Statement of the Curatorium of the European Society for Catholic Theology on the current crisis in the Catholic Church

[Peccavi]

I cannot accept your definition of ‘protestant’ - does it include all my Catholic friends (regular attenders at mass etc.) who are
a) divorced (civil not church divorcees)
b) gay (of both kinds) including many religious
c) have had abortions
d) use birth control - a recent survey in Catholic newspaper showed 90% of under 40s practicing CATHOLICS in Europe did so… All this in defiance of Vatican teaching.
If so you’ve just wiped out about two thirds of the laity in Europe. Why haven’t they, as well as Father Kung, been told to get out and join some protestant denomination? How can the church possibly include such disobedient sons and daughters among its flock ?

 

[Kscrawler]

I cannot accept your definition of ‘protestant’ - does it include all my Catholic friends (regular attenders at mass etc.) who are
a) divorced (civil not church divorcees)
b) gay (of both kinds) including many religious
c) have had abortions
d) use birth control - a recent survey in Catholic newspaper showed 90% of under 40s practicing CATHOLICS in Europe did so… All this in defiance of Vatican teaching.
If so you’ve just wiped out about two thirds of the laity in Europe. Why haven’t they, as well as Father Kung, been told to get out and join some protestant denomination? How can the church possibly include such disobedient sons and daughters among its flock ?

All of those mentioned above are welcome at Mass. Everyone you see at Mass is a sinner. If they don’t believe they have sinned, and disagree with the Church why are they there?

If they disagree with the Church, if they defy the teachings of the Church then we are glad to have our Protestant friends attending Mass and we hope they will see the light, repent, and once again become Catholics.

If you don’t believe what the Church teaches you not only aren’t Catholic you are wasting your time. So once again why are they there?

 

[CapIV]

So whoever dissents from the Catholic Consevative line is to be dismissed as a) laity b) from Europe c) big nothings ! How very judgemental and dismissive of any alternative view of Catholicism from your own - you would have us set in intellectual concrete and wrap us in a dogmatic straight-jacket ! Luckily I have my anarchist priest to say mass on Sundays and reassure me that the church is far more inclusive than many think ! Long may it continue to be so.

There is only one Catholicism. There are not multiple interpretations or views. This is the whole point of the Church. An Earthly institution whose purpose it is to guide truth to the people. Not the other way around.

Simply calling yourself Catholic and being baptized Catholic does not mean that you are in good standing.

Modernists have been trying to destroy the Church and continue to try and continue to do so. What I don’t understand is, why do they even bother to continue claiming to be Catholics in good standing?

 

[Corki]

I cannot accept your definition of ‘protestant’ - does it include all my Catholic friends (regular attenders at mass etc.) who are
a) divorced (civil not church divorcees) - being divorced is not against Church teaching. There is no such thing as a Church divorce.
b) gay (of both kinds) including many religious Being “gay” is not against Church teaching, nor is being homosexual.
c) have had abortions there are many who have and have repented. It is not a continuing condition so a past abortion can hardly be said to be currently in defiance of Vatican teaching **
d) use birth control - a recent survey in Catholic newspaper showed 90% of under 40s practicing CATHOLICS in Europe did so… All this in defiance of Vatican teaching.
If so you’ve just wiped out about two thirds of the laity in Europe. Why haven’t they, as well as Father Kung, been told to get out and join some protestant denomination? How can the church possibly include such disobedient sons and daughters among its flock ?

Father Kung, as has been mentioned, has been censured so should not be held up as an example of a disident tolerated by the Church.

** The teaching you mention is Church teaching, not just Vatican teaching. It comes from the Magesterium, not just the Pope and Cardinals at the Vatican.

 

[Elizabeth502]

There is no such thing as a personal definition (opinion) of a Catholic identity. According to one of the most “orthodox” of Catholics, Fr. John Corapi, you continue to be Catholic in identity once you are baptized, unless and until you formally renounce your faith through some affirmative gesture such as writing to the Bishop, formal conversion/entrance into another faith, etc. The term Catholic does not relate to one’s practice, or level of practice, or level of agreement with approved doctrine and practice of the RCC – as judged by oneself, as judged by others who know you, as judged by strangers on a Catholic messageboard. Even less so does it relate to one’s state of grace/sin.

 

[TMC]

It’s not a bad thing to be a Protestant. But don’t deny who you are. There is no such thing as a “Conservative” Catholic line. There is only a CATHOLIC line. You can find it by reading what the magisterium has to say. You are not required to follow it, but if you don’t you are no longer Catholic. The world has lots of Protestants in it, they are often good and gracious people who are saved by Christs work. But they, and you, aren’t Catholic.

I don’t agree with your definition of “protestant” but it goes without saying that by this definition then the members of SSPX are surely protestant.