Stand until everyone has received communion?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Nan_S
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
N

Nan_S

Guest
A few years ago, the issue first arose of the entire congregation standing in their pews until everyone had received communion “as an expression of community unity.” I remember finding and presenting to our priest a statement from the Vatican which said that no one was to be prohibited from kneeling in the pews immediately before or after communion, or even sitting (as my mother does because of ill health). About half of our congregation continued to kneel in the pews in prayer while communion was being distributed.

Now we have a new priest, who has admonished those of us who have been kneeling in the pews in devout reverence to wait until after everyone had received, whereupon we would be invited to kneel in thanks for a few moments.

What was a deeply meaningful “me and my God” meditation time has been reduced to a quickie. What I’ve also noticed is that when people are standing in the pews watching the communion lines, instead of kneeling in prayer, there is a lot more people-gawking and disruptive whispered conversation. :mad:

Does anyone have a link to that Vatican statement saying kneeling in the pews was not to be prohibited while communion was being distributed to the rest of the congregation? I’d very much like to show it to the new priest. (I’m not talking about kneeling before the priest to receive communion. That’s a separate issue for which I can find plenty of links.)

Thanks,

Nan
 
Nan_S said:
A few years ago, the issue first arose of the entire congregation standing in their pews until everyone had received communion “as an expression of community unity.” I remember finding and presenting to our priest a statement from the Vatican which said that no one was to be prohibited from kneeling in the pews immediately before or after communion, or even sitting (as my mother does because of ill health). About half of our congregation continued to kneel in the pews in prayer while communion was being distributed.

Now we have a new priest, who has admonished those of us who have been kneeling in the pews in devout reverence to wait until after everyone had received, whereupon we would be invited to kneel in thanks for a few moments.

What was a deeply meaningful “me and my God” meditation time has been reduced to a quickie. What I’ve also noticed is that when people are standing in the pews watching the communion lines, instead of kneeling in prayer, there is a lot more people-gawking and disruptive whispered conversation. :mad:

Does anyone have a link to that Vatican statement saying kneeling in the pews was not to be prohibited while communion was being distributed to the rest of the congregation? I’d very much like to show it to the new priest. (I’m not talking about kneeling before the priest to receive communion. That’s a separate issue for which I can find plenty of links.)

Thanks,

Nan
Click to expand...
adoremus.org/Kneeling-after-Communion.html
 
Here is a text that would lead the priest to think everyone should stand.

From the 2002 General Introduction to the Roman Missal (GIRM) approved for the USA, which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :
“*Movements and Posture *
42. The gestures and posture of the priest, the deacon, and the ministers, as well as those of the people, ought to contribute to making the entire celebration resplendent with beauty and noble simplicity, so that the true and full meaning of the different parts of the celebration is evident and that the participation of all is fostered. Therefore, attention should be paid to what is determined by this General Instruction and the traditional practice of the Roman Rite and to what serves the common spiritual good of the People of God, rather than private inclination or arbitrary choice. A common posture, to be observed by all participants, is a sign of the unity of the members of the Christian community gathered for the Sacred Liturgy: it both expresses and fosters the intention and spiritual attitude of the participants.
43. The faithful should stand from the beginning of the Entrance chant, or while the priest approaches the altar, until the end of the Collect; for the Alleluia chant before the Gospel; while the Gospel itself is proclaimed; during the Profession of Faith and the Prayer of the Faithful; from the invitation, Orate, fratres (Pray, brethren), before the prayer over the offerings until the end of Mass, except at the places indicated below. They should, however, sit while the readings before the Gospel and the responsorial Psalm are proclaimed and for the homily and while the Preparation of the Gifts at the Offertory is taking place; **and, as circumstances allow, they may sit or kneel while the period of sacred silence after Communion is observed. ** …
With a view to a uniformity in gestures and postures during one and the same celebration, the faithful should follow the directions which the deacon, lay minister, or priest gives according to whatever is indicated in the Missal.”

It is not “the period of sacred silence after Communion” when the Communion Song is being sung. Nor is it the period of sacred silence when the priest is saying “The Body of Christ” and people are responding “Amen”.

