SSPX poised for formal schism?

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Lormar said:
Precisely. I wouldn’t have posted my comment almost saying the same had I seen this one. 👍
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As one poster said “who am I to judge”
The USCCB if fighting againdt the US on the grounds of “freedom on consious”
So let us not be hypocrites to out brother and sisters in the SSPX and of course not be judgemental and allow them to worship God as best fit for them!
 
codefro said:
“Whosoever, therefore, knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved.” LG.14

Spartan- your statement sounds like the “Dictatorship of Relativism” to me. What’s the problem? Well even by the standards mentioned here, then UNTIL those next 20 years when the Church lifts an excommunication think of the souls that potentially may not be saved because they ignored the call of the Church. It’s not that there are many paths to Heaven- even Vatican II acknowledges there is only ONE path- i.e. The Catholic Church. Whether one is directly or indirectly on that one path is what God can see. Yet does He not use the Church to be His voice on Earth? So if the Church offers warning, should that not be taken seriously? Dangerous stuff here to put earmuffs on when the Church is speaking, ESPECIALLY when earmuff man is claiming to be a Catholic.
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If athiests, and all others can have a path to God through following their conscience, then so should the SSPX. I fail to see why they would be excluded from the the non-Catholic world in that regard. Remember, following ones conscience is what is really important. Could it not reasonably be argued that is exactly what they are doing?
 
And if we isolate individual sentences from the entirety of the Magisterium, we can pretty much believe whatever we feel like.

God does not lead people towards that which he hates, therefore if a person’s conscious is leading them further away from the Truth, then it is not God, but themselves, which they are using as their compass.
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
codefro;11307021:
?? I was not trying to quote the catechism. Are you confusing me with another poster?

I was referencing another poster’s view.
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Any Catholic who uses the phrase “To each their own” to justify rulings or teachings in the Catholic Church is preaching something other than the Catholic faith as that is not a dogma, a doctrine, a rule, or a condoned practice in the Catholic Church.
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Mike30 said:
If I remember correctly the Holy Father said that following ones conscience is what is important. All of those people could in fact be following their conscience. So, obviously there is no problem with there being 40,000 or even 400,00 protestant sects as long as they are in fact following their conscience.
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👍 The Catholic Church has the fullness of the Truth but others have parts. And as long as they are seeking God sincerely. It looks quite hopeful for their salvation.

This is not just a Francis thing. If people have been paying attention it has been quite the norm for some time now.

Plus, this is all speculation since I do not believe they are in formal schism now, nor do we believe that schism= damnation.
 
Any Catholic who uses the term “To each their own” to justify rulings or teachings in the Catholic Church is preaching something other than the Catholic faith as that is not a dogma, a doctrine, a rule, or a condoned practice in the Catholic Church.
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read again. I was not justifying rulings or teachings. One poster wants to go about bringing curses down on the SSPX. “to each their own” was in reference to how they want to go about praying for the SSPX.

But I can tell that this is your “thing” so I wholly bow to your point. I used the wrong words.🤷

Whatever floats your boat.
 
The SSPX has been poised on the brink of formal schism for 30 years.

It’s sad.
 
Mike30 said:
If athiests, and all others can have a path to God through following their conscience, then so should the SSPX. I fail to see why they would be excluded from the the non-Catholic world in that regard. Remember, following ones conscience is what is really important. Could it not reasonably be argued that is exactly what they are doing?
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There is a difference between those who are outside looking in, and those inside moving out. The Church isn’t condemning, but is only offering a spiritual warning that one is in danger of forsaking their soul forever. God judges in the end. Again though, the Church is obligated to do what it does in cases of schism.
 
“There is nothing more serious than the sacrilege of schism because there is no just cause for severing the unity of the Church.”

—St. Augustine

Treatise On Baptism Against the Donatists, Bk 5, Ch. 1, A.D. 400
 
Hoosier_Daddy said:
👍 The Catholic Church has the fullness of the Truth but others have parts. And as long as they are seeking God sincerely. It looks quite hopeful for their salvation.

This is not just a Francis thing. If people have been paying attention it has been quite the norm for some time now.

Plus, this is all speculation since I do not believe they are in formal schism now, nor do we believe that schism= damnation.
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Then obviously there is no problem. I know that they are not in formal schism. And at the same time I maintain that if everyone else in the world, believers or not can have a path, then so should the SSPX, even if one day they do end up in formal schism. I know that will rankle those who revile the SSPX and everything about them, but it is the only way things can really be
 
Mike30 said:
If I remember correctly the Holy Father said that following ones conscience is what is important. All of those people could in fact be following their conscience. So, obviously there is no problem with there being 40,000 or even 400,00 protestant sects as long as they are in fact following their conscience.
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Jeffrey Dahmer was following his conscience when he killed and ate his victims. Before “following ones conscience”, that conscience must be formed. The reason that we seem to come down harder on the SSPX as opposed to Protestants, the LCWR, et. al. is that they - claiming to hold to all of the doctrines and teachings of the Church - should know better. If someone sins out of ignorance, that’s one thing. When someone deliberately chooses to sin with full knowledge, that is what kills the soul.
 
Monkey1976 said:
Jeffrey Dahmer was following his conscience when he killed and ate his victims. Before “following ones conscience”, that conscience must be formed. The reason that we seem to come down harder on the SSPX as opposed to Protestants, the LCWR, et. al. is that they - claiming to hold to all of the doctrines and teachings of the Church - should know better. If someone sins out of ignorance, that’s one thing. When someone deliberately chooses to sin with full knowledge, that is what kills the soul.
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Finally someone talking some sense. You cannot read what Pope Francis said and NOT read “formed conscience” into the article (NOT an encyclical, mind you- an article). If not, then yes what the Menendez Brothers did was morally right because they were following their conscience.
 
codefro said:
There is a difference between those who are outside looking in, and those inside moving out. The Church isn’t condemning, but is only offering a spiritual warning that one is in danger of forsaking their soul forever. God judges in the end. Again though, the Church is obligated to do what it does in cases of schism.
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So someone in the Church, who believes in the Church but disagrees in some areas has less ability to follow their conscience than one who flat out rejects everything about the Church? I fail to see how you can reconcile that. Doesn’t seem quite fair. In fact it doesn’t seem fair at all and I really don’t think given what the Holy Father has said recently, that God will condemn the SSPX even if it goes into formal schism as long as they continue to approach God with an open heart. If following your conscience is what we need to do, and a path to salvation can be found in doing just that, then the SSPX can reasonably be said to be following their conscience and thereby be OK in the eyes of the Church.

I don’t see how you can spin it any other way. I would say the days of heretics and schismatics are over for good.
 
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