I would rather not be involved with. This upsets my peace of soul and makes me think bad thoughts and such. I wonder though am I just being lazy? I think both aspects are part of the reality of my situation. I struggle to discern what to do.

I think I am going to resign from my voluntary position. Should I let the priest know my reasons or leave him in ignorance? Should I admonish him or let him know my thoughts on this matter?

 

[ElizabethPH]

I think before jumping into anything that is asked of us; it would be foolish for us not to discern and pray about it as well. Perhaps a person is really moved to ask someone to do something through prayer and discernment; but if it’s a manipulative ploy on their part it could hardly be from God. And certainly guilt shouldn’t be what motivates us to do something. We all have the responsiblilty to discern and pray and really take time to think over a project before jumping into it.

 

[1believer1]

Hi Trishie, thanks for your reply.

I am just a humble layman. I was asked to take on a role by a priest. I felt at the time conflicted. On the one hand, I did not feel called to the role. On the other, I felt obliged by this priest’s discernment. I was in a certain turmoil because I didn’t want to do what I was asked to do (take on a particular role) and yet I felt I would be sinning by refusing. The pressure from the priest and a friend of mine (at the time) made me feel that I was duty bound to accept. I have quite a heightened sense of responsibility, and so it was easy for me to succumb to the pressure. Basically, I felt (in my own head) that people would suffer if I didn’t accept and I would also be defying the will of God. I was sensitive to the subtle pressures exerted on me.

The result is that I am doing something grudgingly with people I would rather not be involved with. This upsets my peace of soul and makes me think bad thoughts and such. I wonder though am I just being lazy? I think both aspects are part of the reality of my situation. I struggle to discern what to do.

I think I am going to resign from my voluntary position. Should I let the priest know my reasons or leave him in ignorance? Should I admonish him or let him know my thoughts on this matter?

I would hope that the role / responsibility that the Priest gave you was a necessary role and that he found you to be the best available person for that role. I myself was pushed into a role that I did not want, yet as I spent time in discernment through a lot of prayer I KNEW that this was my responsibility. I am still not comfortable with this role as I do not have all the skills to do it properly yet the decision of my pastor was correct. Many times we are called to leave our “comfort zone” and stretch ourselves. I look at St. Paul for help as he did a lot of things that he did not want to do … stoned, beaten, shipwrecked, jailed and finally killed for what he did for Christ. We are not called ( at least not yet) to do all what he did, but we are called to follow Jesus and do The Fathers Will. Before you resign I would suggest that you spend some time at Adoration (if available ). Pray about your decision, but by all means … talk with your priest. One does not admonish a priest unless he is doing things contrary to the Bishop and the Church teachings. Pray, pray pray … and ask Our Blessed mother to help you discern and then ask for her intercecission.

 

[bobolink]

I think before jumping into anything that is asked of us; it would be foolish for us not to discern and pray about it as well. Perhaps a person is really moved to ask someone to do something through prayer and discernment; but if it’s a manipulative ploy on their part it could hardly be from God. And certainly guilt shouldn’t be what motivates us to do something. We all have the responsiblilty to discern and pray and really take time to think over a project before jumping into it.

I did try to pray about it, but all I had to work with in the end as regards my decision was:

1. A feeling of obligation with guilt for non-compliance
2. A gut feeling that this was not for me (something >I< didn’t *want *to do)
3. Feelings and thoughts of laziness (can’t be bothered)
4. Anger at feeling pressured/emotionally manipulated by priest and friend - I felt that if I refused, people would die and I would be ignoring the will of God!!!
5. Felt rail-roaded into accepting role (my perception)
6. Felt that I had the skills and time to carry out the role
7. Didn’t like some of the people involved in the group (spiritually unhealthy individuals losing themselves in charitable works)

I now find myself doing something I don’t want to do (although I have the basic skill and time to do it), with people I am not happy working with, and so my service is grudging and I find my soul being adversely affected. I also feel that one other person in a key role is also not happy to be involved and is passively aggressive with me, acting like I am duty bound to be involved when I see it as my favour to the group, one that can be rescinded.

