St. Joan's in Minneapolis - Rome Has Spoken!!!

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The unfortunate thing is, this doesn’t even come close to taking care of that parish’s problems.

Fr. George needs to be removed, the whole place bulldozed, a proper church building build and turned over to Fransician Friars of the Renewal, Legionaires of Christ or the FSSP.

Then it might turn into a respectable House of God.
 
What a sad situation in Minneapolis!!! I think so much of it stems from the pervasive ignorance out there about exactly what it means to be Catholic. One is not Catholic by virtue of walking into a Church that says “Catholic” on the sign on the lawn. Being Catholic means believing and living the TRUTH. Too many people seem to truly believe that truth is relative to the believer. It isn’t. Truth is absolute and unchanging. One of the functions of the Church is as the "pillar and foundation of the truth (1 Tim 3:15). Too often Catholics such as these come across as being rebellious teenagers rather than mature Catholics. They want to do things how they want to do things when they want to do things and they don’t want anyone telling them differently. God, in his infinite wisdom, left a Church through which he’d impart absolute truth. Some aren’t humble enough to follow. They’re just not gettin’ it.

In Christ,
Nancy 🙂
 
Can’t get it to quote the bit I want: it’s a quote of a quote. Oh well.

‘George’ seems to be rather ignorant. The Church has not (despite a lot of accusations) changed its position on slavery as much as slavery changed around it. All the early declarations on slavery (from St Paul to Philemon onwards) condemned abuses: by the 16th/17th century, when slavery was returning to Christendom in a most horrifically abusive fashion, the Church worked for slaves and finally condemned slavery. Evolution: the Church was sceptical (rightly so) about approving it, but is now (if one looks at the Holy Father’s recent pronouncements) not antagonistic - but also nowhere near the full Darwinian position. As for the curvature of the earth - that’s complete nonsense! Heavens, Ptolemy (2nd century, not even Christian) knew that the earth was spherical, and there’ve only ever been a few, non-Magisterial priests who doubted it. I assume that Fr W. meant the rotation of the planets around the sun - the heliocentric universe - and the Galileo story is far more complex than is normally understood.

One does wonder why parishes like St Joan’s stay in the Church, but I suppose that they need somewhere to be prophetic. ECUSA wouldn’t even notice.

Sue
 
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Catholic4aReasn:
What a sad situation in Minneapolis!!!
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Please remember that there are about 220 parishes in the Archdiocese of St. Paul - Minneapolis. 67 of those parishes have Eucharistic Adoration, half of them have Perpetual Eucharistic Adoration, 7 days a week, 24 hours a day. A major reason that many more don’t have it is that many small rural parishes in the Archdiocese don’t have enough parishioners to fully implement perpetual adoration.

So it’s not a major Archdiocesan problem. It’s a major St. Joan’s problem.

We’re talking about one “problem” parish here. There are a few more parishes that have chronic abuse problems, but they are not as well known to the general public. If the Archbishop can handle St. Joan’s diplomatically and effectively without causing a schism, I would expect that the rest of them will see the light.

I think it was very smart of him to use his Auxiliaries for the first phase of the correction. That gives the parish the opportunity to make a counter-proposal and make their feelings heard.

A new day is a-dawning here (we hope and pray).
 
I do understand your point Ray, but a lot of blame is to be placed on Archbishop Flynn.

Why did it take Vatican involvement for these issues to be corrected?

Should not His Grace have defended sound liturigical practices, if not doctrine, right from the start???
 
“I think it was very smart of him to use his Auxiliaries for the first phase of the correction. That gives the parish the opportunity to make a counter-proposal and make their feelings heard.”

What you may not know is that last spring the Archbishop had a couple meetings with Fr. Wertin and instructed him to stop having lay homilists. Fr. Wertin complied for about 1 month and then it was back to “normal”… :rolleyes:
 
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ByzCath:
Let me say this, we had something similar occur here in Rochester.
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My mom is in the Rochester diocese. Her pastor has said he hates Bush! Wonder who he plans to vote for. —KCT
 
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KCT:
My mom is in the Rochester diocese. Her pastor has said he hates Bush! Wonder who he plans to vote for. —KCT
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Did he say it from the pulpit? I can’t imagine that, but if he did he shouldn’t have done so. By the same token, we’re not required to vote for Bush. We’re not required to vote for any particular candidate.
 
+veritas+:
For all those who have followed the blatently unorthodox situation going on at the parish of St. Joan of Arc in Minneapolis, MN, have I got some news for you all!!
+veritas+
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Oh, thank you so much, +veritas+. 🙂

This in addition to Ray Marshall’s success story has given me so much hope! Just this a.m. I was rather despondent believing I might never live to see steps being taken to correct these things, and what is worse, that I’d be leaving my children and grandchildren to the whims of such spineless shepherds. 😦

I am wondering if maybe accumulated grievances have sent the archbishop scurrying around for events that can convey his competency to Handle Things, while not making waves that are Too Big. Perhaps Joan of Arc is currently the whipping boy (not that the parish doesn’t deserve it), because facing the abuses in that parish, while awkward, is easier than facing down the Rainbow Coalition or the embarrassing politicians. As someone has mentioned, Joan of Arc has functioned in this manner for decades. He can’t not have known. :confused:

(Also: Archbishop Flynn is NOT one of the bishops who has explained “proportionate” to his flock. Worse than that, he has failed to convey the meaning to his priests who have strange and diverse interpretations of Cardinal Ratzinger’s message vis a vis the election. Perhaps cracking down on a notorious parish will take the attention away from these other things …at least for a while.)

