St. Patrick's Day 2008

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salvereginadude

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I’ve heard that the Irish bishops have transferred the date of St. Patrick’s Day from March 17th to March 15th becuase of the timing of Holy Week this year. Does this change apply to the American Church also? If so, how would this be, because it seems that the Solemnity of St. Joseph has been transferred to the 15th here in the United States.
 
St. Joseph is normally march 15th. i have a 2008 liturgical calendar that lists St. Patrick’s day as march 14th for some reason. i have never heard of that being done before. i think it defeats the purpose of a feast day if you go trying to change the date of it. it’s especially strange to intentionally put it on a friday too, considering it will likely not be observed with the eating of fish.
 
Fidelia said:
St. Joseph is normally march 15th. i have a 2008 liturgical calendar that lists St. Patrick’s day as march 14th for some reason. i have never heard of that being done before. i think it defeats the purpose of a feast day if you go trying to change the date of it. it’s especially strange to intentionally put it on a friday too, considering it will likely not be observed with the eating of fish.
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Holy Week trumps all feast days because it is the holiest week in the Church’s liturgy. That is, why, when the feast of the Annunciation (March 25th) falls during Holy Week, it gets translated to a date a week later, as happened the year that JP II died.

Remember, too, that when December 8th falls on a Sunday, the feast is “translated” (moved) to December 9th. Nonetheless, it still remains a holy day of obligation in the United States because it is our patronal feast.
 
salvereginadude said:
I’ve heard that the Irish bishops have transferred the date of St. Patrick’s Day from March 17th to March 15th because of the timing of Holy Week this year. Does this change apply to the American Church also? If so, how would this be, because it seems that the Solemnity of St. Joseph has been transferred to the 15th here in the United States.
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My ORDO says this “Where St. Patrick is observed as a solemnity, the liturgical celebration, according to the current rubrics, is transferred in 2008 to April 1.”
It further indicates that in dioceses in which he’s titular or secondary patron his feast is not celebrated liturgically this year, but that he may be mentioned in the Prayers of the Faithful on the March 17.
 
They should temporarily move St. Patrick’s day and St. Joseph day until after Easter and make it on the same day! The Italians and the Irish can then celebrate together!

🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕

When I went to Catholic school we had a pastor, Fr. O’Leary who gave us St. Patrick’s day off. After he left, his replacement, Fr. Fontana would give us St. Joseph’s day off.
 
We have to remember that St. Patrick Day is an optional memorial in the United States. That means that it does not have to be celebrated and that the Lenten day can be celebrated instead. What usually happens when St. Patrick Day falls on a Sunday in Lent? St. Patrick is not celebrated by the Church on that day. Those places where St. Patrick Day is considered a solemnity, they have celebrated St. Patrick Day on the following Monday. St. Joseph Day is a solemnity and is transfer to Saturday, March 15th this year. We have been told in our diocese that Monday, March 17th we are to use the prayers and Mass for Monday of Holy Week. Many other important saints of our Church have not been celebrated on their day because their day fell during Holy Week or their day fell on a Sunday.

This year it just happens that St. Patrick Day is not celebrated by the Church. But is he forgotten by the Church because of this, I think not. Besides, by the end of that week, at the Easter Vigil, his name will be called out in many churches as the Litany of Saints is said or sung.
 
Fidelia said:
St. Joseph is normally march 15th. i have a 2008 liturgical calendar that lists St. Patrick’s day as march 14th for some reason. i have never heard of that being done before. i think it defeats the purpose of a feast day if you go trying to change the date of it. it’s especially strange to intentionally put it on a friday too, considering it will likely not be observed with the eating of fish.
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The requirement for abstinence does not apply on Fridays which are solemnities.
 
If two solemnities occur on the same day the lesser one must be transferred to the next unimpeded day. The days of Holy Week and the Week after Easter all supersede other solemnities; so the others must be transferred to after the Second Sunday of Easter. The Irish bishops received special permission to transfer St Patricks back instead of forward to avoid the long delay.
 
Re St Joseph and St Patrick: There once was an irish nun in a convent of Italian nuns. They always celebrated St Joseph’s Day and ignored St Patrick. When she complained they explained that St Joseph was the more important because the Virgin Mary married him. The irish nun replied, " She wouldn’t have if she had seen St Patrick first." 😃
 
Phemie said:
My ORDO says this “Where St. Patrick is observed as a solemnity, the liturgical celebration, according to the current rubrics, is transferred in 2008 to April 1.”
It further indicates that in dioceses in which he’s titular or secondary patron his feast is not celebrated liturgically this year, but that he may be mentioned in the Prayers of the Faithful on the March 17.
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Phemie, I think you might want to repeat the fact that you are looking at the Canadian ordo, which is somewhat different from the version used in the United States.

