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kristanl
Guest
What is the difference between SSPX and the Roman Catholic Church?? The church by me that is SSPX, is also Latin rite… What is the difference between all of these? Thanks sooo much!!
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thunderballs75
Guest
The SSPX are Roman Catholic. However, they are not in full communion with Rome, meaning that they aren’t perfectly connected.
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Walden
Guest
Just an FYI. I noticed you are from Georgia. There is a FSSP parish in Mableton that is in full communion with the Church. Sometimes people tend to confuse the two.
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kristanl
Guest
What is FSSP?
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diggerdomer
Guest
SSPX is a group that rejects some teachings of the Catholic Church (specifically, some of what Vatican II taught) and whose ministers (e.g. priests) do not exercise ministry in accord with the Catholic Church. They are unfortunately not in full communion with the Catholic Church. See, for example of some of the most recent developments, e.g. catholicculture.org/news/headlines/index.cfm?storyid=3245
Fortunately, Benedict XVI has made huge efforts (not without controversy) to reach out and invite this group back to the Catholic Church fully.
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Tedster
Guest
Fraternity of Saint Peter (or in Latin, Fraternitas Sacerdotalis Sancti Petri).
From their website:
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Walden
Guest
I’m sorry…I spout things off and just expect everyone to know what I’m talking about.
The Priestly Fraternity of Saint Peter (Fraternitas Sacerdotalis Sancti Petri - FSSP) effectively"broke away" from the SSPX in 1988. They celebrate the Liturgy of the Church as it was celebrated prior to the Second Vatican Council the same as the SSPX does, but the FSSP is in full communion.
The situation with the SSPX is sticky. Their status is irregular at best.
My whole point was that if you were interested in attending an Extraordinary Form Mass, I would suggest going to the FSSP parish. That’s just my personal opinion.
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I_Believe
Guest
Hi, please read this letter written by our Holy Father BXVI to his Bishops.
vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/letters/2009/documents/hf_ben-xvi_let_20090310_remissione-scomunica_en.html
The SSPX is being brought back into full communion with Rome. They are in talks with the Holy See and hopefully, they will be in full communion soon. Their Bishops were excommunicated by Pope JPII, and H.H BXVI has lifted the excommunications.
It’s a mess. The Second Vatican Council produced some ambiguous documents, and some modern teachings stray from Tradition. H.H. BXVI touches on this in the letter.
The SSPX is fighting for Tradition, just as churchmen have been doing for a very long time…
“Even if Catholics faithful to Tradition are reduced to a handful, they are the ones who are the true Church of Jesus Christ.” - St. Athanasius, AD 373
“What if some novel contagion seek to infect the whole Church, and not merely a small portion of it? Then he will take care to cling to antiquity, which cannot now be led astray by any novel deceit.” -St. Vincent of Lerins († 445)
“Not to oppose error is to approve it, and not to defend truth is to suppress it, and indeed to neglect to confound evil men, when we can do it, is no less a sin than to encourage them.”
- Pope St. Felix III
“It is granted to few to recognize the true Church amid the darkness of so many schisms and heresies, and to fewer still so to love the truth which they have seen as to fly to its embrace.” -St. Robert Bellarmine
“Indeed, the true friends of the people are neither revolutionaries, nor innovators: they are traditionalists.” - Pope St. Pius X, Notre Charge Apostolique
“The day the Church abandons her universal tongue is the day before she returns to the catacombs.” -Pope Pius XII
"A day will come when the civilized world will deny its God, when the Church will doubt as Peter doubted. She will be tempted to believe that man has become God. In our churches, Christians will search in vain for the red lamp where God awaits them. Like Mary Magdalene, weeping before the empty tomb, they will ask, “Where have they taken him?” -Pope Pius XII
“In recent times, even in materialist North America, the growth of the Church was magnificent with the liturgy being kept in Latin. The attempts of the Protestants have failed, and Protestantism uses the vernacular. We ask again: Why the change, especially since changes in this matter involve many difficulties and great dangers? All of us here at the Council can recall the fundamental changes in the meaning of words in common use. Thus it follows that if the Sacred Liturgy were in the vernacular, the immutability of doctrine would be endangered.
The introduction of the vernacular should be separated from the action of the Mass. The Mass must remain as it is. Grave changes in the liturgy introduce grave changes in dogmata.”
