Statues: Biblical or Unbiblical?

[Farsight001]

No, i didnt know the site was Ellen Whites site. i didnt scroll to the bottom, and that is not where i get all of my info from.I found it today, but i believe i saw it yrs ago. Ellen has been dead for a long time so she didnt have anything to do with the site. The photographic evidence is there. You really cant make that go away. The site was to big for me to even get to the bottom. I got half way to the bottom and had to run downstairs to flip my hash browns.

The photographic evidence is not there. The picture is just a picture. The caption beneath the pictures contain the claims, in this case, specifically the claim that the statue is Jupiter, not Peter. But that is just that - a claim, not evidence. The picture of the statue is no better evidence that it is Jupiter than a picture of a couch is evidence that it was made in Spain. Evidence would be a photograph of an inscription on the statue that corroborates your claim. We’re not trying to make evidence go away. We’re trying to get through to you that it’s not real evidence, by any stretch of the imagination.

Seventh Day Adventist are good, really good. They even had me fooled for about almost a yr.i would watch their show on TV. Then, one day i heard their hook. I didnt even know they were the SDA. They never mention it. But one day they said that they were gods church and that they had it right and everyone else was, well, wrong, but they put it nicely. Thats when you can be sure its a hunk of baloney when someone claim they they are gods organization.

Why would that make it baloney? God, via Jesus, clearly founded a Church. It’s somewhere. Someone is part of it, somewhere. I haven’t heard a denomination not claim that they were God’s church/organization/etc. I bet you believe it about yourself. If you didn’t believe your group didn’t have God’s truth, you wouldn’t be part of it. It would be silly and illogical to remain in a group you didn’t think had the truth.

 

[kimberly87]

Ok, i found another site which has a little more discussion about the Peter Jupiter controversy. You have to scroll to the botom of the page to find it. Seems no one is super duper sure where its from. But the halo is from roman pagan gods. The halo was the symbol of deity in pagan rome.Ive been to St Peters in rome.I saw the foot had the shoestrings worn clean off from the faithful kissing the foot. Man, that took alot of kissing.
aloha.net/~mikesch/wheel.htm

Here is a site that is sure Peter is Jupiter;
whale.to/c/jupiter.html

Here is a site by a historian. I dont think she believes the bible, so she isnt trying to prove protestants correct and catholics wrong.Very unbiased.
ezinearticles.com/?Apostle-Peter-or-Catholic-Trickery&id=7064960

 

[kimberly87]

Hi jharek, i was saked to go find sites that said Peter was actually Jupiters statue. All of the site seem to be against catholic imagery and what not. Ill forgo trying to find more sites because they do seem to be anti catholic. I dont want to go against policy here. The guy who invited me hasnt shown back up. Im here getting roasted by the best catholic apologists around. I dont stand a chance. By the way, to the person who suggested i doctored up what brother Angelo said to me…i cut ant pasted what he said. No doctoring.

 

[kimberly87]

Farsight, i dont belong to a group. I follow the Lamb. But when i get the time and am up early enough, i go to Calvary Chapel in my area. the pastor is born again and a number of people are born again who attend. The spirit led me there. he gathers his saints. My god is powerful and doesnt leave us on our own. He leadeth me to green pastures.

 

[Farsight001]

Ok, i found another site which has a little more discussion about the Peter Jupiter controversy. You have to scroll to the botom of the page to find it. Seems no one is super duper sure where its from. But the halo is from roman pagan gods. The halo was the symbol of deity in pagan rome.Ive been to St Peters in rome.I saw the foot had the shoestrings worn clean off from the faithful kissing the foot. Man, that took alot of kissing.
aloha.net/~mikesch/wheel.htm

Here is a site that is sure Peter is Jupiter;
whale.to/c/jupiter.html

Here is a site by a historian. I dont think she believes the bible, so she isnt trying to prove protestants correct and catholics wrong.Very unbiased.
ezinearticles.com/?Apostle-Peter-or-Catholic-Trickery&id=7064960

Believe it or not, we’ve seen all these. Again, all you are doing is posting websites with pictures of a statue and a caption that CLAIMS it’s really Jupiter. What we are asking for is reasonable, solid, real, historical evidence. That means an inscription on the statue itself, or an ancient document commissioning it’s creation, or a paper trail tracing it’s history. Something that somehow disproves all the evidence we have already provided to the contrary.

And I don’t know where you got it from, but Norma Holt, the author of that last article, is not a historian. Never was. Even if she was, she is one historian in the face of tens of thousands who would say otherwise. Why in the world would we believe her over so, so many others?

 

[Farsight001]

Hi jharek, i was saked to go find sites that said Peter was actually Jupiters statue. All of the site seem to be against catholic imagery and what not. Ill forgo trying to find more sites because they do seem to be anti catholic. I dont want to go against policy here. The guy who invited me hasnt shown back up. Im here getting roasted by the best catholic apologists around. I dont stand a chance. By the way, to the person who suggested i doctored up what brother Angelo said to me…i cut ant pasted what he said. No doctoring.

