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TrueLight
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Now THAT’S clear.
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choliks
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Ooopsies… I didn’t know. Now I know. My bad, brother JR.A Master of Divinity is an M.Div. I have one of those too. You have to get it before going on for the doctorate.
I have an MD, I was a medical doctor before entering religious life.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, FFV
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albertjazz
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It would be a plus if the many diocese allowed the celebration of the Tridentine Mass Kneeling for Holy Communon and reception on the tongue,Repecting the Sacament of Penance and so on.Here in the Diocese of East Anglia and the Cathedral Church of St John the Baptist in Norwich UK there is little chance ,as yhe clergy are totally immersed in the Norvo Ordo and its consequences.
This is why many traditionalists feel separated ,a bit more Charity would work wonders
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Cristiano
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A bit charity would work wonders when people take an objective look at the OF and do not use it as a tool to slander priests.
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ProVobis
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Br JR, I think it was Pope Paul who surrendered the tiara and perhaps symbolically gave us the impression that he wanted the papacy to be weakened, but that’s a good topic for another thread.
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Cristiano
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He surrendered the tiara to whom?
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Moore11
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The closet?
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Filii_Dei
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Strictly speaking, it was sold off for charity. It now resides in the Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception. If you’re visiting D.C. you can probably steal a look at it. I don’t know if it’s up for display though.
If anybody is still itching for ye olde days, did you know that Pope Benedict XVI possesses a tiara too?
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ProVobis
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What are the chances he’ll ever wear it in public?If anybody is still itching for ye olde days, did you know that Pope Benedict XVI possesses a tiara too?
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Cristiano
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I would love to see it at least once but it would not be prudent because it would defeat a lot of the ongoing work with the pope’s apostolate.What are the chances he’ll ever wear it in public?
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ProVobis
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Good way of putting it.
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Cristiano
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A nice dream/wish: The pope wearing his tiara and sitting on the sedia gestatoria while he is brought into St. Peter and followed by the SSPX bishops and priests for a te deum in celebration of their return into full communion.
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EcceAgnusDei
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JReducation
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No problem at all.Ooopsies… I didn’t know. Now I know. My bad, brother JR.
People misinterpreted this gesture as often happens. We have to get to a place where we let the pope’s actions stand at face value. The whole thing was very simple. He wanted the papacy to serve the poor in some concrete way.
It was Pope John Paul I who actually said that for the foreseeable future, there would be more coronations. Bl. John Paul echoed the same statement as Paul VI and John Paul I by giving up all of his property to the poor.
Pope Benedict followed suit by taking the tiara out of the papal coat of arms.
The influence came from a joint effort on the part of the Missionaries of Charity and the Franciscans around the word who begged Pope John XXIII for help. Pope John XXIII, being a Franciscan, promised that something would be done, but died before it happened. Pope Paul VI wrote back to the Franciscans and Missionaries of Charity that he would keep the promise made by Pope John. He gave the tiara away to be used for fundraising for the poor.
See above.
It’s on exhibit at the Basilica of the Immaculate Conception and every cent goes to the Missionaries of Charity.Strictly speaking, it was sold off for charity. It now resides in the Basilica of the National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception. If you’re visiting D.C. you can probably steal a look at it. I don’t know if it’s up for display though.
Not any longer. He gave it away when he changed the papal coat of arms.If anybody is still itching for ye olde days, did you know that Pope Benedict XVI possesses a tiara too?
No pope can bind another pope. It does not look likely in the near future. The current generation of cardinals is very sympathetic to the work and vision of the Missionaries of Charity, Franciscans and Missionaries of the Poor.What are the chances he’ll ever wear it in public?
Not too long ago, maybe 10 years? The first shelter and soup kitchen were set up in one wing of the apostolic palace. It occupies a small part of the building, but it’s significant that it’s there.
Originally, the Holy Father had told Mother that she could open as many of these houses in Rome as she liked. She went to see him and told him that Christ did not want more such places in Rome. There were enough. He wanted one in Vatican City. The Holy Father ordered that a part of the palace which was used for something or other, be given to the Missionaries of Charity and that it be outfitted to their needs. It was rather interesting. As we know, most of the Apostolic Palace has some very interesting and beautiful things in it. Everything had to be taken out and the walls had to be whitewashed to make it look as Indian as possible. I’ve always found it interesting that so many people keep saying that the Church should give away the Vatican for the benefit of the poor. Little do people know how much of the Vatican and what’s in the Vatican serves the poor. There are also five parishes in Vatican City. These are actual parishes. The were opened for the needs of the transient poor in Vatican City.
The popes and the City do a lot for the poor, but never tell anyone. It’s done very quietly and humbly.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, FFV
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wasserfall
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The previous poster was probably referring to the fact that Pope Benedict XVI has received tiaras as gifts.
He chooses not to wear them, but he does possess them, in addition to many other older tiaras which are still available to him.
One or the other of them is placed on the head of the statue of St Peter every year.
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Cristiano
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You are the perfect straight man, thanks!
You are just making the point that I was trying to prepare slowly. The pope did not surrender the tiara, as symbol of power, to any human being in the name of the common misinterpretation of collegiality. He surrender the tiara to a much higher authority in a response to specific calling of love for the poor.
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JReducation
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Those there are. I would imagine that over the centuries there must be quite a collection. As I think about my days as a student in Rome, I don’t think that they are ever put on display. If they are, I never saw them.
When the Vatican Treasures exhibit came to the USA, I don’t remember seeing a tiara in the collection. My guess is that they are kept safely away.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, FFV
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JReducation
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We should not read into this what it was not. It was not a political move. It was a concrete act for the benefit of the poor at the request of two religious communities who are in direct contact with the poor and who needed the help of the Holy Father, not for themselves, but for their people.You are the perfect straight man, thanks!
You are just making the point that I was trying to prepare slowly. The pope did not surrender the tiara, as symbol of power, to any human being in the name of the common misinterpretation of collegiality. He surrender the tiara to a much higher authority in a response to specific calling of love for the poor.
They were not asking the pope for money. They were asking the pope to move the worldwide Catholic community to come to the rescue of the poor. Pope John said that the best way to move the world community was for the pope to become personally involved. He died a few months later. Pope Paul kept the promise for him. End of story.
Fraternally,
Br. JR, FFV
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wasserfall
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albertjazz
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The Second Vatican Coucil and the subsequent Spirit of…allowed Modernism to flourish in the RC Church,so now we have the majority seeking exuses in sin,rather than recogonising sin and the need for forgiveness[Penance] The lack of reverence to the blessed sacrament of the alter, and on and on…so why all this banter on this thread ? its clear cut.you are either a Roman Catholic or a ProtestantI’m happy to hear him defend the Second Vatican Council
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