Still, let’s hope that the precipitating factor was laity contact with Rome. I certainly hope so, because, in that case, we all can have hope of finding an advocate there 👍

God bless (and pray without ceasing),

Anna
 
Two things stuck out for me:
I am an American Catholic. I wonder about my First Amendment Rights.
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And the fact that they consider themselves “prophetic”.

I don’t see how 1st Amendment Rights have a bit to do with this. Anyone?

And just what prophecy do they feel they have received?
 
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bridgry:
What you may not know is that last spring the Archbishop had a couple meetings with Fr. Wertin and instructed him to stop having lay homilists. Fr. Wertin complied for about 1 month and then it was back to “normal”… :rolleyes:
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I stand corrected. Thank you for making that known.

Well, let’s hope that he’s received the message this time. If they have gone to the extent of having a parish meeting and posting the summaries of that meeting on their web page, maybe he has.

But a lot of people are watching. Me included.

–

With respect to other questions, I don’t know why Archbishop Flynn didn’t act sooner. (And we don’t know that last Spring was the first time that the issue had been raised with this or previous pastors).

I suspect, knowing from personal experience, that it is often easier to get mired in routine duties than to rise to the occasion and handle difficult responsibilities.
 
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Almeria:
I don’t see how 1st Amendment Rights have a bit to do with this. Anyone?
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It’s always interesting how people who claim their 1st Amendment rights forget that the Amendment starts out “Congress shall make no law.” The “immediate gratification” crowd wants to find its validity everywhere.
 
It seems this parish is oblivious about what it means to be Catholic. I believe changes should be made immediatley or close it down. What if someone curious comes for a few weeks to learn what it is to be Catholic? They’ll receive the wrong message.
 
Michael C:
It seems this parish is oblivious about what it means to be Catholic. I believe changes should be made immediatley or close it down. What if someone curious comes for a few weeks to learn what it is to be Catholic? They’ll receive the wrong message.
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I posted this link on a different thread for a different reason, but you are absolutely correct that they must have forgotten what it means to be Catholic/Christian if this link is any indication…stjoan.com/er1/morwood/morwood.htm
 
+veritas+:
Whoops, here’s a working link - stjoan.com/er1/morwood/morwood.htm

And it’s definitely worth looking at… I had no idea they did this, now they are denying the divinity of Christ and saying that all religions are equal. :mad:

+veritas+
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I checked out the link. How appalling!!! :bigyikes: The archbishop should shut them down. I mean it: He can very calmly, himself or through his chancellor, disband the parish, remove the Sacrament from the Tabernacle, and reconstitute the parish elsewhere. Sometimes I think they’re afraid of using their episcopal authority.
 
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Almeria:
Two things stuck out for me:

And the fact that they consider themselves “prophetic”.

I don’t see how 1st Amendment Rights have a bit to do with this. Anyone?

And just what prophecy do they feel they have received?
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AMEN to that! I’d seen that one too! The last time I checked, Rome was not a signature on the Declaration of Independence, nor did Rome lobby for the first Amendment. We can blab all we want and lobby for heaven when judgment comes, but God is NOT A DEMOCRACY! Anyone who thinks that the Church cares about an American’s first amendment rights has NO IDEA who Jesus was.

Incendentally, Jesus did say he was coming to cause division. That division is happening even now. I guess we are the extreme right wing referred to in the above comments, and never have I felt to proud to stand with those who condemn the activity at SJA! No, I was not one of them…but in spirit! 🙂

Anyway, as far as being prophetic…here’s my take on this from a psychological perspective: the reaction we have just read is very similar to an unruly child who has been so for awhile finally being called out on the carpet. He is petulant, defensive, and pretending at submission while planning a way out of the mess he created yet still be able to go on with his ways. He will have his hands slapped with a ruler next…and so on and so forth. He can be corrected with consistency but if not continually enforced loving discipline, he will end up in prison constanting berating society for his own problems. This is SJA.

And let’s continue to pray that the REAL St. Joan stand up and protect her name and mission from defilement of this nature!

WEll! back to work!
 
I was perusing their website and wow what a messed up place. Interesting that they don’t appear to offer confession at all :hmmm:
 
this parish is a complete abomination. they are totally composed of white middle aged ex-hippies and feminist- the worst of the worst.

on the good side, bishop flynn and this congregation are not getting any younger. they will not attract any young people because they are smart enough to see through this. they worship themselves and not God. it is a sort of paganism, a religion they all get to make up in there heads

i don’t think this parish will last another 10 years, 20 at most. they have no vocations. the future is not with them, they are dead in more ways than one.
 
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