Interesting tidbit to tell you. And I want you to sit back, think about it, and let this fact sink in - we are not the best Catholic apologists around. We are not even apologists. We do this in our spare time for fun. We love learning about the Church, and so we research it on our own because we want to. I’m a geologist. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I know none of them are apologists either. The best Catholic apologists around don’t bother posting here. We’re too small fry.

What I want you to really think about is - if we, the small frys, who were never formally educated in the subject, know all this about the faith, and scripture, how much more is there really to know? How much crucial knowledge are you missing?

Farsight, i dont belong to a group. I follow the Lamb. But when i get the time and am up early enough, i go to Calvary Chapel in my area. the pastor is born again and a number of people are born again who attend. The spirit led me there. he gathers his saints. My god is powerful and doesnt leave us on our own. He leadeth me to green pastures.

You may not like labels, but you’re still in a group, whether you like it or not. You have a preferred church. That’s your group. And if you really don’t have a preferred church, then your group is you.

 

[Mystophilus]

What, you’re not going to quote the rest of it? The young these days have no staying power!

It is a beautiful piece of work, though, although I might be rather biased by it having revolutionised the way that I interact with icons.

 

[babs57]

Mysto and Pat,

I printed the whole darned thing out! It was 29 pages!!

It sounds really great though! I’ll read it later. Thanks to both of you. A very useful piece!

 

[vsedriver]

Ok, i found another site which has a little more discussion about the Peter Jupiter controversy. You have to scroll to the botom of the page to find it. Seems no one is super duper sure where its from. But the halo is from roman pagan gods. The halo was the symbol of deity in pagan rome.Ive been to St Peters in rome.I saw the foot had the shoestrings worn clean off from the faithful kissing the foot. Man, that took alot of kissing.

The halo is a symbol of what is holy and sacred. Pagans thought their statues were holy and sacred and used that symbol to illustrate the concept. Christians believe their saints are holy and sacred so they used the halo too. What’s wrong with that? A concept doesn’t have to be exclusive to one group. If it were, we’d never be able to communicate to each other.

aloha.net/~mikesch/wheel.htm

all of this tripe has been debunked by real historians and art historians. It is nothing more than anti-Catholic junk

Here is a site that is sure Peter is Jupiter;
[

Good grief, you believe websites like this? After I gave you evidence from the Louve? I kind of think the Louve knows a little more about art that that web site owner.

Here is a site by a historian. I dont think she believes the bible, so she isnt trying to prove protestants correct and catholics wrong.Very unbiased.
ezinearticles.com/?Apostle-Peter-or-Catholic-Trickery&id=7064960

](Jupiter)

This is not a historian. No credentials, no published scholarly papers in academic journals reviewed by other scholars. This is some lone person spouting unsubstantiated trivia on a website that allows anyone to publish anything without review as to facts. She cites no sources and no research.

 

[pablope]

Sorry but…

Ok, i found another site which has a little more discussion about the Peter Jupiter controversy. You have to scroll to the botom of the page to find it. Seems no one is super duper sure where its from. But the halo is from roman pagan gods. The halo was the symbol of deity in pagan rome.Ive been to St Peters in rome.I saw the foot had the shoestrings worn clean off from the faithful kissing the foot. Man, that took alot of kissing.

aloha.net/~mikesch/wheel.htm

 

[kimberly87]

Gosh pablope, you dont ask for much. Do you want me to bring back Constantine from the dead to confirm things? You are getting me wrong. I just point out these things as a" by the way". I really dont put any stock in exposing pagan incorporation into the CC. Its just something to discuss. proddy religions have some of this in them too but much much less. All that matters is Christ and him crucified. Wheres the guy who invited me here? Im getting creamed by these know it all apologetics. If i wasnt saved i would seriously consider joining the CC from what ive seen in this site. very knowledgeable people in here. Puts me to shame.

 

[Zooey]

By the way, that site isnt just about catholic use of pagan symbols. protestant churches have used them to. To be fair, recent proddy churches dont use them. Their services are held in a room with four walls and nothing else

My non-Catholic Church has a depiction of the Last Supper that is 5 by 7 feet. (I should know; I put in months of work on the tablecloth & the disciples’ feet & robes. It was left to others to finish the rest).

Just clarifying there, so Kim may not want to hear my opinion:shrug:, but I, little ol’ Methodist Zooey, I believe that anybody who comes on a site called “**Catholic **Answers Forums” & as good as calls good Christian people fools & liars is rude.
These are not the Unitarian Universalist Forums. These are not the SDA Forums. These are not the Calvary Chapel Forums (from which freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-shocked032.gifmay God deliver me!). They are not the Thrice-Dipped-Naked Blood-Drinking Vegetarian Vampire Odinists of Kalamazoo Michigan Forums.
No, these are the Catholic Answers Forums, & people who want to holler at a bunch of wild-eyed fanatical pagans need to go visit those last forums.
Just lock the poor kids & your womenfolk in another room while you freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-shocked019.giflook at them.
No need creating anything like this:freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-shocked017.giffreesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-shocked026.gif

[sign1]
Just a couple of thoughts from the Methodist Amen Corner.
Opinions shared in this corner are those of the person posting them, & may not represent those of the management. They may also not represent those of the UMC, nor of its bishops, pastors, & the rest of its members round the world.
[/sign1]

 

[pablope]

Gosh pablope, you dont ask for much. Do you want me to bring back Constantine from the dead to confirm things?