 

[St_Francis]

I did try to pray about it, but all I had to work with in the end as regards my decision was:

1. A feeling of obligation with guilt for non-compliance
2. A gut feeling that this was not for me
3. Feelings and thoughts of laziness (can’t be bothered)
4. Anger at feeling pressured/emotionally manipulated by priest and friend - I felt that if I refused, people would die and I would be ignoring the will of God!!!
5. Felt rail-roaded into accepting role (my perception)
6. Felt that I had the skills and time to carry out the role
7. Didn’t like some of the people involved in the group (spiritually unhealthy individuals losing themselves in charitable works)

I now find myself doing something I don’t want to do (although I have the basic skill and time to do it), with people I am not happy working with, and so my service is grudging and I find my soul being adversely affected. I also feel that one other person in a key role is also not happy to be involved and is passively aggressive with me, acting like I am duty bound to be involved when I see it as my favour to the group, one that can be rescinded.

Well, I think that one can carry the discernment for someone else thing too far, but otoh, this was the pastor of your church. I think that if you can pull away from your thoughts of feeling pressured, which might be easier to do now that you have decided to quit, and just sit with God quietly about the task itself, it may be that it would be good for you to continue doing it, despite the people you don’t like, etc. Maybe this would be a good time for you to ask them questions. I know that when people seem more interested in helping people than in serving God that I feel like they are off balance, but sometimes I talk with them and it turns out that they are really not as imbalanced as I thought, or they are doing what they think is right not knowing there are other aspects to the Faith, such as prayer, etc. so you might be able to ask these people questions and maybe help them or maybe find that they can help you.

Because 5 of your 7 points above seem related to having felt pressured when you got this task. Plus maybe the priest just put it that way because that is the sort of thing that the others respond to?

 

[Junebug999]

I agree that requesting someone to do something based on your own private revelation can be a slippery slope.

 

[bobolink]

Well, I think that one can carry the discernment for someone else thing too far, but otoh, this was the pastor of your church. I think that if you can pull away from your thoughts of feeling pressured, which might be easier to do now that you have decided to quit, and just sit with God quietly about the task itself, it may be that it would be good for you to continue doing it, despite the people you don’t like, etc. Maybe this would be a good time for you to ask them questions. I know that when people seem more interested in helping people than in serving God that I feel like they are off balance, but sometimes I talk with them and it turns out that they are really not as imbalanced as I thought, or they are doing what they think is right not knowing there are other aspects to the Faith, such as prayer, etc. so you might be able to ask these people questions and maybe help them or maybe find that they can help you.

Because 5 of your 7 points above seem related to having felt pressured when you got this task. Plus maybe the priest just put it that way because that is the sort of thing that the others respond to?

The priest is not the PP of my church - he is in a neighbouring parish about 45 minutes away. I know him though since about 5 years ago.

One of the people involved in the group is involved in everything in the parish. My parish - where the group is based. The priest is not part of the parish. Anyway, this person is involved in so many groups, I think as a distraction from the hard struggle of daily cross carrying and the pursuit of holiness. I figure its easier to be involved in 101 different causes than to die to yourself. I find being around such superficial people very difficult. Call me ‘judgemental’ if you wish, I call it discernment of persons, which is not the same thing. To judge is to fix a penalty or comment on soul state, which I’ve not done.

I also find it annoying that I am pressured into selling tickets, packing bags in supermarkets and standing on the street collecting money… things I can’t be bothered with. The incremental nature of the tasks which I was increasingly being expected to do led me to tell one key person that I was not taking on any more tasks as I didn’t want to get in any deeper!

 

[baltobetsy]

The priest is not the PP of my church - he is in a neighbouring parish about 45 minutes away. I know him though since about 5 years ago.

One of the people involved in the group is involved in everything in the parish. My parish - where the group is based. The priest is not part of the parish. Anyway, this person is involved in so many groups, I think as a distraction from the hard struggle of daily cross carrying and the pursuit of holiness. I figure its easier to be involved in 101 different causes than to die to yourself. **I find being around such superficial people very difficult. **Call me ‘judgemental’ if you wish, I call it discernment of persons, which is not the same thing. To judge is to fix a penalty or comment on soul state, which I’ve not done.

I also find it annoying that I am pressured into selling tickets, packing bags in supermarkets and standing on the street collecting money… things I can’t be bothered with. The incremental nature of the tasks which I was increasingly being expected to do led me to tell one key person that I was not taking on any more tasks as I didn’t want to get in any deeper!