Perhaps the priest has also been thinking about this part of the GIRM:
“86. While the priest is receiving the Sacrament, the Communion chant is begun. Its purpose is to express the communicants’ union in spirit by means of the unity of their voices, to show joy of heart, and to highlight more clearly the “communitarian” nature of the procession to receive Communion.”

Or perhaps this part:
“88. When the distribution of Communion is finished, as circumstances suggest, the priest and faithful spend some time praying privately.”
 
However, the dubium submitted by Cardinal George cleared that up (see link on Walking_Home’s post- #2, for exact text).
 
this has to do with the Dubium, which states that you can kneel.
Br.Rich_SFO said:
For those who might be interested:

Clarification on Posture of the Faithful Following Individual Reception of Holy Communion

During recent months, the Secretariat for the Liturgy has received numerous inquiries concerning the proper posture of the faithful after each communicant has individually received Holy Communion at Mass.

Many Bishops have directed that the appropriate posture of the faithful during the distribution of Holy Communion is to stand. They have based this on the text of the General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM), no. 431 which states that the people stand until the period of sacred silence following the reception of Holy Communion has begun. But when does this period of sacred silence begin? GIRM, no. 86 notes that “the singing [of the communion song] is continued for as long as the Sacrament is being administered to the faithful.” The period of sacred silence would seem to begin, therefore, once all have received Holy Communion; hence, the appropriate posture of the faithful during the distribution of Holy Communion is standing.

However, because of the widespread and longstanding practice of individuals returning to their places to kneel or sit in private prayer after having individually received Holy Communion, this provision has caused controversy in many dioceses.

In an effort to clarify the situation, Cardinal Francis George, O.M.I., Chairman of the Committee on the Liturgy, submitted a dubium concerning this matter to the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments on May 26, 2003. On June 5, 2003, Cardinal George received the following response (Prot. n. 855/03/L) from Cardinal Francis Arinze, Prefect of the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments:

Dubium: In many places, the faithful are accustomed to kneeling or sitting in personal prayer upon returning to their places after having individually received Holy Communion during Mass. Is it the intention of the Missale Romanum, editio typica tertia, to forbid this practice?

Responsum: Negative, et ad mentem. The mens is that the prescription of the Institutio Generalis Missalis Romani, no. 43, is intended, on the one hand, to ensure within broad limits a certain uniformity of posture within the congregation for the various parts of the celebration of Holy Mass, and on the other, to not regulate posture rigidly in such a way that those who wish to kneel or sit would no longer be free.

In the implementation of the General Instruction of the Roman Missal, therefore, posture should not be regulated so rigidly as to forbid individual communicants from kneeling or sitting when returning from having received Holy Communion.
Click to expand...
I should also add that you will NEVER see a time when I will not kneel from the anunciation of Communion all the way until the Eucharist is removed from the Altar and put in the tabernacle. It has nothing to do with private prayer, in my mind, I can do private prayer standing or sitting just as easily as I do while kneeling.

Let us not forget a simple fact: The Eucharist is Jesus Christ present for us on the altar… At His name every knee shall bend… how much more so at His Divine Being? I kneel before my God, the King of Kings… and if there weren’t a pew in front of me, I’d be prostrate on the ground instead. That is why you will NEVER see me standing during communion except to process forward and receive.
 
there is a large shrine we visit on our trips back and forth from Ohio, because the evening Mass is just as we are passing through on Saturday. It is built with stadium seating, so you are standing on a slant. They also stand during communion (it is outdoors, no kneelers, some brave folks kneel but I can’t as bleacher style seats are too high for me to haul myself back up). Standing in that position is a terrible strain on the ankles knees and hips of old crock like me.
 
I guess in those churches where there are no kneelers, standing and sitting are the only alternatives. I avoid those, so I have never seen people stand until everyone has received communion. The alleged symbolism of it seems a bit forced to me.

I am probably more of an old crock than Puzzleannie, but I’m going to continue kneeling until the tabernacle is closed, no matter what anybody says about it.
 
