SPLIT: My girlfriend is baptist

[jpink1019]

This is how the thread was started.
Now I am hoping that the topic can be addressed.
The topic of salvation. Once saved always saved.
Specifically I want to give crazzeto the opportunity to explain his quote " Ordinary as opposed to extraordinary salvation, because I have never heard of it before… And I am hoping for clarification.

But you make an assumption in here, and that is that salvation is a one time event which occurs sometime in the past, there for whatever “chruch” you go to doesn’t really matter much.

this is again another misunderstanding.
when you are “Saved” you accept christ. But everyone works out their own salvation from then on. If anything the christian walk becomes harder. It isn’t once get saved you are done working… -_- far from it.

This is not a misunderstanding, as has been pointed out by another poster here. Point in fact, I understand very well this theology, and again, without getting into the particulars it has been rejected by the Catholic Church. In our view, it attempts to take the extrodinary, make it ordinary, and throw out normative salvation.

This is a big problem for a Catholic, very big indeed. If you would like to discuss the particulars of our differences in view of Salvation and Justification then I invite you to start a thread on this topic.

I don’t understand.
A relationship with Christ Jesus is anything but ordinary.
And how is it contingent upon theology?

For clarity, there is such a thing as ordenary as opposed to extrodenary salvation. But we’re about to take this conversation on a left turn. If you want futher clarification, I invite you to quote my post in a new thread and reask your question where it can be delt with more specifically.

 

[3Sanctus]

All Christians were “saved” at Calvary, when Jesus Christ died for our sins.

All Christians are “saved” every moment of their lives as Christians - equally.

All Christians are “saved” when, being judged after death, they are admitted into Heaven - of course with time in purgatory to those who die without having made satisfaction for the temporal punishment due their sins committed.

 

[Scoobyshme]

All Christians were “saved” at Calvary, when Jesus Christ died for our sins.

All Christians are “saved” every moment of their lives as Christians - equally.

All Christians are “saved” when, being judged after death, they are admitted into Heaven - of course with time in purgatory to those who die without having made satisfaction for the temporal punishment due their sins committed.

All who are saved are saved “through” the Catholic Church. When anyone gets to heaven, they ARE a Catholic, whether they were a “card-carrying” Catholic on earth or not. There are only Catholics in heaven. Why? Because the Catholic Church is the Body of Christ, and as such, is eternal. Theologically, then, the Catholic Church has always been around. It only began its earthly ministry when Jesus and the Apostles got it rolling in the first century.

So, any non-Catholic who makes it to heaven will necessarily be part of the Church Glorified.

 

[jpink1019]

All who are saved are saved “through” the Catholic Church. When anyone gets to heaven, they ARE a Catholic, whether they were a “card-carrying” Catholic on earth or not. There are only Catholics in heaven. Why? Because the Catholic Church is the Body of Christ, and as such, is eternal. Theologically, then, the Catholic Church has always been around. It only began its earthly ministry when Jesus and the Apostles got it rolling in the first century.

So, any non-Catholic who makes it to heaven will necessarily be part of the Church Glorified.

The body of Christ consists of all people who have accepted Christ as their Savior and chose to follow His commandments?

 

[Scoobyshme]

The body of Christ consists of all people who have accepted Christ as their Savior and chose to follow His commandments?

The Body of Christ IS the Catholic Church. Everyone who is validly baptized is a member thereof, practicing or not. Some are separated from the Body, by choice or circumstance. But they have the chance to be reunited either in this life or the next. This should not be taken to equate non-Catholic denominations with the Church, however. Those who, THROUGH NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN, are not Catholic, yet live according to the truths of Christ that they DO know, MAY yet be saved. There’s no guarantee, though.

 

[Jim_Dandy]

:
Originally Posted by jpink1019
I don’t understand.
A relationship with Christ Jesus is anything but ordinary.
And how is it contingent upon theology?

Quote:

Becoming a Catholic has changed my relationship to God. I am conscious of God in a much more real way – and I am conscious of my sins in a much deeper way. I am better able to listen to God and live in obedience to Him. My conscience is more sensitive. I was born again in Baptism. When I offend Him, which I try not to do harder than ever, the Sacrament of Penance is available. When I am ill, the Sacrament of the Sick is available. The Eucharist is available daily to nourish my soul. The road to heaven is much clearer and I have the strength to follow it, with the help Christ gives us through the Sacraments. I have more friends – His Mother and His Saints – who are close to Him and help me draw closer to Him by their example and their prayers. I will never be parted from from those I love because we are all the Family of God and nothing can separate us – not distance, not death. Truth has a new meaning, a new reality, a new clarity.

The only reason for becoming or remaining Catholic is that it’s true.

Jim Dandy
former Protestant, agnostic, atheist

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Many of the misunderstandings on the topic of salvation between non catholic Christians and Catholics can first be cleared up on how one enters the Kingdom of God to be saved through baptism.

John 3:3
Jesus answered and said to him, “Amen, amen, I say to you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born 3 from above.”
4
Nicodemus said to him, “How can a person once grown old be born again? Surely he cannot reenter his mother’s womb and be born again, can he?”
5
Jesus answered, "Amen, amen, I say to you,** no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and Spirit. 6 What is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit.
7
Do not be amazed that I told you, ‘You must be born from above.’ **

Then comes the works of those already saved in the Kingdom of God who are working out their salvation with fear and trembling, here is St.Paul;

Phillippians 2;12
10 11 So then, my beloved, obedient as you have always been, not only when I am present but all the more now when I am absent,** work out your salvation with fear and trembling. **
For** God is the one who, for his good purpose, works in you both to desire and to work.**
14
Do everything without grumbling or questioning,
15
**that you may be blameless and innocent, children of God without blemish in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, 13 among whom you shine like lights in the world, **16
as you hold on to the word of life, **so that my boast for the day of Christ may be that I did not run in vain or labor in vain. **

In theological discussions of salvation between “once saved always saved” which is not biblical and “faith and works” which is a biblical teaching;

James 2;17
So also faith of itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
18
Indeed someone might say, “You have faith and I have works.” Demonstrate your faith to me without works, and I will demonstrate my faith to you from my works.

These biblical teaching’s reveal the difference between those entering the Kingdom of God by no merit of their own, but only by the blood of the lamb through water baptism, and those who are already baptised as children of God, who longer drink milk but are eating the meat of the gospel.

Hebrews 5:12
Although you should be teachers by this time, you need to have someone teach you again the basic elements of the utterances of God. You need milk, (and) not solid food.
13
Everyone who lives on milk lacks experience of the word of righteousness, for he is a child.
14
**But solid food is for the mature, for those whose faculties are trained by practice to discern good and evil. **

1Peter 2:2
**like newborn infants, long for pure spiritual milk so that through it you may grow into salvation, **3
for you have tasted that the Lord is good. 2

Understanding the salvation freely and always given by God’s grace to those entering the Kingdom of God and those mature Christians who are already saved and are working out their salvation with fear and trembling, will help eliminate misunderstandings of the topic of salvation of those being saved and those working out their salvation with fear and trembling. This keeps the topic on the same page, from a biblical perspective.

Peace be with you