-James Cardinal McIntyre addressing the Second Vatican Council.
It can be argued that many of the Good Cardinal’s just fears have come to pass. Thankfully, many churchmen in prominent positions, including H.H. BXVI see this. Through the years, the SSPX has refused to submit to teachings that can’t be reconciled with Tradition. They have paid a heavy price, being branded “renegades” “schismatics”, etc. But they, and their flock, bear this cross for the love of Holy Mother Church. They want their children to practice Catholicism. Nothing less, nothing more. They are Roman Catholics raising their children in the same manner as they were raised, their parents were raised, and their grandparents were raised.
The Church is running out of priests and religious. The average Roman Catholic parishioner isn’t even aware of how serious this matter is. There was a time when female clergy was never discussed. Something Roman Catholics just didn’t do. But today, dissident groups of Catholics are taking delight in this dilemma of a priest shortage to further their agenda of having female priests. Yep, they are licking their chops.
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I_Believe
Guest
…continued
The SSPX parishes are producing priests and religious at a steady rate. There is a reason for that, and it goes back to what I mentioned about why they are sticking to their guns. The SSPX flock are made up of traditional Catholic families. Large families, with lots of children being raised and schooled as Catholic children were raised in the days when vocations were keeping up with the demand. There was a time, up until the late 50’s-early 60’s, that Catholic children knew their Faith very well. Their families and the nuns that taught them made sure of it. And while the SSPX schools are not all staffed by nuns, the students are getting the whole package. Solid academics and catechesis. For the youngster taught and raised in the traditional manner, discerning vocations is something they know is done by Catholics.
Love them or despise them, the SSPX and their flock, are good Roman Catholics, and they share so much with so many churchmen who have rolled with the punches in strict obedience to the conciliar Church.
This priest says it best… and it ties in with what our Holy Father said in his letter I linked to in the above post…
continued…
The SSPX parishes are producing priests and religious at a steady rate. There is a reason for that, and it goes back to what I mentioned about why they are sticking to their guns. The SSPX flock are made up of traditional Catholic families. Large families, with lots of children being raised and schooled as Catholic children were raised in the days when vocations were keeping up with the demand. There was a time, up until the late 50’s-early 60’s, that Catholic children knew their Faith very well. Their families and the nuns that taught them made sure of it. And while the SSPX schools are not all staffed by nuns, the students are getting the whole package. Solid academics and catechesis. For the youngster taught and raised in the traditional manner, discerning vocations is something they know is done by Catholics.
Love them or despise them, the SSPX and their flock, are good Roman Catholics, and they share so much with so many churchmen who have rolled with the punches in strict obedience to the conciliar Church.
This priest says it best… and it ties in with what our Holy Father said in his letter I linked to in the above post…
He is speaking of the Indult granted by Pope JPII for the Gregorian Rite as prayed per the 1962 missal. That was before H.H. BXVI issued his Summorum Pontificum freeing the Gregorian Rite of indult. Now, if a priest can pray the Gregorian Rite, he may do so. Before, the indult required the Bishop’s approval. If a Bishop said no, then case closed. Not so today.
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I_Believe
Guest
…continued
This is a filthy world we live in. And as Roman Catholics, how well are we doing at keeping our children from falling pray to the snares of Satan ? Are we doing very well at all when American Roman Catholics vote for pro choice candidates ? Why do Roman Catholics do this, when H.H. JPII said "a nation that kills it’s children, is a nation without a future ? "
How can a Roman Catholic hold public office at the national level and vote pro choice, and then proceed to dare receive Holy Communion ? This is scandal. Public scandal repeated before the eyes of our children.
How are we to reclaim our identity as Roman Catholics ? We can’t unless we return to raising our children as Roman Catholics in the traditional manner. And to do that, we must worship and practice Catholicism in the traditional manner. Same Mass, the Gregorian Rite, same parochial schooling for our children, same pre-VII beliefs, while accepting VII teachings that can be reconciled with Tradition.
Whether this comes to pass will be determined by our young priests. Will they embrace the Gregorian Rite ? History will tell. And if we run out of priests, it may well be the SSPX who is the true remnant of what the Church was in the U.S.
I firmly believe the day will come when an SSPX Bishop is named Archbishop of a U.S. diocese.
Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us
Sacred Heart of Jesus, have mercy on us
This is a filthy world we live in. And as Roman Catholics, how well are we doing at keeping our children from falling pray to the snares of Satan ? Are we doing very well at all when American Roman Catholics vote for pro choice candidates ? Why do Roman Catholics do this, when H.H. JPII said "a nation that kills it’s children, is a nation without a future ? "
How can a Roman Catholic hold public office at the national level and vote pro choice, and then proceed to dare receive Holy Communion ? This is scandal. Public scandal repeated before the eyes of our children.
How are we to reclaim our identity as Roman Catholics ? We can’t unless we return to raising our children as Roman Catholics in the traditional manner. And to do that, we must worship and practice Catholicism in the traditional manner. Same Mass, the Gregorian Rite, same parochial schooling for our children, same pre-VII beliefs, while accepting VII teachings that can be reconciled with Tradition.
Whether this comes to pass will be determined by our young priests. Will they embrace the Gregorian Rite ? History will tell. And if we run out of priests, it may well be the SSPX who is the true remnant of what the Church was in the U.S.
I firmly believe the day will come when an SSPX Bishop is named Archbishop of a U.S. diocese.
Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us
Sacred Heart of Jesus, have mercy on us
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Lainey63
Guest
I found this link that may be helpful in answering your question ewtn.com/vexperts/showresult.asp?RecNum=576197&Forums=0&Experts=0&Days=2009&Author=&Keyword=sspx&pgnu=1&groupnum=0&record_bookmark=3&ORDER_BY_TXT=ORDER+BY+ReplyDate+DESC&start_at=
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Tedster
Guest
That would be fantastic because it would mean that the SSPX have reunited with Rome, which is so important to the traditional movement.
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violetandgandal
Guest
It seems that is the main problem, The pope says that the SSPX is not in full communion with Rome and the members of the SSPX tell the pope he is wrong. If they were in full communion, they wouldn’t be telling the holy father what his position in this matter should be.
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JaMc
Guest
Well, whether Vatican II “taught” anything is part of the controversy. It certainly changed practices, disciplines and liturgy and made statements regarding the Chruch’s positions on a lot of external matters, but it’s not quite so clear if it pronounced any actual teaching. John XXIII, I believe, specifically stated that he would not speak ex cathedra, and there is support for the prospect that Varican II was meant to be a pastoral council.
Actually, even the anti-SSPX forces don’t claim they are heretical, they say they are disobedient and/or schismatic. Of course, the SSPX takes issue with the latter label as well.
Though, I will agree that, whatever the nature of Vatican II, the SSPX are opposed to what came out of it.
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DavidJoseph
Guest
NONE of Vatican II’s teachings are irreconcilable with tradition. As Pope Benedict XVI has said more than once, the council and its teachings must be interpreted IN LIGHT OF TRADITION. He did not say that some teachings can’t be interpreted as such and must be discarded. As an ecumenical council, Vatican II, just like all other ecumenical councils, DID NOT teach heresy. True, it didn’t proclaim any dogma, but then again, it chose to teach via the Ordinary Universal Magisterium, which isn’t as solemn but JUST AS INFALLIBLE. And before you give me the old line that Vatican II was pastoral and not doctrinal and thus non-binding, consider what Pope Paul VI had to say to Archbishop Lefebvre (long before the 1988 consecrations): “You cannot invoke the distinction between dogmatic and pastoral in order to accept certain texts of the Council and to refute others. Certainly, all that was said in the Council does not demand an assent of the same nature; only that which is affirmed as an object of faith or truth attached to the faith, by definitive acts, require an assent of faith. But the rest is also a part of the solemn Magisterium of the Church to which all faithful must make a confident reception and a sincere application” (Nov. 10, 1976).
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Timothysis
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You may say that as your personal opinion but it doesn’t make it true. Pope Benedict has said twice this year that the sspx does not have any active ministry in the Church. The reason is because of the imperfect union between the sspx and the Holy See.
While many hope for full reunion between the Holy See and the sspx, one of the sspx bishops has said that there are many obstacles between the two. I , personally, doubt a reconciliation any time soon.
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Lainey63
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The source itself would be the Vatican…
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bkovacs
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Finally someone tells it like it is.
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Abenadar
Guest
I’m sorry diggerdomer, but if you mean “Dogma” when you use the word “teachings”, you are very wrong. The SSPX denies no Catholic Dogma, and actually reaffirms it constantly.
Deo Gratias.
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