The “standing after Communion thing” used to be a problem for me until I found two excellent parishes where people show reverence to God and courtesy to their neighbor, and yes we kneel after Communion. My new and official home parish offers an English-speaking Mass, my other favorite parish which I need to attend as a visitor more often offers an indult Latin Mass.

In my case, I voted with my feet so that I can pray better on my knees. 🙂 :cool: 👍

~~ the phoenix
 
Ridgerunner said:
I guess in those churches where there are no kneelers, standing and sitting are the only alternatives.
Click to expand...
Depends if we’re talking about adult men, elderly ladies, children… Able-bodied people don’t need kneelers. 😉

As for the posture, as a rule, I regard with suspicion any replacement of genuflection with standing.
 
Ridgerunner said:
I guess in those churches where there are no kneelers, standing and sitting are the only alternatives.
Click to expand...
Those might be the only alternatives for someone who is old or otherwise injured. Even in churche which (gasp) lack kneelers, I still find it in me to be kneeling before the presense of God. Any discomfort this might cause me is excusable as merely temporary… If Christ died for me on the cross, surely I can stand a little kneeling for Him.
 
I believe that this custom was popularized in the United States by a certain western cardinal who also likes people to come up to Communion from the rear of the church first. I’m always amazed at the excuses (at least the non-medical ones) that some pastors come up with for not allowing kneeling. A church in Mexico I once visited had no roof (it was under construction) and the concrete floor had not yet been poured. At the epiclesis, the point when one kneels according to Mexican liturgical norms, everyone knelt on the dirt floor in their Sunday best. Contrast this with certain American parishes where people in relatively pedestrian clothing refuse to kneel on thick, padded carpet floors.
 
No thanks. My back siezes up when I have to stand for long periods of time. Besides being much more reverent, kneeling is much more comfortable. I had to pre-medicate before the Easter Vigil Mass.

DaveBj
 
I’ve seen this done and I always go with the flow when I’m a visitor. I think standing is also a respectful position to assume. We stand when the judge enters the court, when a lady enters the room, etc. I don’t have a problem with it, I think it’s respectful.
 
Cavaille-Coll said:
I believe that this custom was popularized in the United States by a certain western cardinal who also likes people to come up to Communion from the rear of the church first.
Click to expand...
I was told by a local DRE that it was official that we were to come up to communion from the rear of the church, and that doing otherwise was some form of special exception. I know this is off-topic, but I have been trying to find something about this to no avail. Any help would be appreciated, and I will go there and look it up.
 
My problem is I go to a small catholic church (when I am at mom’s for the weekend) and I am one of the few that actually kneels, and once I was the only one and the priest actually signaled for me no to kneel. (it was near the end of communion, but he wasn’t sitting down or anything.) 😦
 
I’m not sure why this is such an issue. Any position, sitting, standing or kneeling, as mentioned in the GIRM, seems to be fine as long as it is prayerful and reverent after receipt of the eucharist. I understand some priests preference for posture and gesture uniformity as part of the liturgical celebration - but this is clearly stated in the GIRM as acceptable posture.

In south Louisiana (and in Memphis TN) it is the general norm to kneel. I find it a very prayerful experience - “be still and know that I am God”.
 
I accept any form, but in my parish NOBODY stands. All kneel or sit if not able to kneel.
 
katy said:
I was told by a local DRE that it was official that we were to come up to communion from the rear of the church, and that doing otherwise was some form of special exception. I know this is off-topic, but I have been trying to find something about this to no avail. Any help would be appreciated, and I will go there and look it up.
Click to expand...
I believe that your DRE is misinformed. This practice was promulgated by Roger Cardinal Mahony within the Archdiocese of Los Angeles, but I’m not aware that it is binding there. Nothing from Rome or the USCCB has come out on this to my knowledge, and in my diocese, they would enforce something like this if it had been promulgated. We’re not allowed to kneel after the Agnus Dei in this diocese, but kneeling after receiving Holy Communion is commonly done. Coming up from the back, however, seems to be change for the sake of change, as well as a logistical nightmare.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top