Now, I don’ t think that St. Patrick’s Feast Day is an optional memorial in the United States by virtue of the fact that there are so many Irish Catholics in the United States (especially in New York, Massachusettes and the rest of the East Coast). Of course, being Italian, I’m still going with St. Joseph as my patron. However, St. Patrick is okay, too.

Incidentally, the Irish Catholics seem to have a similar devotion towards St. Patrick as the Mexicans (and Mexican-Americans) have for Our Lady of Guadalupe. Even though St. Patrick’s Feast Day has been grossly over-secularized (having been turned into a beerfest in many communities–just look at the beer displays), it seems to have taken on a life of its own to the point that it’s the only bonafide saint’s day on a secular calendar. In the Mexican ordo, the Feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe is a Solemntiy and a Holy Day of Obligation. Unlike St. Patrick’s Feast Day, OLG is not secularized. Nonetheless, just like St. Patrick’s Feast Day, which falls during the pentitential season of Lent (and cannot trump a Lenten Sunday when the 17th of March falls on same) nor can OLG trump an Advent Sunday (another penitential season) when the 12th of December falls on the first day of the week.

I bring up OLG to show that different National Conferences have different solemnities in their Ordos.
 
benedictgal said:
Phemie, I think you might want to repeat the fact that you are looking at the Canadian ordo, which is somewhat different from the version used in the United States.
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The ORDO is different for each diocese.

Saint Patrick Day will be celebrated as a solemnity wherever he is the patron of a place, city, state, church or order.
 
Joe_Kelley said:
The ORDO is different for each diocese.

Saint Patrick Day will be celebrated as a solemnity wherever he is the patron of a place, city, state, church or order.
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You have a different ORDO for each diocese???

Canada’s ORDO is for the entire country. Anything that is for a specific diocese (elevation, patronal feast, anniversary of bishop’s installation,etc) is indicated for every other diocese to know.
 
Phemie said:
You have a different ORDO for each diocese???

Canada’s ORDO is for the entire country. Anything that is for a specific diocese (elevation, patronal feast, anniversary of bishop’s installation,etc) is indicated for every other diocese to know.
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Actually several dioceses and Metroplitans share the same ordo. In Texas, all of our 14 dioceses (including two archdioceses) share the ordo with Oklahoma (that state’s dioceses and archdiocese, and, I forget who else), so, Joe is incorrect there.

The ordo we use is published by Paulist Press, which, I would imagine, publishes the ordos for the rest of the regions within the United States.
 
benedictgal said:
Actually several dioceses and Metroplitans share the same ordo. In Texas, all of our 14 dioceses (including two archdioceses) share the ordo with Oklahoma (that state’s dioceses and archdiocese, and, I forget who else), so, Joe is incorrect there.

The ordo we use is published by Paulist Press, which, I would imagine, publishes the ordos for the rest of the regions within the United States.
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The Canadian ORDO is published by the Publications Service of the Canadian Conference of Catholic Bishops.
 
I have 2 different calendars for 2008 and neither of them mention St Patrick at all. Which to my mind is a relief, because much as I like the Saint, the way the day is celebrated in the US is appalling for the most part. That being said, I doubt the fact that it is Holy week is going to stop the green beer fiends.
Sally
revejj2000 said:
We have to remember that St. Patrick Day is an optional memorial in the United States. That means that it does not have to be celebrated and that the Lenten day can be celebrated instead. What usually happens when St. Patrick Day falls on a Sunday in Lent? St. Patrick is not celebrated by the Church on that day. Those places where St. Patrick Day is considered a solemnity, they have celebrated St. Patrick Day on the following Monday. St. Joseph Day is a solemnity and is transfer to Saturday, March 15th this year. We have been told in our diocese that Monday, March 17th we are to use the prayers and Mass for Monday of Holy Week. Many other important saints of our Church have not been celebrated on their day because their day fell during Holy Week or their day fell on a Sunday.

This year it just happens that St. Patrick Day is not celebrated by the Church. But is he forgotten by the Church because of this, I think not. Besides, by the end of that week, at the Easter Vigil, his name will be called out in many churches as the Litany of Saints is said or sung.
Click to expand...
 
pprimeau1976 said:
They should temporarily move St. Patrick’s day and St. Joseph day until after Easter and make it on the same day! The Italians and the Irish can then celebrate together!

🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕 :shamrock2: 🍕

When I went to Catholic school we had a pastor, Fr. O’Leary who gave us St. Patrick’s day off. After he left, his replacement, Fr. Fontana would give us St. Joseph’s day off.
Click to expand...
Actually, this is done in New Orleans every year. There is a joint St. Patrick’s/St. Joseph’s parade.
 
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