Could it be that the “things you can’t be bothered with” are the very things which constitute your own “daily cross carrying and pursuit of holiness?” Doing these things with a good spirit could certainly help you on the road to humility, which could be beneficial to someone who labels others as “superficial.”

 

[bobolink]

Could it be that the “things you can’t be bothered with” are the very things which constitute your own “daily cross carrying and pursuit of holiness?” Doing these things with a good spirit could certainly help you on the road to humility, which could be beneficial to someone who labels others as “superficial.”

Lol. Well, yes, perhaps. But I know what I am saying is true.

I also know that I could bite my lip and get on with it instead of whining, but I am not sure.

 

[ElizabethPH]

It just boils down to doing something you don’t want to do. And coming up with excuses why you are justified in quitting.
I’m not sure why someone would be so involved in parish life so’s they can be distracted from daily cross bearing and the persuit of holiness. It’s more likely they don’t know how to say NO just like you.

Peace

 

[puzzleannie]

Do you think it would be a form of spiritual abuse (or manipulation?) if I asked you to take on a responsibility or duty, based on my own ‘discernment’ in prayer? Say I want you to do something. I tell you that I have prayed about it, and your name ‘came up’. Therefore, I make you feel that by turning down this request, you would be defying the will of God, and therefore would commit a sin by refusing to accept the request. This, to me, is spiritual abuse or manipulation.

It

in the past when I have attended Life in the Spirit seminars and similar events, the instruction has always been that if one feels they have received “a word of knowledge” during the group prayer or private prayer, one must ALWAYS submit it to the discernment of the elders as Paul warns–the leaders of the (approved) charismatic prayer group, or one’s own spiritual director or confessor before communicating it to anyone else, including and especially the person about whom the word of knowledge concerns. I can think of no scenario where it would be appropriate on one’s own initiative to presume to tell another person that one has received a communication from God about them. That sounds like manipulation and coercion in the extreme.

even an orthodox spiritual director or confessor does not presume to tell you what God is saying, rather he guides you to listen, discern and hear yourself (beyond of course telling you what you already know, the commandments, the demands of your state in life etc.).

 

[1ke]

This is all about you, not the priest.

The priest prayed and felt called to ask you to help in whatever it was he needed. It was for you to accept or turn down this position.

After praying about it, if **you **didn’t get the same discernment, you could have said “no.”

The priest didn’t tell you it would be a sin to refuse, that was all in your head.

Now you want to “admonish” the priest?

I think you need to discern what’s going on inside your own head, not admonish the priest.

 

[bobolink]

This is all about you, not the priest.

The priest prayed and felt called to ask you to help in whatever it was he needed. It was for you to accept or turn down this position.

After praying about it, if **you **didn’t get the same discernment, you could have said “no.”

The priest didn’t tell you it would be a sin to refuse, that was all in your head.

Now you want to “admonish” the priest?

I think you need to discern what’s going on inside your own head, not admonish the priest.

When you put it like that…

But really, at the time, I was very conflicted. I didn’t want to do it. I won’t go into the reasons why (for fear of offending anyone here), but I had no attraction to any involvement with this group. It was really only feelings of indebtedness towards the priest that made me say yes. In my own head, it came down to 3 basic points:

1. You can do it
2. You should do it
3. Not to do it is sin

So I begrudgingly and reluctantly accepted the role. I have been whining about it inwardly and passively aggressive about it outwardly, since I accepted the role.

 

[baltobetsy]

“Not to do it is sin.”

When God presents an opportunity to serve, we always have free will to accept or refuse. Unless what you were being asked to do was one of the Commandments or Precepts of the Church, I fail to see how refusing would be sinful.

Consider: Mary could have refused to be the Mother of God when Gabriel asked, and it would not have been a sin. It would have appeared to throw a huge monkey wrench into the plan for our salvation, but God can handle it. God can handle your refusal to participate in this activity as well.

I still maintain that you would do well to adjust your attitude toward your fellow workers and try to serve with a good spirit. Stop whining and do the job as if you wanted to, at least for a while. You may be pleasantly surprised.

Betsy