No…I just wanted to point in the right direction. There are writings, authenticated…from the period that you could research and read for yourself…authenticated by archeology, actual academic research…not the pick and choose methods of those sites you have provided.

You are getting me wrong. I just point out these things as a" by the way". I really dont put any stock in exposing pagan incorporation into the CC.

 

[patrick457]

By the way, that site isnt just about catholic use of pagan symbols. protestant churches have used them to. To be fair, recent proddy churches dont use them. Their services are held in a room with four walls and nothing else

You know, ma’am, we have the same problem with some of our churches too. There’s a recent joke which runs thus:

Fundamentalist woman to Catholic friend: “Why do you Catholics worship statues?”
Catholic: “Oh, we don’t worship statues anymore. Now we worship banners.”

 

[Farsight001]

Gosh pablope, you dont ask for much. Do you want me to bring back Constantine from the dead to confirm things? You are getting me wrong. I just point out these things as a" by the way". I really dont put any stock in exposing pagan incorporation into the CC. Its just something to discuss. proddy religions have some of this in them too but much much less. All that matters is Christ and him crucified. Wheres the guy who invited me here? Im getting creamed by these know it all apologetics. If i wasnt saved i would seriously consider joining the CC from what ive seen in this site. very knowledgeable people in here. Puts me to shame.

You know, he really didn’t ask for much. Cite the Edict of Milan where it says Constantine founded the RCC. A google search for the edict turned up, on the first page, the entire text of the edict to look through. It’s about a page long. So ultimately, it would take you five minutes of effort to find what you were asked to find. Not difficult at all.

There’s a reason he asked you to look for it. Because he’s already found it and read it and he knows your claim is simply unsupported, but he wants you to see it for yourself.

These things are not being pointed out as a “by the way”. We’ve pointed out that we’ve read all this already, and still you try to ‘teach’ it to us. That is not a “by the way”. We’ve provided evidence that your claims are false and without any merit, and you insinuate that we simply refuse to accept the ‘truth’. This is also not a “by the way”. Don’t insult our intelligence by giving us a line like that.

 

[kimberly87]

Farsight, its not me that insults your “intelligence”. profess to be be wise

 

[kimberly87]

Im sorry but im losing my cool. I havent related my visits to torture chambers when i was in europe when i was 14 yrs old. The business end of the CC. I have trouble equating the CC with being gods true church.

 

[kimberly87]

No, no, i dont have trouble with theCC.What i saw in those chambers was beyond what hollywood shows in their worst horror movies. At first i thought it was some kind of movie set. I am from hollywood and went to school with the hollywood elite. but the tour guide told us these were used on humans by the CC. I ran up the stairs because i was going to vomit. The devices were beyond belief. The devil had to be behind them. No human could conceive of such torture. Its far beyond the human mind to vision what it was like to be killed by these devises. The catholic church doesnt have a moral leg to stand on.;+

 

[aragonjohn1]

Gosh pablope, you dont ask for much. Do you want me to bring back Constantine from the dead to confirm things? You are getting me wrong. I just point out these things as a" by the way". I really dont put any stock in exposing pagan incorporation into the CC. Its just something to discuss. proddy religions have some of this in them too but much much less. All that matters is Christ and him crucified. Wheres the guy who invited me here? Im getting creamed by these know it all apologetics. If i wasnt saved i would seriously consider joining the CC from what ive seen in this site. very knowledgeable people in here. Puts me to shame.

Okay I’m sorry but I have had enough:shrug:

In over twelve posts you have laid out you’re principles and “conscience” never even think about imperical or objective truths rather you have solely laid out you’re subjective “proofs” or used them excessively. You ignore many of the principles relating to non-maleficence and human dignity. Will you at least try to talk about some objective or imperical truths? Or at least something somehow relating to the “principles” or “truths” you either believe in relating to ideals, beliefs, or religion, and maybe fath and reason?

Because it is pretty hard for me to take seriously someone who seems to not believe in what one may believe in.

Eg: I like peanut butter, pickle and cheese sandwiches because xenos or dominus is my “friend”

Shalom
God bless you on you’re journey(?)

 

[Zooey]

Okay I’m sorry but I have had enough:shrug:

In over twelve posts you have laid out you’re principles and “conscience” never even think about imperical or objective truths rather you have solely laid out you’re subjective “proofs” or used them excessively. You ignore many of the principles relating to non-maleficence and human dignity. Will you at least try to talk about some objective or imperical truths? Or at least something somehow relating to the “principles” or “truths” you either believe in relating to ideals, beliefs, or religion, and maybe fath and reason?

Because it is pretty hard for me to take seriously someone who seems to not believe in what one may believe in.

Eg: I like peanut butter, pickle and cheese sandwiches because xenos or dominus is my “friend”

Shalom
God bless you on you’re journey(?)